Social workers/Family Law solicitors please help

[OnWhatGrounds]

**I originally put this on legal matters but thought that AIBU would get more traffic.

Okay, so I generally know I'm not in the wrong here due to my own professional background but because of the emotion involved I'm wanting to sound this out....

My nephew has always been a cause for concern. Mum is not around and lives in a different country - very little contact and relationship. He lives with dad and has done since he came to England age 4. He is now 13. We've always had input with him and cared for him frequently. At one point age 5 we cared for him for 5 months whilst social care were investigating my brother.

We have made referrals due to concerns re emotional harm over the years, never meets threshold. I know it's hard to prove. I have always suspected physical as well but no evidence - there is a lot of context here re my brothers violence growing up. A long story.

My nephew alleged physical harm a month ago but social care closed it, not enough evidence allegedly. He has now alleged physical harm, being punched in the face and hit. He has had a black eye and police have taken a statement and want to video interview. Social care are finally involved and have asked us to have him for the moment , but say it's child in need. So my query is:

1.) I know this isn't acceptable. You can't just have a child. Under what grounds am I caring for him as I certainly won't do this on private arrangement like last time. It was wishy washy and no support or structure. If he isn't safe enough to go home then they need to be transparent on whether they feel a threshold is met for significant harm. Currently when I rang up they said it's at child in need. This doesn't sit right with me. You can't have a child who isn't safe to go home but is only CIN.

2.) what grounds am I caring for her. I am going to be emailing the s.worker/manager to let them know I do not agree to care for him under private arrangement. We don't even know if my brother has agreed to a s20 or whether he has been told we have volunteered. We did not. We were asked.

I have a background in children services so I know this isn't right. I want to help my nephew but I won't be messed about and I know they aren't being transparent which is such a shame, as it sets a bad tone when I know the majority of social workers want to do good. Context; I have had cases with this allocated social worker before and she has told me she is on the edge of burnout in a professional capacity so I'm already wary

You're right. If you're being asked to care for him then you need to be assessed and supported as a kinship carer and the father needs to sign section 20. If he won't, they should be considering legal action and seeking a care order.

Currently he's in a de facto placement with you and if it goes on more than a couple of weeks it becomes an unregulated placement. Nobody wants that and if the SW's manager is fully in the picture they should be doing something about this

Thank you, I felt this to be the case.

We have had initial basic police checks but I am conscious of letting this continue as the status quo. There has been no proper assessment. No visit. No confirmation of outcome of a strategy meeting although I know one must have been held.

You just can't have a child on CIN and not allow them home to the parent. Its either considered to be safe to go home or not. It's contradictory. If it's not safe, they need to be acting to safeguard her within the law.

Exactly. They are relying on you to have him as a casual 'family' arrangement but it's not that if they have said he's not safe to go home. They are avoiding their legal duty.

if it has been 2 weeks social worker will be doing the initial assessing & if police are involved it is likely a joint section 47? It would certainly be good practice for the social worker to come to see your nephew at your home but not a requirement. Is there definitely no section 20? His dad may have signed some sort of safety plan/written agreement but that would have no legal standing. If dad has not signed section 20 and s/w decides he is at risk of significant harm then they should apply to court for an ICO and carry out a viability assessment on you. At early stages s/w has likely classed this as a family arrangement but it can’t stay as one if he is not returning home

They’re trying to take the route of less work I suspect.

If I were you I’d contact them and state you are willing to have nephew but only formally. CIN is worthless. Wireless this should at least warrant a ICPC? His son has disclosed physical abuse twice, I’m assuming you and he disclose emotionally abuse and you have some knowledge of his being violent in the past. That sounds well enough for more than CIN.

I wouldn’t really be happy with a S20 either. It’s not really voluntary is it and he could take back consent for that at any point.

Op, please reach out to Kinship care they are a charity that works and supports adults who care for others children either on a temp or permanent basis.

is this a special guardian ship request?

brither needs to sign section 20 to allow the LA to share PR, for you to take it on.

find out what is the plan going forward, what does child want? What happens if you refuse to house child, what would they do?

you are right that private arrangement means you and child get no support or financial assessment or PR, so no support with health or education.

I’ve commented on your thread in legal matters op - but this needs a legal framework and fast. I wouldn’t worry too much about whether CIN or CP, it doesn’t change anything really for the child day to day. You need to know under what order or agreement this child is with you, I’d call and ask for team or service manager and be insistent you need to speak to someone experienced and capable.

They can't file a viability assessment without visiting the home!

It all depends whether the child is allowed to go home or not. It is proportionate to ask family under a private arrangement to care for a child whilst x,y,z is done with a parent for example to support them. But only if that child can return home at any time that the child, parent or family want that to happen. If social care are saying that they can't return home because it is too unsafe and he'd at risk of significantly harm by returning home then yes they've created a de-facto placememt and need to do that under a legal footing.

I’ve seen some done over the phone! Bloody ridiculous.

If the child is placed formally with the OP it HAS to be under section 20 at this point and they would not have s20 and a CP plan running concurrently. In fact there is no threshold for a CP plan if the child is out of the home with OP. Regarding OP's feelings on s20 they aren't really relevant. The decision to go to court or not will be made by senior managers and lawyers based on threshold and need.

brither needs to sign section 20 to allow the LA to share PR, for you to take it on.

section 20 doesn't confer shared PR to the local authority.

That's grim and no way would I be signing that off. I'm surprised any ADM would sign that off either! It wouldn't happen in my LA

They will try to make it a private arrangement so they have no financial obligation. Is your brother in agreement, has he asked you to help him in the situation, what is the safety plan should he want to remove his son.

@Bobtheamazinggingerdog
of course they visit the home for a proper viability assessment, I’m not suggesting otherwise
its only been 2 weeks decisions likely have not been made yet

An initial viability assessment should be completed within 2 weeks of a placement and should include a home visit.

Technically he may be a child in need, because the assessment hasn't concluded - he wouldn't step up to a child protection plan without a conference to make that decision.

However, how a child who is likely to stay CIN and how a child who has an open investigation under s47 (especially if it's felt likely to go to conference or even removal) should be treated in practice is different.

It is appropriate (in fact, legally required) to see if family members would have a child to stay for a night or two while things are looked into. However if there is clear evidence that the child can't go home/isn't safe/CSC wouldn't accept the child going home (eg if you were to send him home they'd find somewhere else for him) then it's in the territory of kinship care. The test is really if you say you can't have him would they let him go back (even if reluctantly) and put in a safety plan with the parent/do extra visits, or would they be asking other relatives/finding a foster placement? The legal status if he is placed with you, rather than a private arrangement (which comes with assessment but also finances) that you want to enquire about is reg 24. In most places there are 2 or 3 stages to this, initial viability which can be done over the phone and is basically checking there's no one who would be a risk to children at the address, then a short assessment to see if it's viable and then a full assessment which is very in-depth and over a period of time (up to 16 weeks)

Yes thank you everyone , I am generally in agreement with everyone's comments

My brother has not contacted me once and we do not speak, and have not spoken for a year. He has stopped me seeing my nephew and I've actually not seen him for a year. So this is most definitely not a privately arranged agreement

I am interested to know what they would do, as one poster said, if we said no. I think the threshold is met for CP and really, so legal intervention.
We are the only family he has in this country so no alternatives.