Colleague lying

[Bettyscakes]

Help! I supervise 2 admins at work. One of them (been here a year) is not very competent and makes lots of mistakes despite lots of training.

They still appear to have no clear understanding of the job even though we have explained it so many times and the manager has spoken to her numerous times.

I can literally give her something & explain and she writes it down but she then forgets to do it, gets it wrong and blames her laptop.

It is exasperating.

Manager is now being cc’d in everything so she can see level of errors.

Today I gave her a task around 9.30am. At 2.45 I realised I’d seen no evidence of it being done (I check it). It was to be posted & the mailroom deadline is 3pm.

Long story short I asked & could tell by the response it hadn’t been done and suddenly a letter appeared in the folder which had obviously just been typed. I assume she must have spoken to the mailroom and could send it late. I asked a few times if the other admin had checked it but was ignored.

I know I have been lied to and she forgot and instead of owning it she then got the other admin involved and fair enough got it done. I know it’s because she is worry about us seeing another error from her.

I just can’t get over being lied to.

My AIBU is should I tell my manager? She said in a meeting this week she needs to know all errors. But she did sort it. It’s the lying…

It’s the other admin staff I feel sorry for. All this work being piled on them, I hope they’re looking for another job, it sounds like they’re being taken advantage of by you and your workplace because you don’t want the hassle of dismissing someone.

Do you or her manager have access to cctv or internet monitoring footage to see what she’s doing instead of her job? Might be easier to dismiss for gross misconduct if you have proof of her internet shopping / chatting to colleagues for hours on end.

@DaftyInTheMiddle I have absolutely no power over this other than keeping flagging. It’s me taking on most of her work, not the other admin. The other admin is looking for a job as she is sick of being paid the same as someone doing very little. They also know I have flagged it many many times.

She is now only allowed to work from home one day a week so we can keep an eye on what she is doing. She is so so slow. Today so far she has achieved nothing.

I have now spoken to my manager and she agreed we will take things further on Monday as she picked up on yesterday too.

This post says pretty much what I meant! Managers who are more comfortable tolerating poor capability rather than dealing with it are also more easily tolerated in larger organisations - where no one is worrying if theyhave the cash flow or profitability to actually be able to pay next month’s wage bill.

Spot on! I also work in HR in the public sector and couldn't agree more. Really bad performers can be got rid of fairly easily if only their managers can steel themselves to grasp the nettle at the earliest stage possible.
In my experience people who cause problems in the early stages of their employment tend to get worse as time goes by, and it's so much harder to address issues when many years have passed.

Thanks. I think I need to somehow get my manager to take action!

Top calling people "admins" and you might get a better response.

Now that’s a a real challenge whatever type of work or sized company you’re in 🤣. I agree it would be great if you could influence your manager to take action. That I know is truly easier said than done!

@BannedfromChristmas that’s what we call each other, no one is bothered!!

@MoonlitStarryNights i agree but she is becoming mindful it’s now affecting the whole team so I am hopeful

She sounds so ill-fitted to the role that you can let this one slide because she'll mess plenty of other things up in nice, clear-cut ways.

Make sure that in your spoken discussions with your managers, you take the time to say nice things about her as a person but continue to emphasise that the role just isn't a fit at all, she really just isn't meeting the minimum requirements, and she'd be much better off in a job where she can use her strengths. You do not want to come across as someone who's bitter or has a personal grudge, because that "gets remembered" and especially for women will be held against you later on.

And ONE HUNDRED percent this. Here's the thing (public or private): managers, at all levels, do not have the same priorities as anyone below them. If a problem is not really a problem to them they will continue to ignore it because it's not really having any consequence for them to just mosey along with more pleasant issues. So right now, your manager's getting your flags each time, but isn't really that bothered to act on them because they aren't (right now) impacting on whether he meets his own boss's requirements of him.

I've seen this in my own workplaces, the boss's boss gives the whole place a stellar review while you're seething about the shitty performance of one colleague, the one you've continually told your own manager about, but nothing happens. So here are some other things to possibly consider depending on your workplace:

Other admin can raise a grievance. Being a govt department there is no doubt an investigative procedure that must be carried out if this happens.

If you're on good terms with boss' boss, as in, good enough to chit chat, throw into the conversation the current methods you're using "along with your boss, so you can both try to do something about Bad-Admin's incredibly poor performance". Make sure you don't come across as going over your own boss's head.

Be more vocal about the issues Bad-Admin is causing and start being "unable" to keep up with all the workload that she is letting you down on. Begin asking Boss for help to complete Bad-Admin's work because you can't manage it alone since "BA has really achieved nothing today". Although you want to document all the actual screw ups, I'd do this one verbally. This is making it his problem.

Then, if it hasn't happened already, get together with Boss and put together a formal meeting AND written statement or summary to BA setting out the things they are required to achieve on a daily/weekly basis, state that they are currently not meeting these tasks and that their performance is well below the minimum standard expected of someone who has been in the role for one year. Ask BA what they need from you in order to begin achieving their minimum job requirements and how you can assist. List the specific "excuses" for example, if she says "I forgot" then you write, "If you are forgetting to complete tasks, you are expected to come up with a solution which reminds you, for example a reminder or task management programme." "If you are having problems with your laptop, you know how to contact the IT department to get this rectified." "If you do not believe you will have time to complete a task by deadline, you are expected to loop me in on this well ahead of that deadline." "If you don't know how to do a task, you know where to look up the guide online or you know to contact me well before the deadline." You're throwing all the "not my fault waaah!" crap firmly back into her court because she's an adult and they are her problems to solve. But more importantly it will give you documented ammunition for later on that you have given her all the knowledge and tools she needs to sort this out and still failed to do it. It's covering your arse.

That way you can go back a month later and say: We talked about this and you told me you would sort it out, but this has happened again.

@Froooty I wished I worked with you! You have skills I want to learn. I loved reading your posts.

For me, there wasn’t anything in your messages that I didn’t know. In fact, you’ve given a message I often try to give…. But when I try and give the message, sometimes (often maybe?!) I’m not heard… and now I know why! It hasn’t held me back that much because most people work out what I meant. However, I need to give and share the knowledge I have much better before I can be sure I’ll be heard and understood! I’ve been given this feedback so many times in different ways but couldn’t work out exactly where I was going wrong. Now I know!

@MoonlitStarryNights you're very kind. I don't think it's a special skill I have, I' just interested in what makes people "tick". That, and a a fair amount of admiration for AskAManager's blog. There's something to be said for learning "workplace politics"; if I read you right you're in a management role and have sometimes felt like you're being ignored. This is where you become less "whiny annoyance" complaining to their manager, and more like a problem-solver asking for support.

I'm an ex-manager but for family reasons I now choose the bottom rung in a supermarket. I make effort to be on "equal" terms with my manager and big boss. I don't arse-lick but I find out what their drives and priorities are. I build friendships with every colleague, I help and mentor, I tell their colleagues and managers when someone does well. End result? I'm given a ton of leeway, opportunities, skill-ups and responsibilities. I am not resented, because word gets back when I've said they did good. I get the performance reviews that knock it out of the park, even though I (personally) don't feel like I do anywhere near the hard work of most other cashiers 😏

Anecdote of my own: I have a nice, smart colleague who would often perform really poorly (Nadia). Anytime someone called her out, she'd say it was unfair. I'd listen, but I privately didn't agree. One day a manager had a very sad face on, so I ask what's wrong. Big Boss had kicked his arse for the shop not being up to standard. So I say he can't just take the flak himself and get sacked, his whole team is supposed to do the work, and he needs to make all of us do it.

He started Nadia on written performance management, she ranted that she was going to BB to complain, I tell her that BB only cares whether the shop is running. The penny dropped as she understood BB had different priorities than her hurt feelings. The manager grew a pair and began to actually gain confidence as a manager. Did I overstep by "telling" him what to do? Oh, very much so. But both of us gained respect, and without respect your staff won't listen. Nadia has improved and she and I are still friends.

It's a WAY TOO LONG story here but Nadia is your Bad Admin in the OP's post. The one who spends too long pissing about and everything is someone else's fault. A lack of boundaries creates a brat because there's no repercussions. If you force her up to the T-intersection in the road, she has to choose which way she'll go: Actually incapable/unwilling (and managed out of the business) or stepping up, learning her skills, and getting things done. You can't force her to that junction by whining up the chain, only by harnessing the strengths of formal structure. And only one of the roads has the outcome that the other staff want to live with.

@Froooty thank you, yes she is Nadia. It’s frustrating as she is a nice person. She is just not capable of this job but yes she needs to know that she can’t coast. Something has to give.

@Froooty thank you again! You’re totally right I think struggling with feeling ignored is likely the root issue. It’s great to have that pointed to me because now I’ve re-read back my posts I feel like I was almost screaming not to be ignored. I think I might need a refresher EMDR session to help me really benefit from the help you’ve given me.

@Bettyscakes, it was very kind of @Froooty to pause helping you briefly to give me such valuable help. I came on your thread hoping to be of help to you and will be going away myself with really valuable help. Hope that’s been ok with you. All the best sorting your work situation out. You’ve come across in your posts to me as someone who could really get this sorted - so long as your Manager is willing to be influenced into getting this sorted.