How much should a 9 year old practice music?

[Switcher]

We are constantly nagging our DS9 (nearly 10) to practice his violin. He eventually does 10 minutes the day before his lesson after we've nagged him all week. It's just so tedious and I've now told him straight out that he's free to stop lessons at any time, but he's not free to have lessons and not practice. He's stormed off in a huff with his violin flung on the sofa. He has spent two years learning and isn't remotely ready for grade 1. I don't mind the grades per se, but he just doesn't seem interested and is making no progress. What's reasonable here??

What does the teacher say ?

Does he actually have any interest in playing the violin? It seems pointless to push it if not.

It depends. At 9 one of my dc was preparing for grade 1 and did 10 minutes a day. Another was at vocational school preparing for grade 6 and did over an hour. Even the very musical child had a bit of a wobble with practice around this age - maturity hit in Y7 and he’s been fine with practice ever since, but it was fairly normal for the younger kids at his school to sometimes lark around during practice time.

I'd speak to the teacher.

My son took up trumpet aged 9 and is now working towards grade 5 (he's just started in Y8). He practices three times a week for 20 minutes. He can be a pain to motivate to go and practice but once he starts he does well.

He also plays in two bands so I guess that's another 2 hours practice a week.

10 minutes a day, but it needs to be structured and supported. There’s no point in telling them to ‘practice’, you need to be with them (or nearby) giving praise and feedback.
Set a routine for each practice so he knows what to do. Warm up by playing a favourite or easy tune or two, then maybe scales or finger exercises, then a bit of work on whatever tune he’s learning. Get a stand and leave the violin out so he doesn’t need to unpack/pack away each time.

Ten-fifteen minutes a day I’d say, maybe 5 days a week. A short practise consistently is better than nothing. So a scale and then a piece or two. Concentrating on a few bars etc.

Can it be the first thing he does after coming home from school . Does he do something like play computer games? So say violin practise first , then homework and then computer game .
it just needs to be something he does.

When my kids were younger they had star charts and after a certain number of stars there would be a treat, or I think I may have tied it to pocket money.
Violin practise just became something they did without really questioning - so just part of their day. It is harder at the beginning with getting into practise but I think it does get easier.

If he's not interested in learning more why pursue it and in your words nag? Ask if he wants to give it up.

With my DDs, I make instrument practice about goals and quality rather than time.
So ...
Choose 3 scales and play them 3 times each
Play the piece(s) set by the teacher 3x each
Choose something fun/you like to play and play that 2x

That often adds up to about 20 - 30 min.

It is tedious making them practise but, back in the day, someone did that for me and I am really grateful now to be a competent musician. I don't play regularly but that skill is there for me and I use it pretty frequently.

You know- if one of mine had been having regular lessons for 2 years and wasn't remotely ready for grade 1 even with minimal practice, I'd be wondering about the teacher.

My dd started the violin in Year 2 or 3 (can’t remember). She quit in Year 6 after grade 3 as I said I would not remind but not nag her to practice and if she didn’t I would simply stop the lessons.

The violin is hard, it requires commitment as progress can be slow. I hated practicing as I have a good ear and I could hear how bad I sounded.

I switched from violin to flute age 10 and it was so easy! I got to grade 8 in 5 years and was in so many bands and orchestras- absolutely loved it, I practiced because I wanted to. I still play for fun and it’s been a source of lifelong joy, cheesy as it sounds.

i do think it’s often a case of finding the right instrument. Maybe try listening to some music on YouTube and see if something else catches his fancy? (I did campaign for a harp for a while, so feel free to wait out the ridiculous suggestions!)

Oh but I never answered your question. Leading up to grade 1 violin id say 10 mins 3 or 4 times a week (don’t actually time it though!) let them stop if they only do two mins. Try letting him play in the bathroom, the echoey acoustic might be nice!

I can only answer from my own experience as a child and seperately as an adult learner.

I started learning to play piano at around age 10. My dad insisted on 1/2 hour practice/night and sometimes I hated doing it and had tantrums. But mostly I did it, with varying degrees of grace. As I got better I wanted to practice, and by the time I did grade 8, I was playing up to 2 hours/day.

I am now learning clarinet and I practice for up to an hour/day.

If your son is really, really reluctant to practice then of course he's never going to progress. Doing exams is not the be-all and end-all (I did them for piano as a child, and I am adamant I am not going to do them with my clarinet now! There's no need!) But both you and he would feel you were getting somewhere if his playing ability was improving so that he could tackle pieces that he enjoyed. (I'm presuming that being stuck at pre-grade 1 for this length of time means that he's stuck doing 3 blind mice or similar?)

Playing music is not compulsory. If he's not enjoying it, then let him find something else that he does enjoy. I would take such marked reluctance to practice as being indicative of his not really wanting to learn. But if he wants to make music, maybe he'd enjoy a different instrument more? Or maybe he would be better moving away from traditional instruments and looking more at music on the computer? (mixing etc).

Ten minutes a day is usually the advice

Our piano teacher expects them to practice five times a week, it's very structured with set tasks and days to fill in. If they do five a day they get a sticker, if they get six stickers they get a chocolate bar. Good motivation!

At that level I’d say 10minutes a few times a week is enough but he’ll probably need you to supervise. I agree with the PP who said scales or exercise 3x through (maybe twice with the music and once from memory) and then a piece of music. Can you read music to help him? It’s not an easy instrument and basic pieces of music can be as dull as anything but once you get to about grade 3 and can join junior orchestras etc the rewards are much better!

DD is 6 (year 2) and has been learning piano for a year. She practices 5 or 6 times a week, about 15 - 20 mins each time. What definitely helps is being clear each time about the objective. E.g. today we're practising a piece we've been doing for a few days, she knows the notes, so we are going to focus on making the chord changes smoother. Tomorrow we will work on dynamics for the piece. Having some musical knowledge definitely helps.

I had to do 15-20 minutes of practise a day at that age. I did my grade one when I was 10.

I'd say 10 minutes a day 5 days a week is the minimum if they are interested in doing it.
Especially with the violin, as it's harder at the beginning, then they need to do that really.

Thanks, some good suggestions. I've already told him he can give up but he insists that he wants his 1:1 lessons. I can't actually implement any strategies to help him practice as I work full time and my DH is in charge of the kids. Which in his world is an endless succession of instructions. But the real issue is that I think I'm projecting. I loved music and nobody ever had to get me to practice. I took up the violin at 16 and did my grade 6 before I left school, because it was the only thing I did. So I lack perspective on this issue!

If you can play yourself I really think you need to find a bit of time to help and play with him. I’m seriously rusty at the
violin but have played with my friend’s kids when they were learning (even on tiny
violins) and she always said how much better they responded than her just telling them they needed to practice!

Violin teacher here. Enlist them. Explain he isn't keen to practise or perhaps isn't sure how.

I happily set out a practice chart WITH my students. I ask them realistically how many times a week they can practice for 10-15 minutes. Then usually subtract a day or two, as they'll work out they COULD practise every day and tell me that, but I know that that's not going to happen, especially if they're only doing once or never at the moment!

Then I put a chart together with what days they've agreed to practise, and I write down the points I'd like them to practise on each day. So might be D major scale, and first two lines of piece X, making sure the bowing is correct, and a tune of your choice.

I try and make the targets small and easily achievable, and end with something they find fun. Practising scales to silly rhythms often works for example as they like making up sentences to play and don't really realise they're practising their scales at the same time!

I also include a section which says 'what I think went well' and 'what frustrated or challenged me' for the student to fill out each time, because actually they often forget what they've found tricky during the week and it means my lesson can be more focused to support them with that. It's also really important for them to recognise what went well- and really small stuff counts. 'I managed to play bar 1 perfectly' is GREAT. They need to be able to identify what is improving to feel the practise is worth doing.

Other techniques; find somewhere in the house where the violin can sit undisturbed but with the case open and with the instrument ready to play. A closed case or an instrument tucked away is a surprisingly big barrier for some children, and you might be surprised at how often he just picks it up to have a go at something during the week if it's just there looking at him.

I often ask them to compose their own little tunes to play to me, or to work out something by ear. Christmas coming up is a super time for this; can you work out how to play the chorus of Jingle Bells? It starts on an F#. They really get a sense of achievement from this!

And finally, I ALWAYS tell my students' parents that I don't want playing or practising to be a battleground at home- you have enough to do with homework etc. Set a time and remind them, yes of course. But argue with them about it? Nope. It's my job to give them the tools and the enthusiasm to WANT to practise. A forced practice with an unwilling child isn't going to gain much anyway.

Good luck!

Enlist the teacher that is!

About 10 mins per grade every day is good. I guess at the higher grades they have band/ orchestra practice, so that contributes to the total of 1hr20 at grade 8.

If they're not practicing regularly, the lack of progress will be very demotivating and they will build up a resistance to the instrument.

I found that I had to enforce practice in the early years, but when they discovered that they were getting pretty good, they drove themselves.

100% agree with this, I used to play - nearly 30 years ago, but I am part and parcel of violin practice. My daughter (9) will do it when I am not here but she is much happier when I am helping, and giving her feedback - it is a real careful balance as too much and she takes it as criticism but does like my input.

The violin is really hard to learn, it takes patience and time, my youngest has just started the flute and has progressed much quicker - more so than just an aptitude.

We have lots of arguments but once she gets going she stops counting the time.

Make time to help him focus, learn to practice - that is a skill in itself, encourage him. My daughter will 'saw' through her pieces, I have had to teach her to break them down, bar at a time etc.

@Switcher
At primary school my daughter's clarinet teacher suggested 10 mins a day Mon -fri. Weekend off.

She said that lots of kids are put off music by the insistence on 30 mins every day.

Btw my daughter got to Grade 8 😀