Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to ask you who has right of way?

95 replies

allswellthatends · 04/09/2023 13:40

Please settle a family argument, especially since our eldest has finally nabbed a driving test date and this could come up.

Near our house is a mini roundabout we pass almost every day. If car A and car C arrive at the roundabout at the same time, and car A is signalling a right turn, who has right of way? Who has to yield?

I have drawn a diagram under MN rules, but cannot see how to link it??

Yes, of course I have my own view (which doesn’t correspond to my husband’s view). I would like to hear what others think, so I am putting this out here and will come back to it in 24 hours to tell you what I think and why. It’s clear that not everyone agrees with me because this location gets a lot of near-collisions and angry hooting!

OP posts:
Scaredycatttt · 04/09/2023 16:08

WhatapityWapiti · 04/09/2023 15:49

You can’t say “assuming we get there at the same time” to answer the question “do you give way to cars that are not yet on the roundabout?”. The question was about when you get to the roundabout first, and they are not at it yet.

Then that would be a total non event as we would both be using the roundabout a different times? Obviously it only applies if we both need to use it simultaneously. I don't sit there waiting for other cars to come along just so that I can give way to them....

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 04/09/2023 16:12

Mysleepisbroken · 04/09/2023 15:18

This surely.

For all the people of who say its A, because 'they are on the right', have you tried turning the screen upside down?

If you turn the screen upside down A is still passing C from the right. We aren't talking about the fact they are on the right of the paper but the clockwise direction of travel. A passes in front of C and C does not pass in front of A which ever way you turn the paper. Turn it onto an origami chrysanthemum and it still won't change it.

AutumnAnnie · 04/09/2023 16:14

Wind ‘em up and watch ‘em go! 🙄

WhatapityWapiti · 04/09/2023 16:17

Scaredycatttt · 04/09/2023 16:08

Then that would be a total non event as we would both be using the roundabout a different times? Obviously it only applies if we both need to use it simultaneously. I don't sit there waiting for other cars to come along just so that I can give way to them....

So what are your grounds for saying that car A goes first? Why does it get priority when you both have to use the roundabout simultaneously, but not if it reaches the line 20 seconds after you reach yours?

Scaredycatttt · 04/09/2023 16:25

WhatapityWapiti · 04/09/2023 16:17

So what are your grounds for saying that car A goes first? Why does it get priority when you both have to use the roundabout simultaneously, but not if it reaches the line 20 seconds after you reach yours?

My last reply because you are being very pedantic - if I can get across the roundabout safely before the other car reaches it, then I will go. If we could hypothetically both be on the roundabout at the same time, or if there is any chance of a collision, then I will always give way to the right. I don't know why this is so hard for you to grasp. It's how I was taught, I never get beeped and I have many years no claims so it's working just fine as a technique. It also only takes a couple of seconds to do

Optionyougot · 04/09/2023 16:35

Car A would be approaching and indicating right, Car B may not be signalling as they are heading straight on.

If both arrive at the same time neither should need to give way as they should never cross paths.

If A reaches the roundabout before B, B should give way (since you give way to the right)

If B reaches the roundabout before A then on a normal two way street neither should have to give way, but since its a mini roundabout B might not be signaling in which case A can't progress until they know B is turning off.

WhatapityWapiti · 04/09/2023 16:38

Scaredycatttt · 04/09/2023 16:25

My last reply because you are being very pedantic - if I can get across the roundabout safely before the other car reaches it, then I will go. If we could hypothetically both be on the roundabout at the same time, or if there is any chance of a collision, then I will always give way to the right. I don't know why this is so hard for you to grasp. It's how I was taught, I never get beeped and I have many years no claims so it's working just fine as a technique. It also only takes a couple of seconds to do

So in fact not a simple case of “Car A goes first” then.

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 04/09/2023 16:58

Should we phrase it differently and state car A has priority and car C must not impede their passage.

NewName122 · 04/09/2023 16:58

I don't even have a licence and know car A has right of way.

TenderDandelions · 04/09/2023 16:59

WhatapityWapiti · 04/09/2023 15:19

So you regularly give way to other cars that are not yet on the roundabout?

If I was car C and was approaching a mini roundabout and the car opposite was indicating right, yes I would.

Think of the alternative. You pull out on to the mini roundabout at the same time as the car opposite. It's a small roundabout. Where does A end up?

The reality of the situation is that most of the time both cars end up sitting there for ages waiting for someone to make a decision, but strictly speaking A has priority in this scenario IMHO.

Dwappy · 04/09/2023 17:03

Scaredycatttt · 04/09/2023 16:25

My last reply because you are being very pedantic - if I can get across the roundabout safely before the other car reaches it, then I will go. If we could hypothetically both be on the roundabout at the same time, or if there is any chance of a collision, then I will always give way to the right. I don't know why this is so hard for you to grasp. It's how I was taught, I never get beeped and I have many years no claims so it's working just fine as a technique. It also only takes a couple of seconds to do

I agree with you. I drive in exactly the same way and in 25 years only had one accident when I was 18 (and it was not at a roundabout). I don't get beeped at either. Maybe some people don't come across busy mini roundabouts that often. Almost everyone I come across in London and surrounding areas does the same as well.

enchantedsquirrelwood · 04/09/2023 17:56

I think this is one of those Mexican stand-off type situations. Whoever's quickest off the mark goes first in my view.

We have a three point roundabout near us and there is constantly a stand-off there with everyone looking at everyone else to decide who goes. This is a bit different, but I think it's whoever gets on with the manoeuvre.

I also take the view that a mini-roundabout is a roundabout like any other, so I don't just drive across them, I always go round. If you follow that, C should have time to get across the roundabout before A gets round.

allswellthatends · 04/09/2023 21:53

Ok, I promised to come back. May I just say what a relief to see how many of you disagree on here: clearly DH and I are not stupid for feeling the answer’s not obvious. Not that I was planning to LTB over this, but still.

Obviously, DH and I do both agree with the many PP who have said it’s best to pause, eye the other guy, and proceed with caution: that’s what we’ve told DS, adding what one of you so helpfully said about not hesitating TOO long during the actual driving test.

But, if it comes to figuring out the actual rule, I seem to be with the minority on this thread. I say C (going straight) has priority over A (turning right).

TBH, I’m amazed at how many PP have claimed that “yield to the right” is relevant (Highway Code rule 185). Neither car is “on the right” of the other before entering the roundabout; they’re nose to nose. Priority to the right applies only on entering the roundabout, not to what happens once you’re in it and certainly not to where you plan to exit it. (If you think about how you actually drive on a larger roundabout, we never do, indeed can't, give priority to the right once in it.)

More to the point, as they enter our roundabout you can think of the cars as following one another nose to tail on a circle, or as side to side heading opposite directions, in which case they will pass each other right side to right side. Either way, neither car has right-side priority. For some reason my DH cannot see this, as it seems many of you don’t?

So I feel the key is that turn. My view is that 1. it’s at best irrelevant that A plans to turn right, and 2. at worst the turn actually means C must have priority. Because:

1: As many of you pointed out, in theory, if both cars go around the nose of the circle instead of straight across, as required in rule 188, there's no conflict: C should have exited the roundabout before A starts to turn. In practice, as we all agree, in a mini roundabout when A starts turning towards his/her right, the cars are still on top of each other, so A will probably rear-end C. That in itself seems like a clue: basically, you rear-end anyone, let alone on a roundabout, you’re definitely in the wrong. But also

2: Nothing in the Highway Code gives priority in a roundabout based on where you plan to exit. Searching for other clues, I turn to rule 180: when you are turning right at a junction (and don’t forget a roundabout IS a junction), you must yield and wait for vehicles going straight on. This, I notice, is basically what PoshPineapple, former driving instructor, said at 13:45. It doesn’t come up in a normal roundabout because in a normal, large roundabout you are not really turning right to exit but veering off to your left.

But, as I started out saying, while I still think I’m right and DH is wrong, I see that many, many of you disagree with me. And clearly the rule is so confused there’s no sense playing High Noon with other drivers.

The foreign part of me thinks it’s weird the rules aren’t spelled out more clearly to avoid accidents, lawsuits, and vendettas; the British part of me thinks it’s nice that we still rely on common sense and courtesy among drivers.

OP posts:
Boomboom22 · 04/09/2023 21:58

Whoever is there first obviously, otherwise give way to the right. I don't really understand the question?

Boomboom22 · 04/09/2023 21:59

Also you never turn right to exit a roundabout, the rule you just quoted is about turning right across traffic on a straight road / into a road.

Dwappy · 04/09/2023 22:00

Surely if car A drives into car C they've hit the side of the car not the rear? (Rear side though yes)

akkakk · 05/09/2023 11:55

"But, if it comes to figuring out the actual rule, I seem to be with the minority on this thread. I say C (going straight) has priority over A (turning right).

TBH, I’m amazed at how many PP have claimed that “yield to the right” is relevant (Highway Code rule 185). Neither car is “on the right” of the other before entering the roundabout; they’re nose to nose. Priority to the right applies only on entering the roundabout, not to what happens once you’re in it and certainly not to where you plan to exit it. (If you think about how you actually drive on a larger roundabout, we never do, indeed can't, give priority to the right once in it.)"

No - until you are on the roundabout you do not technically have priority - so sitting there, neither has priority.

The 'yield to the right' does make sense because when you enter a roundabout you can have cars in front / behind you - they are to your left / right - you give way to those behind you / to your right - i.e. coming clockwise towards you... of course as it is round, technically any car on there is to your right as they could choose to go around as many times as they wish... which is why you only need to give way if otherwise you are affecting their journey...

but as before - there is still a lot of over-thinking this...
drive confidently without arrogance - be aware of other road users and considerate towards them - if they are moving / have arrived fast and hard and are likely to go again - give way, if they seem to be more gentle drivers then be confident and go...

the best advice though in driving is that you need to be looking further ahead - you should be making decisions before you reach the roundabout - if you think that you are going to arrive at the same time - speed up (if legal and safe!) or slow down so that you don't arrive at the same time - issue will vanish. Look further up the windscreen and you will look further up the street - plan before you arrive at the hazard. If you are looking through the lower part of the windscreen you will only see the next small bit of road and you will always be reacting.

The time to make the decision is not when you arrive at the roundabout - that is too late, making the decision earlier allows you to adapt and manage the situation more pro-actively.

HazRab · 07/09/2023 10:07

Think the police would have wee chat with you if they seen you going round roundabout "as many as you wish", 😆

Oldermum84 · 07/09/2023 10:13

Car A. You give way to the right.

Skybluecoat · 07/09/2023 10:14

I’m a bit baffled as surely neither car would have to give way if they arrived at the same time? They would just pass each other?

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Swipe left for the next trending thread