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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

School wrap-around - what do we do ?

414 replies

Oneanddone88 · 05/11/2023 09:52

Hi,
DD (4) just started reception. I chose the school based on local reputation plus the availability of breakfast club and after school club to facilitate us still working. The school explained to us in a meeting that the after school club runs daily.
Fast forward to a week before term in September and the club (who are a private company hired by the school), says they aren't running due to a lack of staff.
Panic stations as we have no local family and not huge flexibility with our jobs. Partner WFH twice a week so collects then and I work 4 days. So we needed after school club for two afternoons.
The schools response was 'that's a shame but nothing we do'.
We've had to juggle it with another local parent who collects on the two days we needed and we take her DS to school every day. Workable in the very short term but not long term as she is having to leave work super early those days and meet important meetings.
I've emailed the school a few times asking for updates and it's all very 'no nothing sorry '.

I'm at the point where I'm wondering do we move schools to one where they have nursery wraparound.
Also one childminder serves the school we chose, and she's full with a waiting list.

What has also annoyed me is that when we went to info afternoon with the school where they told us the club runs daily , that it wasn't even true. The after-school club told us they ran for two days a week last academic year , and not even the days we needed.

Has anyone else experienced similar before? I feel very stressed. I changed my job of 12 years due to DD starting school and wonder now why I bothered as we're in a worse logistical situation thanks to this.

There's nothing from the club or school about when this is going to be resolved.

OP posts:
DahliaJ · 07/11/2023 20:24

potterycorner · 06/11/2023 20:57

@gemma19846

Not sure what youre actually asking or expecting to be honest. The ASC has now closed, it isnt the schools problem its yours so now you have to make some decisions. Get help from other people, change your hours OR move DD to a different school. Im not sure what help you expect from the school or posters on here to be honest

What the OP is communicating is that she made the decision to move her job, and select a school, to accommodate her family's needs - because the school had said that wraparound care would be available.

It isn't now, and she is left completely stranded. This means there is no provision for her child, other than care provided as a favour, which is unsustainable.

I think she said she is a teacher, and will be subject to a three-month notice period.

This leaves her in an impossible situation.

We should all care about this.

The OP is signalling to the Mumsnet community that the current situation is unfair, damaging to young children, and damaging to the whole of society.

How is it good for the rest of us, or our children, if we are losing highly-qualified teachers from the state system because there is no childcare infrastructure?

Women are leaving the labour market in droves, and not because they actively want to. Leaving because there is no care infrastructure damages our long-term earning capacity, and will reduce their pensions further down the line.

This needs a system-level fix and some public investment - parents cannot simply manage their calendars better to be in two places at once.

The OP deserves sympathy - and also our thanks for taking the time to tell us what it's like for parents of early years children.

Thank you. We should all be writing to our MP’s not blaming the working parent, especially one with no flexibility due to her teaching post.

Missminniesmummy2023 · 07/11/2023 23:48

Can’t you get your daughter placed at your school? This would happen in Scotland.. not sure where you are?

JustAMinutePleass · 08/11/2023 00:11

Are there other schools? If you can afford to - private schools often build wrap around care into contracts so might be worth exploring if you can.

LeedsMum87 · 08/11/2023 04:13

Can you put in a flexible working request to change your 4 days per week to 5 shorter days so you can collect your child from school?

LelF · 08/11/2023 06:20

I was a teacher and found myself in the same situation as you. I handed in my notice and became a childminder. I looked after preschoolers and babies in the day and offered wrap around care. I loved it. It was then me who had a huge waiting list!

modgepodge · 08/11/2023 07:02

LeedsMum87 · 08/11/2023 04:13

Can you put in a flexible working request to change your 4 days per week to 5 shorter days so you can collect your child from school?

The OP is a teacher. Have you heard of schools adjusting their school day to accommodate teachers doing this?

Boomboom22 · 08/11/2023 07:26

modgepodge · 08/11/2023 07:02

The OP is a teacher. Have you heard of schools adjusting their school day to accommodate teachers doing this?

Show quote history

Depends. Not for primary, pt full days only really. But for secondary lots of arrangements are possible.
I work 0.8 and mostly ask to be timetabled as off period 6. But I change it every year based on child care needs. Loads of teachers are 0.8 at my school and / or have agreements about ppa time and work later at home to make it up. It depends on the culture of the school.
I was ft at the 2 before that and left straight after the kids to get to primary pick up as they finished a bit later than secondary.

Skodacool · 08/11/2023 07:38

Bluevelvetsofa · 05/11/2023 09:58

The after school club is, as you’ve said, a private company and nothing to do with the school, other than they have used the premises.

If the private organisation can’t staff the club, it can’t run. At the time you were told that the club runs daily, it was running daily. Now things have changed, it seems.

Perhaps a move to a school with the care you need would be better in the long run, because cobbling together temporary solutions must be stressful.

Not so, OP said they found out that the club didn’t run daily last year

Ilovelifeverymuch · 08/11/2023 09:50

PussyGalore1 · 05/11/2023 09:55

To be fair, it’s not the schools responsibility to look after your child after hours.
sorry to be so blunt but can you look at nanny share ?

What bullocks, the issue is they lied about offering a service which they don't and have now left OP scrambling for alternatives.

spanieleyes · 08/11/2023 10:53

There is almost 12 months between applying for a school place in Reception and taking the place up, lots can change for a private company in that time. When the OP originally enquired, there may well have been full time provision which dropped down to 2 days shortly after ( presumably because it wasn't viable) When the OP further enquired, the firm said they could cover the days she required. This was then changed a week before term started and the company closed completely- again presumably because the demand wasn't sufficient/not commercially viable/staffing issues.
Perhaps the school feel as misled as the OP does. They had access to a valuable provision which they could inform prospective parents about. Now they don't. It may well affect pupil numbers going forward, so it's not ideal for them either.

potterycorner · 08/11/2023 11:31

@spanieleyes

Yes! I think we all understand that! But we can't just shrug and say, 'that's just the way it is'.

Otherwise, parents with primary school-aged children cannot both work. And in most cases, households need two incomes to just get by.

CharlotteBog · 08/11/2023 12:11

spanieleyes · 08/11/2023 10:53

There is almost 12 months between applying for a school place in Reception and taking the place up, lots can change for a private company in that time. When the OP originally enquired, there may well have been full time provision which dropped down to 2 days shortly after ( presumably because it wasn't viable) When the OP further enquired, the firm said they could cover the days she required. This was then changed a week before term started and the company closed completely- again presumably because the demand wasn't sufficient/not commercially viable/staffing issues.
Perhaps the school feel as misled as the OP does. They had access to a valuable provision which they could inform prospective parents about. Now they don't. It may well affect pupil numbers going forward, so it's not ideal for them either.

OP says the school website still gives misleading information.

Sarahi1234 · 08/11/2023 14:55

Just want to say I sympathise. No help, but I sympathise. We are lucky to have after school club but it stops dead at 6. I can’t get back from the office till 7. Work have just upped us to 3 days per week in the office, I had a arrangement with mil for one day per week pick up. But three definitely isn’t an option! I have looked at childminders (they laughed at us! Years of waiting lists!) nannies (they charged us more than I earn!!)…what is a working parent supposed to do 🤯 and as a teacher wfh isn’t even an option for you. So, so stressful. Of course, as everyone’s said, it’s not the schools responsibility. But that doesn’t make it any less stressful. Good luck…

CharlotteBog · 08/11/2023 16:01

Sarahi1234 · 08/11/2023 14:55

Just want to say I sympathise. No help, but I sympathise. We are lucky to have after school club but it stops dead at 6. I can’t get back from the office till 7. Work have just upped us to 3 days per week in the office, I had a arrangement with mil for one day per week pick up. But three definitely isn’t an option! I have looked at childminders (they laughed at us! Years of waiting lists!) nannies (they charged us more than I earn!!)…what is a working parent supposed to do 🤯 and as a teacher wfh isn’t even an option for you. So, so stressful. Of course, as everyone’s said, it’s not the schools responsibility. But that doesn’t make it any less stressful. Good luck…

I'm curious to know how you are managing the other 2 office days?

I wonder whether there will be an increase in childminders in the near future. I hope so. I am thankful that my childcare days are over (DS is 14).

Boredandbitter · 08/11/2023 16:08

Schools did not force you to have your kids. Their job is to educate your kids, not provide childcare for you. Suck it up, Buttercup.

JustAMinutePleass · 08/11/2023 16:18

Ilovelifeverymuch · 08/11/2023 09:50

What bullocks, the issue is they lied about offering a service which they don't and have now left OP scrambling for alternatives.

Show quote history

In my experience State schools lie and mislead a lot. Eg schools saying they do ‘daily PE’ when they only do weekly PE with daily paid for extracurricular sports classes that you have to pay for. Or saying they teach French from Reception and you discover they learn it online via a screen (not via a French teacher). The one that made me angriest was when two local schools said they offered ‘free fruit’ to kids but in actuality they made parents donate and if they didn’t / couldn’t their kids wouldn’t get any. One school got rid of morning care during our application process and another decided, randomly, to only offer 5-6pm care to non-working parents (allegedly to support them to get employment, but when there was no take up they used it as an excuse to get rid of it altogether).

These are ‘Outstanding’ Schools.

For me the availability of reliable childcare, French teachers, daily PE is essential and luckily I can afford it so I went private. But there is such a postcode lottery about these things

CharlotteBog · 08/11/2023 16:48

Boredandbitter · 08/11/2023 16:08

Schools did not force you to have your kids. Their job is to educate your kids, not provide childcare for you. Suck it up, Buttercup.

You are missing the issue we are discussing.

CharlotteBog · 08/11/2023 16:50

The one that made me angriest was when two local schools said they offered ‘free fruit’ to kids but in actuality they made parents donate and if they didn’t / couldn’t their kids wouldn’t get any

Has the free fruit scheme stopped? This was for kids in KS1 I think. And maybe just England and Wales.

stichguru · 08/11/2023 18:53

"May- we had meeting with school telling us AFC is running daily (this was also on website when we applied in the October )
June- finally made contact with AFC telling us they were running twice a week all year. We then asked if they would accommodate Tues and Thurs (days we need ) and they said yes and we set it up"

So actually the childcare would have been provided when you needed it, if it hadn't fallen through. Stop blaming the school for this, and find other childcare.

potterycorner · 08/11/2023 22:05

@stichguru

So actually the childcare would have been provided when you needed it, if it hadn't fallen through.

Great reasoning! Redolent of 'if we had ham, we'd have ham and eggs, if only we had some eggs'.

It didn't 'fall through' because of some small random issue within a wider ecosystem where provision is generally fine.

There are structural failures here, causing lack of provision and little foreseeable alternative. The OP is entitled to be aggrieved, as are the rest of us. It really won't do.

CherryMyBrandy · 08/11/2023 22:52

The situation with childcare in this country is absolutely ridiculous. Places are like hen's teeth, nurseries are sending children home every time they have a sniffle, and as the OP is finding that even if you do your research and think you have everything set up it can be pulled at the last minute. Oh and it costs a fortune if it's not a subsidised place.

It did not used to be like this! How have we got from where we were 15-20 years ago when my children were in childcare to this chaos. There was choice, it was rare that they couldn't go into nursery, and there was good options for wraparound care and holiday clubs. How anyone keeps their jobs with the state of childcare as it is is beyond me. And I must say the attitude of posters on this thread is appalling; this ridiculous chaos is not the OPs fault! The system is just really, really crap.

If the government want people working and in jobs, they really need to get their finger out. It's all gone tits up since "free" childcare hours came in. I support childcare being free, but it needs to be properly funded to work properly.

I cannot understand how wraparound care couldn't be financially viable though? Are people just not taking up the places? It's hard to believe that when people are desperate for childcare! Perhaps the intake just has a high proportion of stay at home parents/parents with flexible/part-time jobs??

Anyhow I am sorry you are in this position OP, it sounds incredibly stressful.

stichguru · 08/11/2023 23:06

potterycorner · 08/11/2023 22:05

@stichguru

So actually the childcare would have been provided when you needed it, if it hadn't fallen through.

Great reasoning! Redolent of 'if we had ham, we'd have ham and eggs, if only we had some eggs'.

It didn't 'fall through' because of some small random issue within a wider ecosystem where provision is generally fine.

There are structural failures here, causing lack of provision and little foreseeable alternative. The OP is entitled to be aggrieved, as are the rest of us. It really won't do.

What I think isn't on here though is that the parent is blaming the school. She clearly states that:
"the club (who are a private company hired by the school), says they aren't running due to a lack of staff."
Nowhere does it suggest that the school promised the parents to always provide care, they had an agreement with a care provider that they would run a club for the school kids, from the school. They told the parents about this agreement, but when that provider ended the agreement, they couldn't force them to stay. They wouldn't have had the structure ready to put a club in themselves, because that structure along with employment of staff etc, fell to the external provider.

She then says "I've emailed the school a few times asking for updates and it's all very 'no nothing sorry'. Well what does she expect the school to be doing? THEY don't run the care, they probably never have, the people that were doing it have gone. Maybe the school could set up an internally run club, but that will take time to organise.

Yes I agree, there are huge structural failures in society, in terms of their expectations of parents to work for money, but then no-one ensures there are affordable childcare options. These aren't the school's failings though, the school is NOT there to provide childcare and never has been.

Sugarfree23 · 09/11/2023 00:23

@CherryMyBrandy
Another thing that has changed from 20years ago, people used to be able to work up to 16hrs without affecting benefits.
After school running 3hrs a day, 5 days a week =15 hrs, offer a free child place, and you have an ideal job for a mum on benefits. And if they up their hours over the holidays it wasn't a big issue for staff and benefits to be worked out.

The benefits system has changed people are being pressured to take more hours. UC seems to make it difficult for staff to pickup extra shifts.
The councils are offering more hours and better money in the nurseries.
It just makes it hard to retain staff.

Ryeman · 09/11/2023 06:25

It’s wrong saying the club is nothing to do with the school. At our school they work closely together and have monthly management meetings, because it’s massively in the school’s interest to have a functioning after school club. However maybe they have exhausted all options. You either need a nanny or to move schools.

arintingly · 09/11/2023 06:50

Well what does she expect the school to be doing?

Look into other providers? One won't just knock on their door, especially as their website isn't even up to date so they won't be aware.

Look into setting up their own?

This "it has nothing to do with them" attitude is so weird, even schools that contract it out have plenty to do with the wraparound care, they discuss terms with the provider, they advertise it to parents etc