Disgusting hospital

[Furyfurious]

I was discharged from hospital this week following surgery and a 5 night stay at an NHS hospital. I am absolutely traumatised. What I have seen and been exposed to was totally shocking. I will definitely be looking for a Private health care policy. The Nurses attitudes, patients attitudes poor (not all ) but a shambles. The smell of the ward, the food etc sorry but there needs to be resolution

🙄

...the staff are fundamentally kind, its not the kind of job you can do if you don't care.

You cannot truly believe that this applies to all HCP, @hollylou?

I hope you are reading the whole thread, including the comments by fellow nurses.

I have witnessed absolutely awful behaviour by some nurses towards patients. I am sure staff/funding shortages exacerbate this, but there are people working in clinical roles in the NHS who are fundamentally unsuited to patient care. Denying or ignoring this is not the answer.

Very good advice. Trouble is when this happens it's usually when you're at your lowest ebb and focussed on surviving. Two years on from my mother's appalling care at a community hospital I still wonder about making a complaint. But mum died - in part due to the fact she appeared to have been forgotten in the corner of a ward - and the trauma of that is still very much with me. we weren't allowed in except for one person once a week because of Covid. yeah right. They just didn't want us on their case.
It was barbaric. No one encouraged her to eat and drink let alone get stronger through physio. And the worst behaviour was from the ward sister who seemed to hold all the power and delight in saying 'no'.
The whole family was traumatised by what happened. I still weep for mum - at her lowest ebb she was forgotten.

I am so sorry, @honeyandfizz . That is heartbreaking

And for you, @explainthistomeplease

It's just appalling. My dad was at a community hospital where he would definitely have been left to rot if we hadn't been able to go in every day. I'm so sorry you and your mum were failed.

The NHS has been chronically underfunded and largely understaffed for many, many years. Many managers that have little to no clue what it's like to work in the departments they run and therefore run them inefficiently.
Staff morale is almost always low so you've done well to see / hear laughing nurses. Staff turnover is high these days with lots of agency cover too.

Sorry you had such a terrible experience though. Contact PALS to feedback but honestly nothing will change sadly.

Getting private health insurance is exactly what the government want you to do. Just remember though, the reason private health insurance is so cheap is because we have the NHS. Insurers won't insure anyone who's likely to need treatment. My FIL had private health insurance his whole fit and healthy life. As soon as he got old and started needing a bit of healthcare, nobody would insure him anymore. I have private health care through work, it's shit. I once tried to claim for an expensive operation, they first made me jump through multiple hoops while they tried to search for any possible way they could get out of paying for it.

The problem with complaining at the time, @LemonPeonies, is that as a relative or patient you are terrified of alienating staff and making things worse.

When my dad was admitted, a nurse made a horrible comment about him being an alcoholic. She said he wouldn't be needing any water as his tastes lay elsewhere. I objected to it as it was just so unprofessional and wrong. I then worried so much that he would get less good care because I had stood up for him, that I went and bought her some flowers and apologised to her. Even though I had done nothing wrong. Absolutely ridiculous but you are desperate not to trigger worse care.

Is that someone who is caring but just overworked, @hollylou?

(I feel like I need to add that dad was in no way disruptive or difficult.)

Hopefully you don't have a pre-existing condition, ever need emergency care or get one of the chronic conditions health insurance doesn't cover.

The NHS can't always be avoided - which is why it is in everone's interest to make sure it is well funded, effective and treats its patients well.

I’m not sure that would help tbh. Most midwives don’t go on to work in the postnatal ward, so asking them to do an extra degree is a bit harsh. But the NHS should definitely be picking up on all these complaints (i also had shocking care after my CS) and be using to provide further training, especially in postnatal ward where many of the complaints come from

Spot on!
Cleaning/ catering was always an entry level job for many from the EU.
However the Senior Sister is responsible for the cleanliness on their ward.
Surprised to hear about the issues.
It's spotless where I work, everything cleaned daily, disposable curtains, commodes tagged Rooms sealed and fogged after an Infectious patient.
However as with all these threads it's the fault of those filthy, gossiping, lazy nurses.
Never mind you will all get what you voted for shortly.
Hope you have plenty of money !

So many varying experiences. I was taken by ambulance to hospital last month and stayed in for five days. The nurses and auxiliary staff were lovely, kind, patient, and the ward lights went out at 10.00pm and I didn't hear a sound from the nurses' station which was just near the door to my ward (four bed ward) during the night. I had to press my buzzer several times in the night for help going to the loo as I was on a drip, and they came in so softly and patiently. The food was actually edible, better than I expected. Clean sheets and pillow cases every morning. So although this is just one person's experience, I would like to point out that not all NHS hospitals are as horrible as the OP suffered.

I used to work as a carer for adults with learning difficulties, some non-verbal. If a client had to go into hospital we went with them and took our own gloves, anti-bac wipes, hand wipes, disinfectant spray. Our manager insisted we wipe down the bed frame, mattress (strip and remake the bed), the bedside cabinet ( inside and out) and the floor around the bed if necessary on arrival and several times daily ( not the mattress) On return home we washed the clients clothes twice, the first wash with half a bottle of Dettol added. Any overnight bag they’d used was left outside and sprayed with disinfectant. This was in the days of MRSA and the manager was paranoid one of the clients would catch it. Some of the hospitals were ok but one was so disgusting ( large bathroom with bedpans containing excrement piled up on the floor) I couldn’t let the client use it. Staff generally were never great with people with LD, not even basic Makaton signing and often said they didn’t know how to look after “patients like that” 🙄
This was in the days of Blair’s government.

Sounds like Treliske in Cornwall!

I believe when the last Labour government handed it over to the Tories satisfaction with the NHS was at an all time high (although people remembered how it had been run down under the Tories before them so that might not say much). I believe it was also widely regarded by the WHO and other such organisation who measure these things as the best, most efficient and cost effective health service in the world. I think it still rates very highly on value for money with these international comparators.

Hopefully you don't have a pre-existing condition, ever need emergency care or get one of the chronic conditions health insurance doesn't cover.

With respect, there's no saying the NHS will 'cover' those things. Not effectively, anyway.

In my case, it was an emergency. I could have died if my 'care' had been left to the NHS. A private hospital saved my life.

Similarly, my husband had a pioneering surgery that wasn't available on the NHS.

So, you were saying...

Chronic underfunding is not why some nurses are evil or borderline evil.

Sorry but private healthcare isn't the panacea some make it out to be. Examples from my husband's stay in a private hospital close to where we live:

(a) no drip stand, so his post-op. drip was left trailing on the floor at the side of his bed. When I queried why with the nurse her reply was "there isn't a stand available" - to which my reply was "well, go and find one"

(b) one of his pillows removed from another patient's use as a 'temporary measure' because they 'couldn't find one' . Eh? Private hospital?

(c) inside of small wardrobe cupboard in his room was filthy, the shelves obviously hadn't been dusted or cleaned for yonks.

My husband's medical insurance was paid for by his company, but we told the company that if they wanted to dispute the final bill, we had evidence of what had occurred. We said that had we been paying ourselves, we would totally have refused to pay the bill ("OK, see you in court - and hope you enjoy the publicity"). Don't get me wrong, we would happily have paid for the consultant's work and that of the anaesthetist, who were first-class, but nursing care? A joke - all you heard them talk about was ordering a takeaway and how many extra shifts they were going to do and the money they would make. I could give other examples, too.

I’ve had and heard horror stories stretching back to the 1980s when lazy and incompetent doctors and nurses left me at death’s door as a teenager. I don’t think it’s changed. I think the problem is that there’s no consistent discipline or care and there are many very hostile people working in hospitals. I kind of understand why they’d become like this but it doesn’t excuse the awful behaviour. Just recently my mum was in emergency care and the No-shit-given attitude was miserable. Two male nurses had an aggressive argument at the foot of her bed, same male nurse lunged towards me aggressively when I accidentally interrupted him as he was inputting something onto the computer. I was being very careful and polite bc I am anyway and also dm and I were both a bit frightened of how things would be after I left. But at least we can get some care and meds without going bankrupt, I just wish they wouldn’t promote willy-waggers over competent people.

I've seen lack of hygiene. Filthy loos, lifts, wards, I'm talking bodily functions and blood in all three. Cleaners are blamed because they're outside contractors. No-one on the wards gets involved because it's not their job to clean up. Don't know what the solution is.

I don’t think people’s real experiences can be dismissed so sweepingly. Also I don’t think you can assume that everybody except you on this thread voted Tory! I know I didn’t and won’t. I’m rather old (50s) and have experienced awful NHS stuff, as well as some good, throughout my life, which includes Tory and Labour governments. I have no idea what the solution is, but it can be cathartic sharing traumatic experiences. That’s not an attack on you. I’m sure most nurses are hardworking and caring but the whole apparatus is riddled with faults.

Of course it "hurts" people to be given inedible, often cold, slop with little nutritional value, particularly when they are unwell already. Not everybody has someone available to bring them food. At the very least hospitals should provide the option for people to pay for decent, appetising meals provided by proper caterers (with exemptions from payment for those in poverty). But this is basic stuff: how can anybody get better in an environment where they are uncomfortable, can't sleep due to excessive noise and lighting, are given disgusting "food", at high risk of infection due to poor hygiene standards, are given medications including pain medication irregularly, are not given the nursing support they need even to access toilets/ showers (when you ring a buzzer often nobody comes for hours, literally) and on top of this treated with contempt, no dignity or kindness and given no privacy (decent hospitals in pretty much every other developed country are now exclusively private rooms. Wards are outdated, unpleasant and increase infection risk as well as hindering patient safety, rest and recovery).

How anybody could find any of the above acceptable, even if it only happens in some hospitals, is beyond me. And we are now spending an equivalent % of GDP on taxes in comparison to the European countries with decent public services. Higher earning PAYE employees in the UK pay some of the highest marginal tax rates in Europe (and, indeed, the world) so we pay Scandinavian levels of taxation for services that would shame most developing countries: rivers and seas full of sewage, some of the most expensive rail fares in the world per mile, roads falling apart, failing energy infrastructure, failing schools with huge classes and dangerous buildings, dirty hospitals and poor standards of medical care and huge treatment delays, some of the lowest state pensions in Europe that don't even reflect contribution levels, some of the lowest levels of welfare support in Europe, hideously expensive childcare with minimal state funding...

I had a stay at the JR, though it was 13 years ago, and they were very good indeed. My one real complaint was that I was still labelled as 'nil by mouth' the morning after my operation so wasn't offered a cup of tea, though I did get given one after explaining.

Im guessing those families wernt told to "get on their bikes and look for work"

I’ve lived in some countries in Europe and visited people in hospitals there. It’s just as awful as here in the places I’ve seen. If you don’t have family to bring you stuff, you can be left lying in blood and excrement.