To think that any one who designs a town, building, theme park or attraction should have to spend the day navigating it in a wheelchair?

[Flufferblub]

Needed a wheelchair on some days since my early 30s, and the experience has been eye opening. Some spaces seem well designed such as airports, but others it feels like disabled people are a complete after thought. Even in new places that have just been built in the past few years. You can understand in historic towns and places, but if some where has been designed and built in the 21st century, you'd think that they'd put a button to open the disabled toilet door.

The people who design and run these places need to spend a day getting around in a wheelchair. Design it with wheelchairs in mind first, and everyone else will be alright. Who doesn't like a ramp and automatic doors any way?

Not building accessibility, but I read an interesting article about designing cars a couple of years ago, specifically about car design for an ageing population in sub-par health. One company, might have been Ford, made all their (predominantly) young male wear fatsuits that limited their mobility for two or three days of test-driving a range of cars aimed at the demographic.

I visited a new build in 2014 that was only accessible over a pea shingle car park - no good for my wheelchair bound friend.

Some workmen came over and created a 4 person lift to get them to the door.

Mind you, that's in line with the hotel that similarly had it's "accessible" rooms across their pea shingle drive. Sadly they had a fire alarm the night we stayed and the fire brigade issued a notice to close them down before they left. Luckily it was a false alarm ...

When the baby change is in the accessible loo....!!!! I remember someone banging on the door for me to get out so they could use the baby change. Tbf, I think she assumed it was just using the toilet for the sake of it because she looked mortified. It's not good enough though.

That's interesting as my gripe is the baby change being in the accessible toilets. Maybe they should be in all toilets or totally separate.

Pity disabled mothers. Remember being shafted twice isn't two times as bad. It's as bad squared.

The bin men should be returning the bins to the edge of the property, where they collect them from. It would be unreasonable to expect someone to return from work to put the bin away.

This wheelchair user ain't offended - I think its possibly better to have some truly disabled people doing this, but actually none disabled people might highlight issues better as they won't be used to it, won't have found all the work arounds etc.

The reality is, a lot of people just don’t care.

We’ve been in the ‘system’ for over 20 years due to a disabled son.

One of the most difficult things about going out is disabled toilets. We need a changing places toilet as our adult son needs to be hoisted onto a changing bench for personal care. Whilst an awful lot of work has taken place, changing places are still few and far between. Imagine going out for the evening and being told the nearest toilet you could use is 5 miles away.

We once met with the CEO of our local hospital which was having a major car Park build. He explained how it would be so much better with all the disabled spaces near the entrance. We asked him to remember that wheelchair accessible vehicles are too tall for most multi storey car parks. He thanked us for that and assured us he would highlight it with the designers. Obviously, that never happened, so every time we visit (unfortunately regular users) we can’t use their parking.

Fair point! I was thinking more a person not used to a wheelchair would be more likely to "cheat" and say something was fine.

We’ve found this a lot, my husband needs to use the accessible toilet when out, he was once presenting at another company and the accessible loo not only have one of those huge electric floor cleaners in, there were old tables, chairs and just random bits thrown everywhere. He took some photos and then left, his choice was to just leave and find a toilet elsewhere, or wet himself.

We’re find facilities are a bit better where we live now, but the main thing we have noticed is that accessible facilities aren’t full of clutter, they’re clean and not used by lazy people who don’t actually require them.

We’re find facilities are a bit better where we live now, but the main thing we have noticed is that accessible facilities aren’t full of clutter, they’re clean and not used by lazy people who don’t actually require them.

You can learn a lot waiting for a lift with a wheelchair user. When I'm out with a friend and there's a crowd , I'll wait with them for the lift, make sure they are in, then cheerily shout "I'll take the stairs". And usually get there before the life.

The recent fad for needing lifts to get from a car park to a supermarket shop floor hasn't really panned out well*. You can't get a wheelchair and a load of trolleys in there at the same time. And you can't get a wheelchair on the travellator.

Probably better you don't think about what if there was a fire. My friend did use a phrase "Crispy C***" once. (Which did sound like a new range, rather that what the fire services would find at the top.)

I occasionally use a transport chair but much more often a walker with wheels. So I'd say I'm considerably more mobile and able than someone who uses a wheelchair, but still weak, tired, ill and mostly can't go anywhere the walker can't go. Recent experiences:

After bin men have been, walk a few feet along the pavement, stop, move someone's wheelie bin, walk a few feet, stop, move someone's wheelie bin... the bins even empty can be quite heavy and I find it tiring, but at least I can do it! Not everyone can. People's landscaping companies leaving big bags of garden rubbish etc on the pavement, and those I can't move.

Went into a shop in a mall which was on various levels. There was street access to one level of the shop which was a bit like a landing, with no till, and stairs up and down to the other levels. Around the corner was a little platform lift with a sign to push a button to summon staff who never answered it. I had something I wanted to buy but there was no way of doing it so I left it.

Shops: narrow aisles, things blocking aisles, steps up to shop, steps down to shop, heavy doors and so on. Heavy doors even in hospitals, sometimes there are some automatic doors and some not and nobody seems to think it's an issue.

Lifts in hospitals where all the able bodied people make a dash for the lift and by the time I get there with my walker the door closes in my face. I know all the lifts in the hospital I'm in the most, and try to use the least busy ones because of this.

And so on, and my needs are trivial compared with people who use wheelchairs.

I honestly don't know how wheelchair users manage in my area. Some of the pavements are not wide enough for a wheelchair user to get past a bin, whereever you put the bins. I suppose the only solution would be to have them on each path to each house (few driveways here), rather than on the pavement, both before and after collection.

It's certainly an eye-opener pushing someone round in a wheelchair, and due to the weight and the centre of gravity it's nothing like a pushchair. Even a tiny kerb is difficult to negotiate, and as for shop doors... often I need three hands to open the door(s), keep them open, then get in with the wheelchair, though usually the staff see me struggling and come to help.

Also notice the modern trend of cobbled uneven paving to wanky places up. Totally impassable in a wheelchair. But then again, that was the idea, wasn't it ? Who wants disabled folk around making people feel uncomfortable ?

This time of year becomes particularly fun when shops want to use every inch of space for Christmas displays without thinking of accessibility. I would think the extra displays would be an issue for those who are visually impaired.

there is a card shop (part of a chain) locally that I won’t go in any of their branches because they are so difficult to navigate

The pavements around my parent's place are so, so hard for any kind of wheeled vehicle - abrupt edges with no slope leading you down to the ground. And this is a nice neighborhood! I think the problem is that nobody (except me, apparently) actually walks in that area. The whole neighborhood is now largely baby boomers with hardly any young families, and I wonder what will happen in the future as people start to get older and need mobility scooters etc.

Yes I think my mum thinks I'm a snob for not shopping in Primark, Quality Save etc but in reality I just can't relax with so much stuff around and then all the people rummaging through like a jumble sale. It's also incredibly hard to actually find what you need when a store is set up like that and you are visually impaired!

And this is a nice neighborhood

Presumably they want to keep it that way ...

YANBU at all.
I know this isn't the same but since DC was born earlier this year, it is not easy at all navigating London with a pushchair and using things like the tube. And it made me think about it from a wheelchair user's perspective. I am really surprised that "the greatest city in the world" does not better cater for wheelchair users. It's really poor.

You only need to be on MN for a few days to realise how much of a nuisance wheelchair users are. Especially when they take up the pram spaces on buses.

It was difficult during covid where companies put seating outside blocking most of the pavement.

Electric vehicle charging.
Accessibility hasn't been considered until very recently and I think.a working standard is still in process of being produced.
Problems are booths or spaces that aren't wide enough to maneuver a wheelchair around, charging points up on kerbs and large bumps to put the front wheels against that can't be navigated in a chair. That's without considering how heavy the charging cables are.

Also agree about baby changing tables being only in disabled toilets and the new version of this.. I complained about two negative experiences in a mixed sex toilet in a bar and was directed toward the disabled toilet. Why should I have to inconvenience a disabled person to avoid the potential of having to watch a drunken man peeing and worse.

I just remembered my dds mentioned that cash machines and self service tills aren't set up very well for wheelchair users. You can't get close enough to them to hide when you are putting in pins