To think the Eurostar should be cheaper than flying?

[ClaudiaWankleman]

I’m looking at £176 for a return flight to Amsterdam versus £246 on the Eurostar. Flight from London City so just as convenient (for me).

AIBU to think that the Eurostar should be cheaper? I remember going to Paris a couple of years before Covid for £120 return which seemed like a decent price. The same journey is presumably much more now.
Given the carbon cost and the number of passengers compared to flying, AIBU to think the Eurostar is very expensive?

Eurostar is so much more civilised than flying. We usually book in advance so it's a lot cheaper too. I wish they would open Ebbsfleet up again.

You are paying for convenience. When you factor in the travel to/from the airport and the waiting required at airports, the train is quicker than the plane. It takes you right from the centre of one city to the centre of the other.

It's the same for train travel in the UK. It's quicker to go by train from London to Glasgow than it is to fly.

It's quicker to go by train from London to Glasgow than it is to fly.

Out of interest, never tried it, but surely if Google is correct with it's claim of a typical rail travel time of 5 hrs 30 there can't be much in it.

(I appreciate a lot depends on how much of a buffer you put in at the departure airport)

Eurostar is a much better experience than flying, so to many people it’s worth any extra cost.

Also, you need to add on any additional travel costs to and from airports at both ends. Eurostar takes you into the heart of the city.

Plus the cost of baggage. A basic EasyJet fare will be for a small cabin bag, but you can take shitloads of baggage on Eurostar, including liquids, and a certain amount of your own booze.

I would never fly somewhere that I could get to by Eurostar, but appreciate I wouldn’t feel like that if I didn’t live in SE.

I also would think you can get cheaper than £246.

We have just booked Eurostar London to Amsterdam and return fare is £233 BUT we have booked the Premium Standard, or whatever it is called, for the outward trip. It would have been much cheaper if we had just gone Standard both ways.

"it's quicker to go by train from London to Glasgow than it is to fly"

It's great when you can get a train that goes direct. My trip I have coming up (Scotland to England) needs two or three changes, but I can get a direct flight - cheaper, easier and quicker. Including the time and cost to and from the airport.

As PPs have pointed out, demand is outstripping supply for Eurostar at the moment. They would love to put more trains on, but due to increased post Brexit passport checks taking way more time, hence passengers having to spend longer in the terminals, they can't fit any more people into the terminal at St Pancras (or Gare du Nord, for that matter). This is hoped to ease as epassport checks start working better (in April we discovered that the epassport gates couldn't do kids yet, so all the families with children had to go and wait in a VERY long queue at GdN 🙄).

That said, you can usually get a better price than that. Booking early helps, as does flexibility around times- but given you're aiming to go to Amsterdam and back in a day, I'm guessing you're looking for specific trains OP 🤔

I'm looking at travel to Amsterdam in the Easter holidays. I actually thought the Eurostar fare of £432 return was relatively reasonable.

Then I priced up rail connections to St Pancras from the city we live in, a couple of hours away. That's an extra £603, taking the total to £1035.

I'd say the cost of the domestic leg of the journey was a bigger issue, rather than Eurostar in particular.

You're right - but flights should be more expensive, and rail travel subsidised. The only cheap fares on Eurostar are at random times

caspergutman
Looks like it might be worth your while checking out the price of a 4 day Interrail pass- 200 odd quid for an adult, less for "youths", FREE for under 12s. Then you just have to pay a Eurostar supplement- 38 euros pp each way for Amsterdam I think. And ALL UK train travel is 100% free!!! The only thing to watch out for is that you have to book your Eurostar reservations nice and early, because they do sell out at popular times.

Early December is definitely Christmas travel time and tickets will be more expensive

If you book ahead and not at busiest times Eurostar is quite reasonable. Personally I don't mind paying more to avoid hours in airports, transport to city centre, packing headaches to comply with baggage rules etc.

But it is a real scandal how expensive trains are here, within the UK as well. They're so much cheaper in other countries. You can't blame people for driving or flying when trains are so expensive.

I can get it for cheaper too, I am sure. But my point is that I compared flights and the Eurostar at the most convenient times to me, and the Eurostar is significantly more expensive. I've compared apples with apples. Flight would have been with KLM, so I would be able to bring a small suitcase in the cabin.

I'm not 100% sure I agree with the experience being nicer on the Eurostar. When I last went to Amsterdam (2017ish) on the Eurostar I seem to remember there was no Wifi available for at least 2 hours because the satellite signal it used was so poor. The flight is only 70 minutes so total time offline would be shorter. It's no different London end (City airport versus St. P) but definitely better Amsterdam side arriving at Centraal over Schipol.

"it's quicker to go by train from London to Glasgow than it is to fly"

Until they cancel the train while you're on it and leave you to rot in Preston 🤣🤣

4h32m from Euston to Glasgow Central. HS2 phase 2 would have cut that to 3h40m which would be genuinely competitive with air, but our helicopter-loving PM has cancelled that. If we were Spanish we'd have already built a high speed line all the way to Glasgow and the journey time would be as little as three hours.

By comparison Easyjet and BA advertise 1h15m (Luton/Stansted), 1h25m (Heathrow) and 1h30m (Gatwick). Obviously you've got to get to/from the airport so we're probably talking an extra 30m at the Glasgow end, an extra 30-60m at the London end depending upon which airport, plus the time to go through security.

Then you need some breathing space - if trains are delayed and you miss a connection you can get on the next train, not so easy by air. I got back into Amsterdam several hours late a little while back (long-distance trains through Germany have been a pain for more than a year). Eurostar staff just rebooked me onto the next train with no fuss at all. Would an airline do that?

Isn't the Eurostar more convenient? I've never used it but I assume you don't have to check in 2 hours before the train leaves, queue up at security or leave your car in a long stay car park that costs a fortune etc. You can just get on the train and go. I'd expect it to be more expensive as it would be a more convenient and more pleasant experience.

It used to be . I had a friend staying with me from the US and was telling him how fab the Eurostar was and how much calmer ...we were literally queuing outside the station, staff yelling, massive queues...they ask that you're there 90 minutes before and there's barely anything past security.

An even more illogical comparison .

Return flights to Dublin from Birmingham are cheaper than return train travel to Oxford .

They both take a similar amount of time, but still ......

There are probably other similar examples . I only know this one as they were journeys that DS and I had undertaken (separately).

Train definitely not quicker than the plane unfortunately.

I'm quite down because I would have loved to do the Eurostar, but it just doesn't make any sense at all.

Some airlines will even sting you for cabin luggage. Eurostar on the other hand permit two large cases, plus a smaller bag absolutely free.

This sounds like a good plan to me!

Not much chance with current govt though

Book well in advance and it can be dead cheap, like 60 quid a return. Shorter check ins, everyone sitting together, and basically infinite baggage (we travel with SO much stuff it’s unbelievable).

They used to run so many more trains but nearly went bust during Covid and assume the recovery has been very tricky.

However, I don’t think the Amsterdam route is at all competitive - not many trains, whereas Paris/ Brussels a more compelling offer.

We found similar a few years ago when we needed to get from Luton to Glasgow. £39 flight that took an hour or £120 train that took all day. No-brainer really.

Another case of prices being hiked due to limited capacity. Again the government have just abandoned the scheme that would have substantially increased capacity between London, the Midlands, and the North.

If you compare only the time spent moving then yes it is a no brainer. But assuming you live in London, its not as simple as that.

Travel to Luton airport- 1 hour
Checkin,security/waiting time at airport - 2 hours
Flight - 1 hour
Travel from GLA to city - 1 hour

You can get on the train at Euston 5mins before it leaves and get off again right in the centre of Glasgow 5 hours later.