To think the National Trust should not let Park Run volunteers marshal the cars at a NT property

[ParkRunIdiots]

So rocked up a very large NT property with lots of parkland at about 9:25 today.

had gone through the payment control bit, then you drive for about another mile (no joke) to the car park. Just before the car park all traffic stopped in a traffic jam caused by two Park Run people in pink vests who would not let any cars through.

So I sat there and say there and sat there, not a single car moved through. I could see the runners approaching from the right, at times there were gaps in the runners but still no car was allowed through. After ten minutes still no car had been allowed to pass. Several cars behind me did a 20 point turn and left.

Then I realised that the runners weren’t even crossing the road as I’d originally assumed, they turned right and ran alongside the road edge, which has a massive Green verge they could run on . So in my mind no need to stop any car. Or if some risk assessment has deemed it too dangerous to have the cars beside the runners then it means there’s no access to the car park for about 45 mins, in which case the NT property needs to open later!

the runners were all strung out, no big wide bunch/crowd, so single file or in pairs.

anyway I honked at this point. One pink vest guy had obviously been waiting for this moment and charged up, ran past me and bollocked the car behind me who was mid 20 point turn and leaving. That driver grassed me up so the park run guy came and condescendingly told me “when there’s a gap” we will let a car through. I said it was ridiculous, that there had been plenty of gaps, nobody had been allowed through and the runners weren’t even on the road!

At which point he told me if I didn’t like it I could leave!

then the other marshal let some of us through, even though there were still runners running alongside the verge the same as there had been for the last ten minutes! I think they were letting cars through in groups of 5 or 6 as some had gone through just before I got stopped. Again when there were runners there! So nothing to do with gaps!

diagram for an idea.

I do feel like emailing the NT and telling them they need to have an NT person there overseeing it, and preventing the Parkrun people been rude to other users.

I may be slightly anti park run after my (on lead, walking to heel) dog was trampled on and tripped over by several park runners on the inaugural run of my local new park run on a narrow public bridleway and they shouted at me for been there with a dog (even though I’d stepped into the mud at the side). Still not forgiven them for that.

Yes, that's an option.

But in the interests of research, I'll go along Clumber Lane and through the crossroads and see what's what. Weather permitting, I'll go round the Lake on my bike and visit the coffee stand near Hardwick if it's there.

I do think though that the NT is somewhat shooting itself in the foot effectively closing the car park closest to the money-makers though. I cannot remember how people get to the shop and café from the Event field/now Main Car Park, so that's of interest as well.

@MasterBeth

true while people keeping fit is good.
these runs are too big and park run while successful for those who do it is becoming a huge pain everywhere.

its not the idea it’s the entitled runners thinking that because it is organised it’s ok.

what we other did organised brick stacking. To block there path and then took it down.

thats exercise too.

the honest truth is it need to be groups of mix 30 people then it’s never an issue.

I meant what if
when will mums net give an edit function!

Well you lot inspired me to go to Clumber today. I went in the back way because the walk I wanted is on the far side of Limetree Avenue over near the golf course. There is no way that if I'd been in an official carpark (I was too late anyway) that I'd have been able to reach there - they seem to be trying to keep large parts of the park available only to the special, very fit, few. I appreciate that they need to look after the trees but they way they are doing so make visitors feel very unwanted.

I know this isn't the point of the thread but it is a symptom of the same thing - National Trust properties only being available to the ones deemed pure. They are having massive internal rows at the moment and isolating a lot of good volunteers.

If you are on the website press the three dots at the top of your post - you have about 10 minutes after posting in which you can edit. I don't know if it's available on the app.

@Binglebong did you get a note under your windscreen wiper for not using a carpark ? I have quite the collection 😁

Agreed @Binglebong - hope you had a nice walk; I can't say I'm familiar with where you went (so I obviously don't know every square acre, as I thought....) - since the DHL site was created, I haven't gone much along that side.

Yes, there is a sense that they are wanting to discourage people (and volunteers as well? I hadn't heard about that), certainly from Clumber, which is as much as I know.

I have been far far over the other side - and ended up alongside the gallops for the racing yard at Carburton., that was a long pedal. But the size of accessible areas is definitely reducing, and even as inaccessibility (e.g. parking) is increasing.

Btw can you still access the park via Trumans Lodge or is that gated off now?

A volunteer did tell me last year the NT we’re looking at building a car park off the north side of Limetree Ave for people who want to be that side of the park.

This was after he (politely) ticked me off for parking on Limetree Ave and I politely explained I wasn’t trying to dodge the entry fee but I just want to be that end of the park and I can’t walk there from the visitor centre. He said he understood that, that not everyone cares about shops and cafes, etc.

I see no sign of that happening and to be honest I understand if it doesn’t if they think wildlife is flourishing more there due to not many people being that side. Because of course if a car park is built maybe it would get busier. Saying that I still think 95% of visitors would want to park near the cafe and walk round the lake and not bother with anything else.

Truman's Lodge is the one off the road to Carburton isn't it? (Clumber Lane).

That was open last time I went, and is the way I intend to go tomorrow.
The new Lodges are alongside, so I can't imagine they would close it.

Yes, that’s the one. Thanks.

I know where to park to hide! 😁

Please see attached map:

For those who don't know, Limetree Avenue (drunk red dots) is where most people park and then get told off. It's nearly 2 miles long to give a sense of scale. They have now erected lots of wooden bollards (they don't need to be spaced so close together- wasteful!) to stop people parking on there. The purple cross is where the car park is so if you want to be the far side of Limetree Avenue it's a long walk.
The blue circle is where I parked (the side road next to the gatehouse has a little layby where you can still park) - if you want to explore that end it is way too far to walk from the carpark. Beware the gates are sometimes locked so you may need to go the longer way round.

The side roads are a whole other matter - they were closed to put people off going in early lockdown (with signs to that effect) but somehow never reopened....

With regard to war on volunteers I couldn't find any good, accessible (for free) articles. This one is biased but at least admits it! Open in private tab to read for free. https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-has-the-national-trust-just-started-a-war-with-its-members/

To keep its houses open to the public, meanwhile, it is heavily reliant on the many volunteers who give their time unpaid. But the treatment of volunteers is another sore point.
Selling the past: the shop at Stourhead, Wiltshire CREDIT: Alamy“When I started, seven years ago, the volunteers were shown appreciation by the staff at the property,” says Nigel Plimmer, a volunteer at Shugborough. “We used to have a summer barbecue, with free food, and a Christmas meal. Both of these have ceased.” Of more concern, he says, is the “obvious reluctance” to pay volunteer expenses – for travel between someone’s home and the Trust property, and the like. “I claim my expenses approximately every six weeks and they are always £100-plus. When I started, they used to be approved within a couple of days. Over the past year, it has averaged three weeks, and twice it was more than four. This from one of the wealthiest charities in the country.”
Volunteer staff of many years’ standing, meanwhile, tell of their despair at the imposition of “convoluted, patronising and largely irrelevant (for volunteers) ‘mandatory learning’, which covers topics such as diversity training and institutional racism”, as Anne-Marie Jordan, who spent a decade volunteering at Ightham Mote, in Kent, puts it. Jordan gave up volunteering last November, after the Trust enforced the training, threatening those who refused with dismissal. “There was no common sense to it,” she says. “It was all politically correct – typical of HR these days. They seem to forget the current serious shortage of volunteers.”

This is from a much better article but it's behind a paywall. www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/09/24/national-trust-crisis-dusty-houses-no-volunteers/

@Binglebong Wow - that's all very interesting - and depressing - to read.

I have been to Clumber, and there have been some/even more rather depressing changes; one of which is altering the route to the Shop, and not even signposting it very well, so it and other little businesses in the "Laundry Yard" are losing footfall by over 50%! Added to the change in the parking arrangements, and this really is a shooting themselves in the foot moment (the car park only changed this summer, so it's forgivable that no-one is really fully clear on it, if they haven't been for a while).

So - @ParkRunIdiots - I am actually a little bit more confused about where you were when you were prevented from passing through. I have established visually the barrier/signpost towards Accessible parking (and confirmed that no Blue Badge required, and generally, no-one (wo)manning it. Maybe that only happens for the PR .....
....however, I have now been told that the PR Parking is on what they call "The Pastures" [and is also, even today, marked Visitor Parking but with a pair of closed gates] and not the event field/previously overspill. So, straight after the Paypoint, the left turn (eventually to Hardwick) is for PR parking, and then a Right. (I think it used to have yurts on it or something). A footpath goes through from there to the Start etc near the Cricket Ground and Bark Café.

SO, while this may partially solve the PR parking question (that only I had I believe), the route of the Parkrun , and therefore people o foot, possibly assuming some kind of priority, will surely meet up with vehicles heading into the now "Main" car park (field) - which by the way has a very bumpy un-user-friendly first 50 yards, and I cannot imagine how bad this field will be in wet weather!

I think this spot will be the road to the car park, and also the PR route, does it look like where you got snarled up @ParkRunIdiots ?

And before anyone tells me I have too much time on my hands, I had a lovely ride around the lake! Trip down Memory Lane 😍🤗😢

You are impressively energetic! I've given up trying to work out the locations as it is very rare I am that side of Limetree Avenue - only really if I want to go round the lake and my dog and I struggles a bit with it these days.

Sorry for hijacking your thread OP but it does all see to be connected - nonsensical decisions that pissoff their core supporters and volunteers, leading to less experienced people being in a position they are not ready for.

Edited for typo.

Haha - thank you @Binglebong - and, even though it looks like it, the bike is not electric; all pedal-powered!
Again, yeeears, ago, I would take my mother's dog for a walk around the route I took today (alongside the event field/car park); he would bob up and down through the ferns that are long gone, giving me an occasional sighting of his floppy face. We would do the whole lake, but I would probably not do it on foot now, so you are better than I am.

(He was an actual Clumber Spaniel, a breed brought back from the brink of extinction. My mother was very proud of him.)

Hmm, yes - the guy I was talking to today (about Riding passes) at the Membership "shed" said that the new route that goes through where the Offices were (now the Lincoln Courtyard) was made possible by moving the staff car park to the main (now accessible) car park, as there are fewer staff*. He had been an employee for years then left and is now a volunteer.
(*He couldn't get anyone on the phone to answer the query I had.)

Ooh I like Clumber spaniels- they look so solid as if they could go through ANYTHING. My boy liking being off lead is why I tend to be on the other side (if I can find anywhere that has not been extensively logged!) as round the house dogs are, quite rightly, on lead only. Plus the geese are terrifying and would eat him given the chance.

I'm not saying how long it takes me to get round the lake....

@LighthouseTheme hope you enjoyed your visit. Yes that photo is the area of conflict so I was stopped just prior to it but from the other direction as the verge was on the right.

So lovely wide verge which people were running down, nobody on the track. Even a rope separating the two. But still no cars allowed through 🤷🏻‍♀️

Omg the geese. As a child my parents used to make me help out at the annual goose round up. Every single Canada goose was caught by hand and individually weighed. Not sure if they still do that but I have photos of me from about the age of 8 with a goose tucked under my arm!

Hm, right - yes, all roped off, and a nice wide verge. Yes, I thought you would be coming from the opposite direction.
But, I suppose the conflict will keep happening as the people try to (are forced to) park up that way.

Geese! Better than guard dogs I've found... The geese were probably near to the size of the - brave - 8 year old you.
Great to deter people from walking down by the lake - green poop in the treads of shoes. Yuk!

You were a lot braver than me! I wouldn't go near geese- Google the inside of their mouths if you want nightmares.

Separated with a rope and they still wouldn't let you drive. It's gone from ridiculous to full on farcical. Did you contact NT and Parkrun officials (hopefully with a screen shot of the race director's post)?

I emailed NT. I have had a letter apologising about my experience and that they have forwarded my email to Clumber for a more detailed response.

I am not bothering with ParkRun as I think they have clearly demonstrated their attitude.

I suspect the race director will already have contacted Clumber and got their “side” of the story in. I suspect I will be painted as an uppity, rude old woman who had no patience and wanted to mow people down. So I am not holding my breath to be honest.