Results like these at a general election would mean Tory annihilation

[noblegiraffe]

Says a BBC headline this morning.

Anyone else stockpiling popcorn?

85% vs 15% according to polls.

But that 15% overwhelmingly permanently Ex Tory.

Also, it’s not my friends, it’s the anti Lockdown movement. You get to hear opinions of many times more people than you actually know.

Besides which, that conservatives hate both

1. Govt abuse and
2. Economic destruction

is hardly news to anyone!

“Lockdown was both”, is something we weren’t allowed to say in 2020 but is now widely said on both sides. Indeed not being allowed to say stuff is another thing conservatives hate.

@Fifteenth I partly agree with you. I would posit that lockdown one was necessary simply because we did not know what we were dealing with - if it had had the lethality of SARS or MERS, for instance. It also didn't help that the pandemic hit at a time when the NHS had already spent 10 years being (intentially) run down.

Lockdown two could have been prevented with better management. The government of the time should absolutely be held accountable for that.
I do think that the hardcore lockdown people will vote for the likes of Reform.

@TizerorFizz

"It does mean the belief that Labour can turn things around with any speed is ludicrous. Definitely a 10 year project. "

+++

Most definitely and this will in turn lead to disillusion with Labour in the 2029 election. There simply isn't the money there for Government to spend combined with appalling low levels of productivity in the UK and appalling low levels of business investment makes for a shit show beyond Labour's control.

In my mind it keeps coming back to the 1815 quote by Alexander Fraser Tytler

"A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy"

Just as they tell you it takes 9 months to recover after a 9 month pregnancy I'd imagine 13 years of Tory asset stripping our country, neglecting our infrastructure and economic illiteracy will take 13 years to recover from.

It's never been this bad before.

The cheeky bastards have put us in record debt and the country has nothing to show for it.

Completely agree. I hope they’re irrelevant to the end of time after the last few years.

PFI is a major drain on finances for schools and hospitals. Labour policy. It’s money not available for teaching children. Academies were handed over to business and church schools proliferated. Labour guaranteed returns for companies owning nuclear, water and train infrastructure. Air traffic control and defence research were sold off. In work benefits made it a no brainer for employers to keep wages down. The government helped out. Great.

Anyone thinking Labour will return to socialist policies of the left will be wrong. They really will struggle to tax more. Non dom tax won’t be enough. Nor vat on school fees. Those who don’t have as much always think others have bottomless pockets. They don’t. They retire. They reduce hours. They don’t produce as much. So everyone is poorer. In the end, the Cons spend more time in power.

I believe the argument goes that if the Tories didn't like PFI they could've changed things...

Johnson kicked out the more sensible Tories.

Rory Stewart and Dominic Grieve etc replaced by headbangers like Gullis and Anderson.

PFI actually started under John Major.

PFI might have been a shit deal, but school buildings falling on children's heads is also a shit deal, and it turns out that was the alternative.

PFI contracts must be nearing their ends now. The 30 year one for our local hospital started in 2003 so another decade and the payments cease. The main hospital is pretty much 100% RAAC though so God knows how that’s going to be dealt with.

They only had 13 short years....

The Tories are lacklustre but where in the Labour Party are politicians of the calibre of Tony Blair's cabinet: David Blunkett, Frank Field, Alan Johnson, Mo Mowlam, Jack Straw, Margaret Beckett etc? I can only think of Wes Streeting in the current lot and unfortunately he's of the TWAW variety.

Are you suggesting that the Tories had loads of excellent candidates they could have put up, but put up that stinker instead?

Why?

Far from it. I think they’re having to take whoever they can get now.

But we all know that But Jeremy Corbyn made him do it.

The simple message is that people will vote for the party who will make their life better or at the very least not make it a lot worse as the current lot have done. Anyone who thinks Labour will be any better (spoiler alert they'll be even worse) is deluded. But still no reason to vote for the tories and really resent being called apathetic for not wanting either of them. They both represent noone apart from themselves so why should we vote for them?

Have you considered standing as an MP?

Anyone who thinks Labour will be any better (spoiler alert they'll be even worse) is deluded.

I’m going to vote on the evidence of past experience, the country was in an immeasurably better state from 1997 to 2010 than at any other point in my (very) long life.

(Sigh) that was because the economy was great back then as left by Ken Clarke acknowledged to be one of the best Chancellors. And we didn't have all the cultural problems that we have now or housing or about a hundred other issues which are so much worse thanks to 25 years of the labour tory uniparty shitshow. You are going to be severely disappointed, Labour are going to be even worse than the tories ( yes I know that doesn't seem possible!).

On the subject of housing do you mean that we have a crisis in the distribution of it?

What cultural problems?

Labour are going to be even worse than the tories

Impossible. Utterly and completely impossible.

Open your eyes. There are Jews in London and elsewhere that have to have security at their schools and elsewhere and have been attacked in the street. Don't really want to get into an argument about all the other problems that some are determined to ignore. Suffice it to say there was alot more social cohesion in 90s.