To think compressed hours works out as less than FT hours?

[moana5]

Some people at my work do compressed hours, so they do 5 days in 4 and have Fridays off (so they work 8-6 rather than 9-5 or thereabouts).

There are A LOT of meetings in my job, but etiquette states these would usually be between 9:30-4:30. So in effect, people who work compressed days are getting out of a whole day of meetings, as they won't have meetings during their longer hours.

I've also found they log in and out to the minute of their hours, whereas those who work Monday - Friday generally login at 8:45 and log off at about 5:15. I really doubt they are 'full on' working that whole time to make up for a whole day off every week.

It's become a pain to me personally because my colleague has to offload lots of things to me because she doesn't work Fridays and she is now complaining about her workload as she has to compress all meetings into 4 days. I also have to attend her Friday meetings that require attendance as she can't go.

AIBU to think compressed hours are actually working less hours? Preparing to be flamed!

And I can't do compressed hours in my role but even if I could, I'm not sure I would do it.

Logging on/off to the minute is nothing to do with compressed hours. Plenty of people who work FT do this. It’s to do with how much you care about work / are willing to work ‘unpaid’ time.

In my job, there are no set hours. I have logged on at 7:45 for 8am meetings and worked past 11pm to get something over the line. I am compensated for this though. If I were on NMW, I would probably be logging off at 5pm on the dot.

I work 5 into 4 and it's knackering. I'm in a managerial role in financial services and my diary is crammed.

I have questioned whether to move to 5 shorter days. Barely any meetings on a Friday and all the 'fun' happens eg departmental quizzes etc. I'd welcome the slower pace and time to do some concentrated work. One I'm thinking about.

Oh, and I also have kids and all the life admin on a Friday too! 😩

No...

If you choose to work longer than you are contracted to, that's your choice, you can't expect that other people discount those hours from their compressed schedule because you choose to extend your working day for free.

People like you are why employers think they can expect their pound of flesh from everybody.

the meetings are to discuss the output required.

So, as with most meetings, this could actually be an email.

It's actually the opposite.

The problem is in the culture of overworking and you seem to be a believer in it because it's the done thing. It's changed though.

I started off like you but once I got to my position now, I've had my priorities right. It's about efficiency. The amount of meetings you're describing is inefficient management. Extra hours are the legacy of office presenteeism now replaced by a green dot on Teams in remote jobs. If you still have to work over and above without office distractions then your company is completely inefficient (or you are, or both). That's the reality.

The markets you are referring to are actually often not eligible for compressed hrs precisely due to established shift patterns and in-person cover required. Flexibility in existing shifts is not the same concept as compressed hrs at all, you're confusing things.

Compressed works well in an office environment for individuals who are good planners and leave no or very little of their own work to be looked after on days they are not in. This usually means you're more senior. Nobody needs to work 5 days, it's proven by now that actually working 4 days is just as efficient or more (and that's 4 days not even compressed). I think you need to get yourself out of your skewed perception of what efficient work is, you've been conditioned to believe this. I say this as a senior person within the sector traditionally expecting you to work extra like you've described. It's utter nonsense.

This, with bells on. Longer days are very tough and leave less personal time before and after work, and yes there is extra 'invisible' managerial work that I also fit in outside my hours. I'm working on that too, to minimise this.

Like you, jollier office Fridays with not much happening used to wind me up and I've decided I'd rather push myself and work longer for 4 days and have 1 full day with DC. That 1 day is in fact more exhausting than work, but I do enjoy my time with him and save on childcare for now too. I too had thoughts about 5 days vs 4 but it absolutely is the reality that in most jobs people working 5 days are either poorly managed and/or they piss about for what adds up to nearly a full day of work throughout the week and I begrudge that after years of watching this. They are usually those moaning about how they 'work extra but others log off on time' 😄.

What I have found is that people who do compressed hours, and work, say 8 - 6 then expect people who don't work compressed hours to be around and available between the same hours, and it makes you look bad if you finish at five or thereabouts and decline a meeting or whatever, so you end up doing longer hours but without any extra days off in the week.

Then if you are trying to schedule something, or generally get something done that needs other people, you come up against loads of 'non working days'.

I think that unless a role needs shifts to cover extended hours, everyone should work broadly the same hours and days unless they are actually part-time or job-share.

my colleague has to offload lots of things to me because she doesn't work Fridays and she is now complaining about her workload as she has to compress all meetings into 4 days. I also have to attend her Friday meetings that require attendance as she can't go.

This too, you end up taking work from other people and it's never reciprocated.

Agree!!!

@PurplePansy05 agree!

If she doesn't work Fridays, why are people scheduling meetings that should include her during her non working time?

If you make additional effort that's up to you. It isn't required. It's not the early nougties when working extra hours was the norm and to be expected.

When people post things like this though I do wonder what sort of job they have.

Sometimes it's not about working extra hours because the employers want more than their pound of flesh; it's because some kind of shit has hit the fan and someone has got to sort things out and maybe you are the only, or the best placed person who can.

When the air traffic control systems crashed at the August Bank Holiday, do you suppose the people in the IT department were saying "Well I am not meant to be working this weekend and am not due back until 9am Tuesday so it will just have to wait and I will look at it then?"

OK, extreme example and I have never worked on anything with quite that pressure. But sometimes things go wrong and you really would not be doing your job if you just logged off and went home at 5pm.

Even if it's not an immediate crisis sometimes there can be understandable pressure to work extra. E.g. A piece of work you or your team have committed to deliver then circumstances beyond anyone's control delay it or cause it to be more complex than expected.

I would imagine that the majority don't work for air traffic control or aren't heart surgeons. There will always be exceptions to the rule, that type of profession is it.

Generally, people who do 'normal' office type work aren't on the precipice of earth shattering decisions come 4.55pm.

I had a (micro)manager who would insist that she was the only person who could do all of the things she did which is why she was working her fingers to the bone and it was utter nonsense, she just didn't want to delegate because of her inflated sense of self importance, which seems to be a recurring theme with managers.

You may be right, OP, but that's not the fault of the people doing compressed hours.

Either your workplace functions in a way that allows people to work a certain number of hours over either four days or five days, or it doesn't.

I agree that in jobs where people frequently need to work outside their formal contracted hours it doesn't really work. This is why I have returned to work full time after maternity leave. If you go back to work, say, three days per week, in my line of work you are either going to have to take calls and pick up emails on your non working days or otherwise finish jobs outside your non working hours, or you have to be really strict about logging on and off exactly when it says in your contract and not answering calls or replying to emails or doing any other work outside those hours. But if you do the latter, your full time colleagues will start to resent you because they frequently do work outside their contracted hours.

Really it would be better if everyone, regardless of their working pattern, agreed not to be available or do any work outside their contracted hours, and that if they need to do so (for example) on a business trip, that they get paid overtime or get time off in lieu. That's really the only way to ensure equality between full and part time workers, or between people doing compressed hours and people working a five day week.

Sometimes it's not about working extra hours because the employers want more than their pound of flesh; it's because some kind of shit has hit the fan and someone has got to sort things out and maybe you are the only, or the best placed person who can.

Classic reading with no understanding.

I'm talking about regular work not emergencies or particularly busy periods. Obviously this tends to involve more work generally especially if you're a senior manager (I am since you're wondering, and to give you peace of mind, I don't leave my team hanging out dry in these scenarios).

Also with reference to someone else's post earlier, if people send emails within their working hours then that's because they're working their hours not because they expect you to be working the same hours. Seriously, why blame others for your own skewed perception 🤷🏼‍♀️

YABU, it sounds like you and others are working excessive hours, and there isn’t a proper plan in place to cover Fridays-you need to speak to managers about this.

It's become a pain to me personally because my colleague has to offload lots of things to me because she doesn't work Fridays and she is now complaining about her workload as she has to compress all meetings into 4 days. I also have to attend her Friday meetings that require attendance as she can't go.

You need to push back on this. My colleague has compressed hours and doesn't work Mondays. I will only cover a meeting if it is absolutely unavoidable. If not, she has to set it up to automatically record and follow up on her working days. Same goes for offloading work to me on her non-working days. I don't have capacity to pick it up. We both work full time, I don't offload work at 4pm (I work 8am-4pm) for her to do when I've logged off, if I pick it up then who is going to do my work?

Presumably because other people who need to be in the meeting have non working days on Mon, Tues, Weds, Thurs ...

Where I work we schedule meetings for when the important people are available. If it's urgent. We pick up the phone