Disgusting hospital

[Furyfurious]

I was discharged from hospital this week following surgery and a 5 night stay at an NHS hospital. I am absolutely traumatised. What I have seen and been exposed to was totally shocking. I will definitely be looking for a Private health care policy. The Nurses attitudes, patients attitudes poor (not all ) but a shambles. The smell of the ward, the food etc sorry but there needs to be resolution

armchairactivist1 · Today 09:01

@CoffeeCantata why do we hate saying this though? Because we have been conditioned not to criticise the nhs and blame all its woes on the tories?

I know. I have many friends who work in the NHS, and they all say there's much more than funding wrong with it and the problems go back further.

My problems with it have all been unconnected with money - basically the result of not-very-nice people in positions of power. I could list many more awful things which happened to my mum in a local hospital in the NW. We asked staff for help and got the evil eye. My mum then told us about what was in effect bullying because my sister and I had dared to ask about her care. It got so bad that we wanted to go to PALS but she became hysterical, terrified of retaliation from the ward staff.

We did go to PALS, nevertheless (it was unsustainable - she was dying and so unhappy and frightened), but nothing much changed, except that the next time we went to the ward - if looks could kill, we'd both be dead now. A really upsetting experience all round.

All these particular problems were about unkindness and rudeness, as well as neglect (not due to funding cuts, but frankly, an unprofessional culture on the ward - loud gossiping round the nurses' station, discussing how drunk they were last night etc etc) while people went without help drinking, or needed other basic care. It was hard to discover just who was in charge - and they turned out to be just 'part of the gang', so nothing changed. While one of these loud parties was going on, I was sitting with my mum and 2 or 3 of the other elderly patients were begging for water etc. I got up to help them (after alerting the nurses - result: evil eye) and that just made them even more angry with me.

The whole thing was a nightmare.

As I said, I've experienced excellent care at GOSH, the Royal Marsden and the new hospital in St Helens, Lancs (to name a few). But in my local hospital in the SE and the one in the NW where my mum was. I was absolutely shocked at the calibre of people calling themselves nurses.

Thank you to the ward sister who has responded on this thread - if only you had been there for my lovely mum! My friends who are HCPs are all highly motivated and professional - I know it's not everyone.

I think it varies by hospital, to be honest. My DS had his appendix out in 2021 in our local hospital and they were brilliant. Caring, patient staff, the place was spotless, food was good, they were on top of his pain relief. He was on a ward with two people with dementia who were challenging and the staff just took it in their stride and handled it with calm and patience.

The problem is how do you go about addressing the variability, especially in a health service that is understaffed and underfunded as a whole?

Just to note, private insurance doesn't cover pre-existing conditions and, in my experience, tries to wriggle out of paying for anything. Dh's boss had a sports injury and rather than send them to a clinic, they sent a pdf of exercises...Aviva I'm looking at you.

@Fran2023

As far as I can tell nothing has changed and I am actually afraid of being inpatient now. This is a major problem as I have several serious long term and life threatening conditions. My plan for any admission is to take food, drink, wet wipes and have my husband stay with me as long as possible if I am in any way incapacitated. I have made him promise not to leave me on my own if I am unconscious or semi conscious.

I am the same. But I was back 21 years ago when I had our son by C-section. It was awful back then too. I took in my own anti-bac wipes, hand gel, and cleaning spray/cloth, and cleaned the chair, cabinet, call button, TV remote, table, etc - they were disgusting - food/drink stains etc and they felt "sticky" to the touch. Luckily OH was self employed and took time off for the duration I was in the maternity ward - he'd come in at 9am and stay till 9pm, and would bring me drinks and food etc. I'd have hated to be there on my own. The sheer lack of cleanliness and hygiene was awful and there was no way I was eating their food as the crockery and cutlery was also often clearly unclean with remnants of old dried food etc. Doctors, nurses and care assistants were just walking from patient to patient without washing their hands, not wearing gloves, etc. It was like a petri-dish!

On the other hand some patients can be bloody awful - moaning about the food and then getting family to bring in Macdonald's, being rude to staff then complaining that the staff member didn't come the instant they were called. Having large numbers of noisy visitors who left food wrappings and empty coffee cups when they left.
This was the person in the next bed to me was very glad to get home (btw staff were professional, food okay, ward clean)

A student nurse of my acquaintance has explained to me that trained nurses no longer do any basic care. That is all done by the healthcare assistants. If there isn’t an HCA in your bay then you are on your own because the trained staff regard providing care, or food and drink as ‘beneath them’.

That absolutely shouldn't be the case, and it certainly wasn't the case when I worked on the wards for 15 years. The band 7 ( ward manager ) would put an apron on and muck in, with personal care and mealtimes.

OH has treatable but incurable cancer…OH is piggy in the middle of this fiasco, every sodding month!

@Badbadbunny Please copy your post and post it on Care Opinion. This is exactly the sort of difficulty that Trusts need to know about so they can address.

https://www.careopinion.org.uk/

Many of the complaints here are about cleanliness—surely the nurses are not responsible for cleaning the wards and bathrooms? I’m surprised no one has mentioned the high cost of cleaning crews and the effect of the UK’s post brexit situation on the availability of low wage cleaning crews.

I also want to point out that filthy bathrooms and facilities are demeaning for every—patient s and staff alike.

And therein lies the problem... The NHS is lauded as offering the best healthcare in the world. And it should be with all the money taxpayers pay into it every month. Certainly not 'basic'.

The few times myself and my husband have needed treatment, we've had to go private. I would not be without insurance now. Frankly, I would happily pay more towards that than anything into a service I can't use.

It really does, the disparity between Trusts is big and it all makes a difference. I have worked in toxic trusts where management were all self serving, arrogant and didn't give a hoot about patients and staff, the facilities were rubbish and as a result the entire culture was different and there were huge staff shortages. Where I work now the CEO is brilliant, truly values staff, listens to feedback and acts on it, spends time bidding for all sorts of grants/extra funding and takes patient complaints and issues very seriously. As a result we have more staff (proportionately) than even the well regarded on paper well known local hospitals, patient experience is invariably better because there are enough staff and decent facilities etc. I don't just mean having enough medical staff either, but catering, cleaners, admin etc- all vital roles that have a huge impact on the experience too.

Not sure of the answer really as if all Trusts merged invariably I suspect things would be dragged down rather than standards rise. Definitely many many improvements that could be made to improve patient care across the board though. Having one IT system for a start so different settings and trusts can share info and makes it easier to access stuff for patients; fairer pay for staff and more of a focus on retention rather than just spouting about increasing training places; a real zero tolerance towards toxic cultures; managers held to account for their work as we are for ours; centralisation of procurement to ensure saving money by streamlining the admin burden and taking advantage of economies of scale etc; more funding in other services that link in like social care etc.

It also very much depends what you are using, some functions of the NHS are far from basic- some of the surgeons for example are world renowned and work with cutting edge equipment and cutting edge procedures. However that's just a small percentage of the health service.

Agree. When my poor Nan was in hospital I popped in to visit her. She was sleeping. There was a carrier bag (open/no tied up) on her table. Sat down and immediately noticed the smell of poo. The carrier bag had a soiled nappy in it, just a few metres from her face.

I can’t get a referral for my daughters ongoing pain (which keeps her from school) as various healthcare providers play a game of bouncing her case around rather than someone taking ownership. I’ve given up with them. If I could opt out of paying tax for the nhs and just have private instead I would.

in comparison, the cardiology ward I was on last year was fantastic (food still shit).

@Lastchancechica What an ill
unformed comment. Billions pumped in. Post your source. Also culture doesn’t appear out of nowhere. Stop posting inflammatory nonsense and go and read the Francis report about what happened at Mid staffs.

This has been my experience of my local, outer London hospital. The wards have reasonable quality of care, but because of excess tolerance of poor standards and chaos in the Emergency Department, a clique of HCAs, nurses and sisters appear to be trying to squeeze out the competent.
After two days of non-care, I enjoyed a restful night in an emergency bed, medication delivered professionally and on time. In the morning I witnessed one of the clique trying to undermine the competent night staff.
If anyone has a suggestion of how to structure a complaint, I will be grateful - a Chief Nurse suggested that a complaint to PALS would be fairly pointless.

I spent three nights in our local NHS hospital recently, and I really could not praise them highly enough. Brilliant care, wonderful nursing staff, excellent medical staff, everything cleaned regularly by cheerful and polite people. OK, the food was a bit basic, but I managed. The other patients in my 4 bed bay (of a large ward) were a mixed bunch, but we got along OK. All in all, a good experience.

It clearly depends on the hospital.

I would speak to PALS, they talk through the formal complaints process and can offer support. Perhaps CC in your MP they often respond too.

I don't blame her, she's right.

I went in to have DD in 2019 and was the picture of health. Pre op bloods and swabs showed no infections / illness. Within 24 hours of giving birth, whilst still in hospital, I was rushed to HDU with sepsis and iGAS that was only picked up after I insisted DH go and get somebody right away as I felt I was going to die. They came a postpartum hemorrhage.

They were preparing my discharge at the time.

The ward was filthy, a number of nurses couldn't have cared less. When I was crying out in pain (from bloody sepsis) I was told "well of course you're going to be in pain, you've just had a baby"

DH was treat as an inconvenience for approaching the nurses station in HDU and asking a question about my condition.

They refused to tell me I had sepsis until I'd been in there for a week.

Another young woman in for a CS came down with exactly the same. We were both held in side rooms in isolation.

I had infection control on the phone.

It was all just really horrible. I was diagnosed with PTSD shortly after.

you can address and complain to PALS. I personally would so there is documentation of your experience should you wish to take it further in the future. hope you're feeling better now

agree with person above, write to your MP too.

Firstly, thank you for your service.
Things seem to fall down between the demarcation between HCAs and nurses. If a drip has to be attached, restarted or disconnected, otherwise most tasks seem to be left to HCAs (recent week as in-patient.
Frustratingly, I didn't need to be an in-patient, but the inability to see me (with a recurring condition quickly approaching sepsis), give me the long-course, high-dose prescribed oral antibiotics led to drips and admission.
Poor management, shoddy nursing and a refusal to listen to a knowledgeable, returning patient made up the vast majority of the cost of my treatment.

of course a chief nurse would say. after lucy letby, you can see why.
you can go through PALS. i would make a complaint about everything you saw. you never know, you may be saving the competent nurse from work place bullying. the fact that they were open and allowed you to see it just shows how gross some of these cliquey nurses are. everyone knows what we're talking about when we say cliquey nurses too.

I know this will be an unpopular view but personally I think midwives now being direct entry and not requiring a nursing qualification prior to training was a big mistake. Postnatal wards are still largely staffed by midwives of which post op care is only a small part of their training. They work far more autonomously from an early stage of their career than nurses, with lots of the ethos focusing on pregnant women not being poorly and holistic care which whilst I agree with broadly, sometimes things are overlooked or downplayed though a CS is a major operation and any birth carries risks that might not present until the hours or days after birth. This isn't a slight to them, they work hard and are invariably decent at what they do, but whew sadly your story of the obvious being missed isnt wildly uncommon. What would be treated very very seriously on any other recovery ward (not saying mistakes aren't made or that they're perfect) for women it's brushed under the carpet often as an oopsie.

I had a traumatic experience in 2020 (on the ward, in labour they were excellent and saved mine and my daughter's lives).

Experience at a different hospital in 2023 on labour/post natal ward - brilliant. Absolutely wonderful care. And when my son had meningitis at 4 weeks old, they were exemplary. I also had HG so ended up in A&E a couple of times for fluids - always treated with kindness.

Both NHS. IME it depends why you're there. I've seen a lot of time wasters, and medical staff can't help but get compassion fatigue.

Sadly my Dad died in April this year at the hands of the NHS. His care was neglectful and he died as a result of missed opportunities to save him. I have taken it to PALS as an official complaint and it has now become a Significant Incident and is being investigated by the patient safety team. I am a nurse of over 25 years experience and I have been traumatised by what my Dad and my family have been through. Luckily I know the questions to ask and I will make damn well sure those responsible for his death will answer my every question. One of the worst things for me strangely (out of all the horrific things that happened to him) is that he wanted to have his bowels open and he asked for 3 days, despite being very confused due to sepsis and died without having been to the toilet - this to me is the basics of care and it was woefully lacking. I feel so let down by the organisation I have worked for for so long.

Agree with everyone about massive differences between hospitals and even between wards within the same hospital. There are some brilliant nurses and some diabolical ones. Unfortunately, the vulnerability of patients can bring out both empathy and bullying depending on management, ward culture and individual personalities.

Everone with a bad experience: complain, complain, complain - PALS, Hospital Trust, Nursing and Midwifery Council, local paper, social media....

Everyone with a good experience: write a thank you letter, it will be appreciated.

More NHS (and Social Care) money and openess to immigration will help staffing levels. That should determine how you vote. Be prepared to pay the tax it will take if you are a high/middle income earner.

Agree with avoiding hospitals if you can (and get out as fast as you can).

Op- I'm sorry you had such a bad experience. I wish you all the best with your recovery.