'Increase' in ASD/ADHD

[Sunsnet]

There are a lot of discussion at the moment on this subject and many people who believe that people are faking these conditions in themself or their children. This makes it very difficult for those with these diagnoses to be taken seriously and feels like a massive attack and dismissal of their genuine struggles so shouldn't the question actually be, why is there a massive increase in Munchausen's and Munchausen's by Proxy (child abuse)?

Lots more children are “stressed” and explosive which then leads to parents worrying about ASD/ADHD and when they cannot cope with their kids at home, they seek a diagnosis. People are underestimating the impact of Covid, long hours in early childcare, pressure at school from an early age in a noisy environment, not enough time in nature and just playing/being bored. In addition, for young children to be around stressed adult a lot of the time also has a huge impact. Young kids are hugely dependent on the temperament and moods of the adults around them, including at school and in nursery settings!

So far more young kids are stressed and impatient which can present as ASD/ADHD to a parent and often even to teachers. Also screens, the constant stimulation etc. Kids are not getting enough down time, peace, quiet, time in nature etc. Constant fight and flight is messing with behaviour and impulse control. If adults are stressed and struggling mentally, it affects the kids too.

And I forgot diet as well. High sugar diet and constant stimulation.
The good news is educators from early settings through primary to secondary are starting to focus more and more on mental health, talking to children about diet etc

Why do you need to figure it out if it doesn't concern you?

People constantly told me I 'gave in' to my child who was school refusing and that I wasn't firm enough with boundaries. They had no clue. If it comes to the point that the child is going to harm themselves or others if they are made to do something they can't do it is not soft parenting it is meeting a child's needs.

The word resilience was used a lot. How could a child be resilient if they were not made to do things they can't do? ( Notice I use the word can't not won't). Let me tell you you don't make a person resilient by forcing them to do things they can't do for whatever reason, you break them.

My DS who I was so dreadfully weak and parented with no boundaries in the eyes of some is now the most resilient, hard working, kind and caring young person I know and we have a great relationship. When he was going through his worst time he was violent to me and trying to kill himself and breaking things like TVs.

I don't think he'd be alive now if I'd done conventional parenting. If he was alive he would have been criminalised.

No one knows what it is like to parent a struggling autistic child unless they go through it , and even then it is limited to their own experience.

If you haven't experienced it you have literally no right to judge.

Talking to a friend the other day, he was having a good grouse about his sister depending on their parents for everything and how she really needs to be more responsible and less chaotic, given that her son has quite severe special needs (global delay, deafness, but also ASD and ADHD) and has so many appointments. He's a nice man but was grumpy that she wasn't 'pulling herself together' and 'coping like an adult' with his little nephew.

After a bit, I said, 'Will, did you realise some of these things run in families? Has she always been like this and could she have some of Jack's problems herself?' He looked thoroughly taken aback -- he's only ever thought of ADHD as a thing that affected 'modern kids', and any problems his sister had were just her own fault for being Emma, so to speak.

Your post is unreasonable and kind of crass

Lots of people do have traits associated with ADHD, because it’s the same stuff that is cultivated by phones and scrolling through SM. Many traits are also quite common, but the distinction is in the degree to which they affect an individual (eg time blindness, procrastination).

This is why medical assessment is offered, to determine if an individual does have one of these things. Incorrect diagnoses by private companies is clearly an issue at the mo.

You might find the -accusation- of people faking frustrating, but relabelling it as Munchhausens isn’t helpful. I think you’re aiming your frustration at the wrong target.

They run absolutely riot, there's never been any boundaries, they do what they want, when they want.

There would be people who saw or heard me describe my nearly 6 year old and believe the same. He is globally delayed with his autism, he is cognitively around 24 months old (this is from numerous assessments). People see a 6 year old with poor behaviour control and emotional regulation, however he is (and may well be forever) 2 years old. So my parenting and expectations have to be of a 2 year old no matter how it looks to strangers or ignorant older folk who simply don’t ‘get’ ASD and what it actually entails. Which often is far more than the misbehaviour in the eyes of society.

I’ve learned to nod and smile at the ‘wasn’t a thing in my day, kids knew discipline!’ type of exhausting person though. Autism certainly was a ‘thing’ at least 30 years ago but just buried under the carpet.

@Gerrataere

Thats the thing though. If a 6 year old has the cognitive ability of a 2 year old then it really is fairly obvious that the child is a genuine case. You can tell the difference. An incredibly bright, manipulative 6 year old running adults riot because he has no boundaries really is a very different thing. In practice you can spot it a mile off.

But faking a condition IS Munchausen's (now Factitious Disorder). What would you call it?

If you faked any other condition it would be Munchausen's, why not ASD/ADHD? That tells me that people accusing others of this are not being completely honest about their intentions.

Your post is ridiculous. Who are you cross at? The people discussing whether people seeking ADHD diagnoses are faking it? Or people with Munchausens & MbP generally?

Autism is autism. It doesn’t matter if you can ‘tell’ by sight or not. And on glance you wouldn’t be able to ‘tell’ either of my children are autistic. My older son has ASD and adhd without a learning disability, he is still very much emotionally and socially delayed. Just because he has a higher level of communication doesn’t undermine how difficult he finds life every day. Busy environments like school are huge triggers and he often needs calming time. But because he doesn’t have a learning disability there is far less care and understanding for his needs. It’s no wonder kids like him are far more likely to end up with MH issues.

The masses of people self-diagnosing ASD/ADHD don't necessarily have Munchausens. The problem is nearly everybody has at least a couple of traits of ASD/ADHD, so they may genuinely believe they have the condition. The problem is that many of them then aren't bothering to actually get their self-diagnosis confirmed or denied but go around saying they're #ActuallyAutistic or their children's behaviour can't be managed because they have ADHD or whatever.

How do you suppose this can be faked? and why? My child has severe ASD/severe learning difficulties, special school for complex needs students, will never be independent. how on earth would we fake this and why?

Its really difficult. There are three groups as I see it

• people with a diagnosis from a well respected clinic/NHS
• people who are trying to get a referral for diagnosis who suspect they/their child might be ND (and they probably have a point) who may have been to a private clinic etc
• people who want to claim a ND condition as an identity for themselves or their child(ren) and there may or may not be anything in it

The difficulty is telling, on the face of it, who is in the second group and who in the third. The people in group 2 might really be struggling and they're getting no help and they're coming to be seen as crackpots on top of everything else. The group 3 people I see as basically milking out the sympathy that should be going to group 2. Not that the people in group 3 aren't struggling, but maybe they are struggling more generally to find how they fit in in the world and are trying on different diagnoses to see if they fit.
It's very frustrating to see this happening though as the people who really are profoundly affected by these conditions had to fight long and hard to get them recognised and now there is a danger that that recognition gets rolled back or diluted by all those people who are fascinated by their inability to chop garlic or their dislike of small talk or whatever.

So what is your authority to decide who is and isn't genuinely affected by ASD? You don't see inside Tommy's head, you don't understand the difficulties he may face.
You supposedly haven't been through terror someone may feel when unexpected phone call comes for which you didn't have time to emotionally prepare. You haven't been bullied at work all through your 20s because your direct communications have been taken as rude by work colleagues and management. You haven't felt the stress when someone tells you at the last minute that they booked a weekend trip abroad or that you have to move house with JUST two months notice because society thinks everyone should be able to be spontaneous and two months notice is enough for anyone to adjust. You haven't wondered why your brain gets stuck on a single topic and cannot let it go (unlike someone I know who once had a fleeting thought that his mum is going to die which developed into obsession leading to mental breakdown and 3 years worth of therapy to become "unstuck").
What you are saying in your post is that ASD is only a valid concern when it inconveniences other people such as smearing or violence. Nothing about the person's own experience. And it is very much is belittling.

15-20 years ago loads of people were claiming to have bipolar, or that their kid did.

Some actually did. They only joined the dots once bipolar (and how it can present) was more widely known about. Some didn’t. They will have moved on to whatever the next popular trendy thing to have is. It was Tourette’s for a bit. Then multiple personality disorder. For a minute it was Schizophrenia, which surprised me. I’m wondering if self diagnosis of Cluster B disorders will be next. It was all “self diagnosis is VALID” for a while which let all sorts of people make all sorts of claims, with varying degrees of evidence. But that may have died back a little due to shift in the cultural waters.

I was diagnosed with ADHD about 7 years ago. I taught kids with the diagnosis for donkey’s years and utterly failed to recognise the very obvious traits I had in common. So I talked about ADHD rather a lot once I knew I had it.

I reckon it’s fairly normal human behaviour to be quite vocal about it and bring it up twenty times a day after recent diagnosis. Personally I was so relieved I had a thing beyond “being crap at humaning” I got totally overexcited and one track minded. But it wears off. So some off what you are seeing may just be temporary post diagnosis uptick in mention-itus. In a world where SM has really changed the volume of communication we anre exposed to each day it may just seem like an awful lot more than we were used to hearing back in the day.

I am cross at people who are making life harder for people with disabilities because they don't consider them to be hindered enough or worthy enough of a diagnosis, understanding and assistance. I am happy to admit that. If it is valid to accuse someone (or even many people) of faking an illness then it is valid to analyse why they believe that and why somebody would do it.

I don't see why faking ASD and ADHD should be treated any differently to faking other illnesses or conditions and I wonder why so many think it is.

So rather than replying, you’ve just gone back and edited your post. 🤷🏻 I responded because you quoted me… if you’re going to change your earlier posts to say something different there’s not really much point is there. V odd.

So what is your authority to decide who is and isn't genuinely affected by ASD? You don't see inside Tommy's head, you don't understand the difficulties he may face.
You supposedly haven't been through terror someone may feel when unexpected phone call comes for which you didn't have time to emotionally prepare. You haven't been bullied at work all through your 20s because your direct communications have been taken as rude by work colleagues and management. You haven't felt the stress when someone tells you at the last minute that they booked a weekend trip abroad or that you have to move house with JUST two months notice because society thinks everyone should be able to be spontaneous and two months notice is enough for anyone to adjust. You haven't wondered why your brain gets stuck on a single topic and cannot let it go (unlike someone I know who once had a fleeting thought that his mum is going to die which developed into obsession leading to mental breakdown and 3 years worth of therapy to become "unstuck").
What you are saying in your post is that ASD is only a valid concern when it inconveniences other people such as smearing or violence. Nothing about the person's own experience. And it is very much is belittling.

In my post I literally said I think diagnosis should be reserved for the people whose lives are genuinely affected or hindered by the condition. The example I gave was one of those. All of the examples you've given are also of people whose lives would be genuinely affected/hindered by it. Which is exactly my point, those who have a couple of traits don't need to seek a diagnosis, like my child, someone else mentioned similarities with their child above etc. A staggering amount of people will have traits but not to a level it affects their lives and that's where I think the over diagnosis/self diagnosis lies.

Maybe I should have put hypochondria in my OP. Why do they think are so many people suffering from hypochondria?

You have made me think though. Anxiety levels have increased greatly due to repeated lockdowns the massive disruption that caused to regular life, hypochondria is an anxiety disorder so should everyone be questioning that instead of questioning ASD/ADHD? I suppose my point is more about the language used and feeling that the wrong thing is being questioned.

A staggering amount of people will have traits but not to a level it affects their lives and that's where I think the over diagnosis/self diagnosis lies.

Do you know what’s actually ‘staggering’ @pinotgringo ? The amount of adults (especially women) who have been affected by not having ASD/ADHD pick up on from youth. You choose not to see how it may have affected them because it will come out in ways that is very easy to make negative judgments about those people rather than recognising their actions as symptomatic of neurodivergence.

Undiagnosed/unsupported asd/adhd leads to all manner of issues that’s simply seen as anything from poor decision making, to social deviance. From poor career moves, risky sex lives (leading to possible multiple pregnancies), impulsive behaviour, poor money management leading to debt, criminal behaviour. Many people with addictions or dependency issues have been known to have undiagnosed ND and use substances as a coping method. And because they are undiagnosed their children are far more likely to have the same conditions, they usually present more obviously as the genetic line goes on, but all society sees is a feckless person who has had a child, a child they’re now ‘claiming’ to have ND but it’s ‘probably’ just because of the chaotic environment from the poor parenting. And the cycle continues….

"There are two things one Pharma is happy with people being medicated. "

There is no medication for autism.

But my DD was doing fine until she wasn't. I had said I believed it was ASD for years but as she was doing ok I was told to leave it. In the course of a couple of months she went from ok to a serious suicide attempt and had to drop out of school. My once high achiever now has no GCSEs and is extremely concerned for her future.

I tried to get help in place quickly by paying for a private diagnosis, but it was too late. Why are we waiting until they break? What would have happened if we had waited for the NHS diagnosis?

We are letting down huge swathes of children and I don't just mean ND children, the NT ones with massive mental health issues are being let down too. We need to do something about it and accusing parents who are just trying to get answers and clinics who are filling the gaps in NHS provision doesn't help. People are self diagnosing because they have no choice in a broken system.

I think there’s a lot more young people getting convinced that any little quirk is ASD/adhd.

This - we seem to be headed for a society where only a narrow personality type is considered NT - people who are confident, relaxed, extroverted, flexible and not sensitive all, either emotionally or in sensory terms.

To me, to be defining something as beyond the realms of NT, the classification should only be picking up the extremes, not just anyone a little different. And society shouldn't be so rigid, we should be able to tolerate a broader range of individual differences.

@Gerrataere

I don’t agree. Autism is autism? Not a chance. We’ve now over diagnosed to such an extent those individuals who really are autistic have been lumped into the same bracket as every man and his dog and their needs totally watered down.

Sorry what medical expertise do you have to conclude what is autism and what is a random diagnosis handed out to, what, make someone shut up and go away? I’m confused by your post in general, what do think qualifies autism as a diagnosis?

I also think that many people use ND as a synonym for just autism and Adhd whereas others use it for dyscalculia, dyslexia, dysgraphia etc. With a school classroom you are likely to have 1 autistic child, a couple of ADHDers but many more from the dys.... family and its quite possible that in some schools ND children will outnumber the NT, particularly so in lower income areas where (inherited) learning difficulties are more common.