Difficult parents of DDs friends

[Needsawine]

DD8 has a large friendship group; she’s very sociable and kind and attracts lots of friends, although she struggles to stand up for herself and is a people pleaser. Two of the girls fight over her a lot, one is quite bossy, E and the other O is more reserved but equally quite a dominant character. DD is happy to go along with who ever demands the most attention but when the other gets upset that she is not playing with them they fight over her and demand she chooses. She has told them she doesn’t want to choose and that they can both be her friend. This has been going on for sometime and DD often gets tearful telling me she is worried they are going to fight over her tomorrow. One of the girls, E, physically drags my DD away ‘playfully’ and I have witnessed and told this girl to be careful with her. My DD is very small for her age. The more reserved girl cries at school and says she feels left out but DD makes every effort to involve her but she goes off in a sulk that she can’t have DD to herself and the other girl takes advantage of this and drags DD away telling her to ignore grumpy girl. DD feels torn, emotional and is worried she is upsetting everyone.

Now I know this 3’s a crowd thing isn’t a new thing and I’ve given lots of advice to DD and told her to firmly tell each girl that she doesn’t want to be in the middle and that they can all play together. She thinks the world of both of them. Some days my DD has enough the arguing and goes off and finds someone else to play with completely. She has been on the receiving end from the both of them when they want to be a twosome but she genuinely goes and finds another group to get involved with and doesn’t take it heart. She is by nature a very patient and kind girl.

Sorry this is long winded but getting to the point. Recently at out of school activity that they all attend, we went to collect and DD and E were holding hands and dancing, O was sulking and O’s mom (who I’ve gotten on quite well with to say hello on the playground over the years) called them horrible girls to her sulking daughter and didn’t realise I was in earshot. I turned to face her and she played it off pretending she was talking about someone else. She tried to chat to me and make conversation but I felt so uncomfortable. I get that she is upset that her DD feels left out but shouldn’t she be encouraging her to get involved like my DD keeps asking her to? Rather than making the divide worse by telling her 8 year old that her friends are horrible.

Do I go and speak to the teacher?

I rarely get involved in the playground drama as I believe it’s best dealt with by the dinner ladies who are there to witness it. It just feels like O’s mom is alienating her own daughter by poisoning her mind and encouraging her to sulk.

Don’t worry about O’s Mum concern yourself more with your daughter as this entire scenario sounds mental and I would not be happy with anyone dragging my child around playful or not.

I would mention the issues dd is having socially with the class teacher so she/he is aware.

I wouldn’t engage with the parents of o and e

i would encourage dd to play with other children and move away from o and e.

Oh god I remember 8 year old girls. They're brutal. I'm afraid that you're going to have to let them get on with it however you're right to intervene if anyone tries to physically drag your DD.

They do grow out of it...

Tbh there might be valid reasons why O and E avoid each other. Yy it might make your DD's life easier if they got on but it might not be better for the others. From O's DM's comment, I'd guess a lot has happened that you're unaware of. Speak to the school and ask them to keep an eye on the friendship group.

O’s mum has complained to me in the past that E ‘tries to split the girls up’ I direct the conversation away from the topic as it’s awkward. I know for a fact my DD wouldn’t leave anyone out and I see her constantly try to include O. O is very stroppy and likes it all on her terms. Love having DD to herself. I don’t want DD to be joined to the hip with anyone, it’s a recipe for disaster. Totally agree she should try and play with others. I have told her this and she said she does but obviously always ends up with these two girls. I think O and E definitely have some issues but surely that’s not for DD to try and resolve or get tangled in x

Your DD is involved because she plays with them both and it seems you're trying to encourage her to get them both to play together. Sometimes threesomes like this are just about jealousy and all the DCs are playing their part in the dynamic (including your DD).
Sometimes there is one DC who is pushy and aggressive - and the DC pretending they can't see that difference in behaviour isn't being kind - they're actually contributing to the bullying by indulging the DC with the worst behaviour.

Your DD is being manipulated and harangued and is in the middle of a dysfunctional trio of friends whereby O’s Mum feels justified in calling your DD names. You only need to look at this behaviour to predict that it’s going to get even more intense and uncomfortable. Your DD needs some help setting clear boundaries with these two friends.

The other mother obviously feels her daughter is being excluded and it is normal that she feels upset about that. Is your daughter as innocent as you say? Girls do seem to relish leaving someone out.

I agree, and I think E does like to select children and leave others out as I said she has done it in the past to my DD. But how do I approach that? Tell DD not to play with her? DD really likes her. She likes them both. She tells me that O tells my DD that she doesn’t like when she plays with E. It seems either way that one child gets to decide who gets to play with who which is bizarre in itself. I’m confident my DD would not purposely exclude anyone. She is the type of child that goes over to the kids feeling lonely on the buddy bench. She is buddied up with new people joining the school. A new parent recently thanked me for my DD settling in her DD. She has lots of friends just this dynamic is off, so I do encourage her to play with other kids. She is very attached to those two as she sits by them in lessons etc. We talk a lot about school dynamics at home as DDs sibling has a disability and has experienced being left out/excluded. I know how important it is to my DD to include everyone as she sees how hurt her own sibling has been.

You're approaching this the wrong way. From your own posts, E quickly becomes physical. O's unwillingness to spend time with E is because E manipulates and physically pulls and pushes. Those are valid reasons not to spend time with E. O's reasoning is completely different from E's jealous possessiveness.
You don't need to teach your DD to 'be kind'. You need to teach your DD to have boundaries around the behaviour she accepts. As a girl, the entire world will teach your DD to 'be kind' and by that they will mean she should put up with poor behaviour, turn a blind eye to bullies and acquiesce to physical intimidation. You need to teach her how to protect herself by being able to say 'no' and imposing boundaries around the treatment she expects and condones.
At a practical level, ask the school to move your DD in class so she doesn't sit with O and E in lessons.

I just wanted to add, I don't mean that you don't ever need to teach your DD to be kind. I mean you've obviously taught her that lesson well already. Now you need to teach her the boundaries around that and how to stay strong against the many, many people who will see kindness as weakness.

I definitely do need to get her to be more firm with her boundaries. I am a people pleaser and being firm sometimes feels like being mean/difficult, I think she feels the same. I spoke to her about it on the way to school.

Little update DD told E today not to grab her! As soon as DD got to school E started pulling her. DD said please let me walk, don’t pull me. This is the first time she’s ever stood up for herself. I think E was quite shocked and it seems E has taken a step back from her today, which is a good thing. It’s made me realise that E only likes people that she can control. It turns out that E and O had another falling out today (whilst DD was playing quite happily with another girl). I do feel for O as I think E tends to target people (which is why the children don’t like standing up to her I think). Girls friendships are hard. Bottom line is I won’t be having my DD dragged around by anyone. I have also spoken to the class teacher and mentioned the dragging/man handling. She said she will have a word. So all good all round.

Sounds frightfully like a dynamic in my daughters class at that age. Trio of girls constantly pushing pulling each other and having huge fallings out. Really unhealthy attitudes from the parents too. My DD wasn’t part of it and went to find other kids to play with.

Personally I’d encourage your daughter to nurture other friendships and work at play dates etc outside of school. Sometimes the parents like to pretend they are in school still and stir shot too.

You don't need to teach your DD to 'be kind'. You need to teach your DD to have boundaries around the behaviour she accepts. As a girl, the entire world will teach your DD to 'be kind' and by that they will mean she should put up with poor behaviour, turn a blind eye to bullies and acquiesce to physical intimidation. You need to teach her how to protect herself by being able to say 'no' and imposing boundaries around the treatment she expects and condones.

100% this!