I’ve been scammed - help me nail the bastard.

[Thebigblueballoon]

Hello AIBU fans. Shamelessly posting here for traffic.

I work in an interior designs field, and over the part two months ago I have ordered some stock from a person who I previously had a good business relationship with.

He hasn’t delivered the goods. Apparently because he’s had a “family crisis”. It’s been eight weeks. Eight weeks of excuses I have accepted, even when he’s cancelled a delivery on the very same day.

It turns out he’s a massive fraud, and has scammed dozens of people in our industry out of money. There’s somebody in Australia waiting on 15k. Literally thousands of pounds in some cases. Why this hasn’t been documented more online is beyond me, but there you go… now is the time.

I’m taking him to small claims court as soon as possible, I just need to get his address and details, and as much info as possible on this scumbag.
What’s the best way to do this? And how can I flag this arsehole up to everybody in the industry I work in?

Action Fraud won't give a toss. They investigated less than 1% of cases referred to them last year. There was a programme on Radio 4 last week about a famous brush company- Kents, who have a Royal Warrant- that have been scammed out of £1.2 million and neither the police not Action Fraud would do anything about it.

What's odd is those who have never heard of a legitimate business person falling on hard times and becoming a thief. This is truly not unusual and particularly not unusual in the antiques/vintage furniture/cash businesses. I personally have encountered more than a few along the way in my life.
Unfortunately, it's unlikely that the police and/or trading standards will be interested because there is just too much of this around and it's too hard to prosecute.

I would definitely do some posts on social media to alert others in the industry. Be careful how you word the posts (do some googling on what constitutes defamation .... ie I think you can post about your personal experience, but not call him a thief in general)

Here's the link- it was £1.6 million.
'My business had £1.6m stolen in 20 minutes' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67149919

Agree. Not just business, desperate people do desperate things. There was a case local to me, sadly he took his own life. He was a good person who robbed Peter to pay Paul and then the money he was expecting for Peter didn't arrive, so he robbed Jane whilst waiting for Peters money.... if affected a lot of us locally but the general consensus is that he was still a good man and that by the Grace of God go we.

Also I've met people that are scammers, legitimate when things are going well but when times get tough aren't willing to sacrifice their lifestyle so they resort to fraud. Then they dissolve the buisness, claim stock issues and set up again.

Lots of buisness is based on relationships and trust, those implying otherwise are disingenuous.

Although I am intrigued, I have heard rumors of an antiques dealer heading that way, but his website is currently functioning.

No business should work on trust alone.

there have to be contractual checks and balances of some description in place to enable you to operate effectively.

I have no accurate phone number or address, so I’m on a mission.

you're going to be boiling an ocean trying to get a slimy toe rag to reveal an accurate phone number or physical address now he knows you're on his case.

are you saying you already transacted with him, but never got any validated details to be able to visit him and look him in the whites of his eyes? I'm sorry to say it this way, but this all feels like you're locking the stable door after the horse has bolted.

Are you sure he is a scammer and isn’t just having a “family crisis” as he said and can’t deliver what he promised to anyone not just you

No they should not. But it’s a big part of what we do.

I’d be amazed if he didn’t know people were on his case weeks ago.

I’ve dealt with him before face-to-face. As have many in my profession. He has relied on this to take the piss, basically.

If he's set it all up to con people out of money he's probably clever enough to cover hos arse so he can't be found

Ask for chargeback from your bank. https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/somethings-gone-wrong-with-a-purchase/getting-your-money-back-if-you-paid-by-card-or-paypal/

@Thebigblueballoon said:
I’ve dealt with him before face-to-face. As have many in my profession. He has relied on this to take the piss, basically.

Step 1. The conman wins the trust of the mark. Everyone thinks they are a good judge of character in a face to face meeting in which conversation takes place.. Unfortunately, the conman can judge character better than most, and is very good at playing a highly plausible role. After all, this is what he does for a living...

Step 2. The mark doesn't do due diligence because they trust him, because something the conman has said or done has convinced them they can (e.g. went to same school, has expensive things etc - which conman establishes in Step 1.)

And now the mark is on the hook. It only remains to reel them in.

I am so sorry you had to learn this the hard way, OP. Sadly, it's probably not worth pursuing. He's probably set up a similar scam with a new name by now.

@SequentialAnalyst

All very true, but the OP did clearly say she'd been dealing with this man for several years with no prior issues, as had many other people.

That's a very long lead time to work up a scam.

The fact that this person was clearly legit for many years and has suddenly become a fraud points more to identity theft than anything else in my view.

The OP has admitted she hasn't actually dealt with the person face-to-face since the fraudulent activity started, and neither has anyone else. So there is no real evidence that they are dealing with the same person they thought they knew and trusted.

For alll of yousaying identity fraud why is the OP not able to contact the genuine peraon on his old phone number or at his old address? Are you saying that at the same time as he had his identity stolen he decided to off grid with no forwarding details?

Wouldnt that be one hell of a coincidence?

@Thebigblueballoon I'm an antiques dealer in South Wales. Where is this guy based? Does he go to fairs, auctions etc? I think I'd report him to the police for fraud.

Thank you recent posters for your support - and the DMs are appreciated as well!

As confusing and ridiculous as it sounds, this is the same guy! I’m almost 100% certain, although I am doing my research behind the scenes.

He was a legit and and decent seller, but he’s gone down some wacky road and is now scamming people that he once dealt with legitimately. I’m talking some big names, that have gotten their money back, but others are still waiting or have been left out of pocket.

Scotland. He used to do all the fairs.

Sounds like his business has been on the decline for a while and he’s just trying to scoop in what he can before pulling the plug totally

Quite possibly. In this industry it is very easy to get into debt. I wouldn’t be surprised if he’d ended up in that situation and decided to rinse his contacts as much as he thought possible.

I don't know how you could actually work this one if you have no way of proving his identity, but could you look into the Ombudsman process (I think there is a specific Furniture Ombudsman if thats your product line) to see if they can advise you the best approach. I'm not in any way clued up on your sector I'm afraid but if you're wanting pursue every avenue and not leave a stone unturned it's another one to explore.

Isn’t fraud dept open 24/7 ring 159

@Zebedee55

It was a business transaction, not a consumer purchase.

Thanks for people correcting my misunderstanding.

Perhaps the business spiralled out of control for some reason, and he's been acting in a panic on a day to day basis. This sometimes happens if a business is too successful too quickly, and expands beyond its capacity to cope. It may then not have enough capital reserves to remedy the situation, and may end up in a cash flow crisis. I can imagine supply chains getting caught up in the resulting mess.

Or it could be that he has become mentally unwell as a result of things getting out of control, and is making irrational or delusional decisions

@SequentialAnalyst Or he could just not be being a very good person. Someone can go from treating people well to not treating them well, and vice versa.

Whatever his motivation for becoming a scammer, he has seemingly become one and the result is the same for OP and the others he's effected.

You say you know it's him but do you?

Have any of you who have been scammed previously seen or spoken (verbally - actually hearing and recognising his voice, not a modern use of the word spoken which is used when the person texted, emailed, whatsapp messaged etc) to the seller both when he was reputable and spoken to him during placing an order that was not delivered and the money not returned?

Because otherwise all you have is
1 a man used to run decent business and subsequently closed the physical locations
And
2 a man calls himself man 1 and takes money but fails to deliver.

But no evidence that man 1 and man 2 are the same man. Man 2 saying he is man 1 is not evidence that he is man 1.

Someone needs to have seen or spoken to both man 1 and man 2 to confirm they are one and the same.

Has anyone?

Give me strength! Of course he could. Or, as I said in my post before the one you replied to, the first of the two posts I've made on this thread, NOT the second one, he could be a scammer.