Should families get a tax allowance for dependant children

[Clariee45]

Just a thought from another thread about there being no help for the squeezed middle who feel they are hardly better off than those on universal credit. Wouldn’t it just be fairer if those families not entitled to universal credit were given an extra tax allowance equivalent to the adult personal allowance for each child.
Why are adults given a tax allowance that acknowledges the basic costs of needing to eat and have a roof over there head etc and yet parents are expected to provide all this (plus 80% childcare costs) for their children completely out of their taxed income

If you want to start taxing people for staying at home, you can't stop at mothers. Part timers, early retirees? Taking choices away from women is they very last thing we should be doing.

@bopbey I'm 1 of 4 siblings so it depends on your circle. From what I've heard people say it's been a deterrent the benefit cap though and I think its a good thing. I'm a single parent myself, not high flying or anywhere near. I just feel that it's very easy to become reliant on benefits not CB as such but things like UC

Everyone is entitled their opinion aren't they?

We have a slightly weird system where looking after your own children is not counted towards GDP whereas a nanny doing the same job is added to GDP.

@Uggtrending I'm not talking about my circle though I'm talking statistically. I'm one of 3 but I'm not a child anymore so what happened in the 80s isn't reflective of today.

"There are estimated to be around around 3.56 million one-child families in the United Kingdom as of 2022, with a further 3.4 million two-child families, and 1.25 million families that have three or more children."

The vast majority of families now don't have 3 plus dc

no just a tax allowance to take account of the fact children need to eat, have shelter, be clothes etc, bring allowed to keep 2.5k a year more per child of the money they have earned would hardly pay for a month in private school, not to mention to ++>£2.5k a parent will be spending on the absolute basics anyway. This is money the parents have earned themselves, not money being taken from you

I totally disagree with the idea of the tax system supporting a family having a SAHP. This is a huge luxury - not that I begrude those families that can afford it, but having a SAHP is equivalent to being able to do without the £30kpa-ish (or more) that a capable adult could earn, and instead have a full time person to provide a full household management service. Totally fine for families to choose that but not subsidised by the tax payer.

Yes yes to a higher tax allowance for single parents though.

but don't think it's appropriate to boost the personal tax-free allowance amount - child-benefit already does pretty much exactly this with an amount that's basically equivalent to boosting the allowance by about £4500 per child, it's just structured so that those who aren't earning get it too because punishing kids for their parents not being in work isn't something a civilised society does.

@anniegun because a Nanny is in paid employment and a sahp is not

Everyone is entitled their opinion aren't they?

I'm was just interested in why you had that opinion hence the question.

Happens in the USA, but of course it benefits better off families as low income families don't reach that threshold

Which is what the OP wants.

I'm so sorry for your situation but you are definitely right in your thinking. The people who think this is a good idea haven't thought about where the money is going to come from.
There are so many things that need to be considered, when do we stop paying for other people's children? After full time education? What about children with disabilities? There'll be suggestions we take it from pensioners next because we're all living too long.

@bopbey OK that's fine. I gave my opinion just like you. When you said CB is 90% that's still high I don't see why it must be 100%. Its a form of benefit and not everyone is entitled.

It's like the free school meals rule you could go on and on with various things. I mean where would it end?

no just a tax allowance to take account of the fact children need to eat, have shelter, be clothes etc, bring allowed to keep 2.5k a year more per child of the money they have earned would hardly pay for a month in private school, not to mention to ++>£2.5k a parent will be spending on the absolute basics anyway. This is money the parents have earned themselves, not money being taken from you

Adult personal allowance is 12.5k not 2.5k, and you specifically said equivalent to the adult tax allowance in your OP. And it takes away from everyone because lots of parents would no longer pay any tax at all if they had several children.

Because they would not live very long in old age without other peoples children propping up the economy , caring for them in hospital or nursing care

So how many parents on this thread will be encouraging their children to
a. work in the NHS.
b. to become a care worker in a nursing home
c. to become a mobile carer caring for the elderly/disabled in their own homes.

I"ll wait.

💯

The parents skipping meals extends beyond those on UC, yes.

A huge number of households are unable to manage their expenses. The cost of living crisis is affecting working age people very badly, obviously those with children have higher outgoings. The additional income (e.g. child benefit) doesn't cover the additional costs.

These are just the economic realities of where the UK is currently.

@Uggtrending as I said not all of the 90% who claim will be eligible. I just think the rule for joint vs family income is silly, the income tax bands are too low & the fact its equivalent was universal. Primary pupils in London already get free school meals regardless of income.

Oh Jennifer, didn't you know that no-one has children for their own selfish reasons, people only have them to benefit society

We don’t have enough babies being born. We as a country could look at why the birth rate is falling, is it just a post covid blip or a long term trend? Does it need fixing?

there’s some commentators already saying it needs fixing, so this is one way to use the tax system to nudge people to have that 2nd or 3rd baby. Make it a bit less painful to add another child.

guess it would come down to which sections of society are not having babies, is it across the board or are the richer or poorer more likely to have no or only 1 child?

OP - is this only for people not in receipt of UC or everyone with a child?

No issue at all with child benefit being a universal entitlement. The government managed to set up a system for supermarket vouchers during the various lockdowns and school holidays, so the admin can't be that complex.

But I'm childless, not through choice. I would absolutely not ever be in favour of being financially penalised because my body doesn't work properly. I'd go self employed and utilise every tax avoidance scheme possible if that were the case.

@bopbey ahh really well you've taught me something. That's not the case up North you pay for school dinners so that's a HUGE saving of approx £120 per month based on 2 kids. I had no idea at all about that! So thanks. The point is though everything can't be the same and there is a cut off point/limit to things.

oh goodie yet another thread adovating for parents to have better tax rules and keep more money Never ever see anyone advocating for single childless/ childfree people to get better tax breaks or help - just fucking squeeze us for all our money why don't you. 🙄

Isn't it enough we pay enough taxes to fund things like schools etc. oh no you want more....

Nope.

Why should child free people pay full whack and people with kids get extra money?

Take responsibility for your own life choices!

I have kids but I remember being single and child free and really struggling while a junior colleague with three kids got everything topped up and was 'earning' way more than me when I managed her because of that. Sick of single or people without kids getting the shitty end of the stick.

@JenniferBooth - lots of people encourage children into medicine and nursing.

bur a bigger issue is if you are planning on a state pension being part of your own retirement plan, you need young people working.