AIBU? Escalating work issue to HR/legal advice

[WanOvaryKenobi]

Hello 👋,

Posted this in the Work chat but didn't get any response. Seeking a bit of advice here.

I started a new role 14 weeks ago that has a three month notice period. The contract wording is:

"Your probationary period is specified in section X (which says 3 months). Should either you or the company wish to terminate your employment during your probationary period, the notice required will be one week. Your probationary period may be extended at the direction of the company."

The notice period beyond probation is 3 months.

So this week my manager informed me that my probation was to be extended, 2 weeks after the 3 month probation period.

I have to be honest I was completely blindsided by this as I have a weekly 1-2-1 with this person and there has never been anything negative raised. Yet at my last meeting they announced that they still needed more time to decide, and in particular I needed to finish a strategy document, and a few issues with my "engagement" and "not being bubbly enough". Again, nothing along these lines has ever been raised in any of the 12 previous 1-2-1s.

As for the strategy document I was told to put it to the side for a few weeks to focus on bigger projects that had tight deadlines. I was never informed that passing my probation was contingent on completing this strategy document. In fact the opposite, I have been told that it is not a priority. If I had been informed of the consequences on my probation I would have worked a lot more extra hours. I'm also just shocked that there have been any issues with my performance or attitude as this has never come up before.

I now have a few questions as a one week notice period is extremely stressful.

I basically want to know if they are able to extend my probation period after the deadline has ended, and with no prior warnings or written confirmation. I have still not been asked to sign anything and some of the feedback, like being "bubbly" and "engaged" feel a bit like subjective measures to improve on rather than concrete achievements, and again these issues have never come up before. So it is not a clear performance improvement plan or official document and I don't want to be blindsided again.

I am also wondering if they do try to sack me if I am entitled to three months notice/pay. I have been looking at other cases and it does seem to me that they have to inform you before the probation period has ended if they are going to extend. Also, my contract does not say I need verbal or written confirmation when this period has passed so it feels like this is done automatically.

Any advice? Thanks.

I am somewhat leaning towards a few suggestions here which is to leave it for now and refuse to sign anything. At that point I can bring up the legal cases about extending probation after it has passed. Then if they want to get rid of me I have three months notice.

It would be a bit odd though to go from zero to quoting case law.. it shows you researched the situation but did nothing to resolve it amicably.

You could email your manager and copy in HR. Stating your recollection of the conversation, that you are confused about this because a) no negative feedback to date and b) probation actually finished xx date and please could (manager) clarify the situation as you are not clear.

Then HR know about it and can discuss with manager to sort it out (properly).

If they dismiss you you might have an unfair dismissal case but you'll need to go through internal grievance first.

Although you've been there for less than two years I think the possibility that it's racism is a protected characteristic so an employment tribunal would have to hear your case. This fact should mean they'd be keen to settle to avoid the costa of a tribunal. Write everything down in an email complaining about how you've been treated as a formal grievance

You can fight this like anyone can fight anything they want to, I don't think you will get the outcome you are looking for but totally up to you of course

Have they told you what steps you'd need to be taking in order to pass probation? Does it depend completely on how well you complete the piece of work?

Are your 1-1s documented at all?

It seems off that they've not mentioned anything to you about attitude or performance previously.

Sounds like shitty management behaviour. I'm a manager myself and probation extensions should never come as a huge shock. There should be things put into place prior to probation reviews.

Has the outcome of your probation been put into writing?

If this was me in your situation I'd leave HR out of it for now but email your manager to outline a few points....

I'd go with:

1. Wanting clarification on the discussion surrounding your attitude and not being bubbly.... What goal are they setting that's SMART?

1. Outline that it had previously been noted that the project wasn't urgent however is now an issue due to not being completed, what support you made need to realistically finish this within your scope.

1. Are there any other steps you can take or need to be working towards in order to pass probation.

Any further discussions on this follow up on email so there's a paper trail should you be dismissed.

Good luck and feel free to message me if you need any support.

I'd also start to look for a new role as your manager shouldn't be managing.

My company has a clear probation period policy and like a previous poster of we have not formally communicated the need to extend prior to the calendar date then we've missed the boat and the employee automatically passes.

Based on the wording of your contract and the circumstances you've described, in your position I would be very confident that you've automatically passed the probation phase.

I wouldn't raise this with HR at this stage as, in most every work place issue, your first port of call should be to resolve it directly with your line manager. This smells to me like an inexperienced / poor line manager as opposed to a bad company so I would nudge them to check their facts before you jump to a grievance.

I would email your line manager (to have in writing) along the lines of
"following our informal discussion on the 25th, I have checked and according to my employment contract my probation period concluded on the 18th so therefore an extension is not possible.
I am also surprised at the feedback you gave as this was not raised in any of our previous 1-2-1s" etc and detail the moving of expectations re the strategy piece.
Cynically I would imagine your line manager got called out for it not being completed and is throwing the blame onto you.

If the above fails, or if they stick to their interpretation of the probation terms then you go to HR, forwarding your email chain with your line manager. As mentioned HR are not your friend- but they are not your line managers friend either; they exist to protect the company so will follow the legal processes / policies in place so they should favour you in this scenario.

Also yes they can extend your probation unless they've informed you in writing that you'd passed.

12 1-1s and not a single mention on goals/ how your projects are progressing and nothing about your engagement or how bubbly you aren't?

Something's off here.

Thanks all. I am extremely nervous about writing to this person directly (not my line manager as they haven't hired my line manager, so this is a person a step above that) as the trust has completely gone. I don't understand how any issues have not been raised before.

They have admitted several times my work has not been a priority for them and have not been available for support me. I've raised several issues to do with processes (not in my contract to implement) but have been fobbed off to change processes without actually having any backing from senior management. I am in a manager role but have no direct lines and the (well known and acknowledged) issues the team have had with disorganisation is from another department and people at the director level. I feel like I've been put into an extremely difficult situation and this person has thrown a shit fit.

Putting it in writing is just a way of protecting yourself.

If you're that worried about sending this person an email then get back on the job market quickly.

Sounds toxic as fuck and you're better off out of it.

One question though, if I leave it until I have to sign/agree to anything officially does that leave me protected legally so I don't have to annoy this person as they will probably make my life hell if I make them look bad.

They want you to finish and implement the strategy document and then get rid of you once you have done their work!

In a situation where the trust has gone you absolutely need to put things in writing. Keep a moderate, professional tone sticking purely to factual statements in all communications.

Legally the key here is have they followed the terms of your employment contract and the associated policies; whether you acknowledge this in writing now or in two weeks doesn't make any difference. I would feel more comfortable getting it documented as early as possible what conversations happened when- what if he later says he told you verbally prior to the probation end date and just hadn't put it in writing yet?

It sounds like a shit show, but in your situation I would play nice for the time being, crouching things in a constructive way but clearly documenting the timelines and short comings eg reiterating the point re probation period having concluded but suggesting some practices to improve things going forward and something like "I appreciate that you are managing me off the side of the desk pending the hire of my permanent line manager and this is less than ideal for all of us. Could we consider that I have an interim reporting line into x dept so that I can utilise their resources / support them in addressing some of the well acknowledged issues etc"

Also, you don't have to agree / sign anything. Your employment contract is the key document (subject to there being no employee handbook or policy addendum) and you are following it's terms. The onus is on the employer to put any required extension in place within the stated timescale. They have failed to do so, and should not seek to do it retrospectively.

Also have they given a written statement of where you need to improved and how they are doing to help you achieve this?

example X is to keep written records of y and report all findings to A by Y deadline?

A previous manager told me it’s extremely difficult to fire someone - they must prove they have offered every type of Supper available to them. With weekly meetings on progress etc

What have you been offered?

MavistheMonkey's approach sounds sensible and practical.

It allows you to keep the relationship with the 'manager' and the company on an even keel whilst preserving your rights should you wish to escalate it through a grievance and tribunal process (with a view to settling for 3 months' notice).

There is a risk they will try to get rid of you with one week's notice after you have delivered the strategy paper and that is when you have to escalate.

Update. Had a surprise call from HR today to "check the details of my contract and notice period" apparently (and this could be bullshit) they have been looking at contracts and were concerned they sent me a one month notice period when it should be three. I had the contract in front of me and confirmed it was three, they seemed pleased.

I then followed up that I was through my probation period as we are in week 14 of a 12 week probation period and was told someone was going to speak to me about that. Was overall a very friendly call but very strange. ACAS has been closed today for the BH so will call tomorrow. All very odd.

I wonder how many men are told they may not make it past their probation period because they aren't bubbly enough?

This is awful. You are there to do a job, not please others by being 'bubbly.' How silly.
Sounds like they do not value you and have issues with communicating with their staff on expectations, something that will not get better unfortunately. I would take it on the chin and very quickly start searching for another job and hand your notice in. You are worth more than that place!

Hmm, how do they work out their "3 months" in actual weeks though, since a month isn't an exact number of weeks, its 4 and a few days. Yes 14 full weeks would take you beyond 3 months, but i would have expected to be told based on my start date, what exact date was the last day of my probation period, as "3 months" is a bit too vague.
If i were you i'd ask for the new end date of your probation period extension in writing, then if they do try to extend your probation again or not to keep you on after that date passes, you've got written evidence you were past your probationary period and so are now a full employee and they cant extend, or are now are entitled to 3 weeks notice etc.

Interesting update with HR. I would only trust HR as far as I can throw them.

What a coincidence that they are 'looking at contracts'. They might be fishing for info to see how clued up you are on the contract (yes, you are). Then they said that someone would speak to you about the end of your probation. Looks like they already have some plan in mind otherwise they will say oh really, let me check because I did not realise the probationary period has expired.

I would suggest you continue to keep your guard up and paper everything, send emails to preserve your position. Yes, speak to ACAS and ideally an employment lawyer.

I am an in-house lawyer and deal with these types of matters.

If an employer had been treated the same as you the best thing from your perspective would be to reply to your line manager and cc HR. If you have emails where you have been told that work was deprioritised, attach that.

Keep the tone formal but polite in 'working together to resolve this' type approach.

I would specify that in line with your contract you had believed the probationary period had passed, as the extension wasn't issued or any matter raised with you prior to its expiry. Could they provide some further context or policy under which this is being extended.

I would also ask them to clarify what they meant by you "need to be more bubbly" stating that it's obviously a subjective term and your keen to understand what is meant by this in context. Maybe it was an ineloquent way of saying that people have found you rude or standoffish (I'm not saying you are) but frame it again that you're looking to work together to clarify expectations.

The reason I say this is if its in writing, its more difficult to get rid of you where you've queried these points.

In relation to the comment about race, I suppose it would depend on whether the area you live and work in now is more ethnically diverse. I wouldn't immediately be concerned by that comment on its own, unless there was more that had been said (not saying it wasn't rude or dismissive, just how I would view it in terms of legal risk)

In the end you may wish to move anyway but shorter periods on cvs look worse so I'd maybe try to clarify this and make them work to do better, then if you don't see an improvement look for new roles after you'd been there a year.

This is 100% wrong.

If the contract says 3 months, you are deemed to have passed your probationary period if they do not say anything after 3 months.

Thats why in most companies you have a probationary review right before the 3 or 6 month deadline.

I have seen this thing before.

If you had a 1 month notice period, they would have sent you a new contract with a 3 month period to sign.

At that point, you can either sign or not.

They push people to do this to reduce turnover costs, which can be an issue in a labour shortage environment.

Its 100% for the benefit of the company. Not you.

I agree with your DH, keep your head down and get on with the job in hand. If they are going to pull a snidey on you you’re best off out. With regard to the bubbly comment, is that a polite way of saying you are moody?

It depends what it says in the contract. If it says your probationary period is 12 weeks but will continue until it’s been confirmed I writing that you’ve passed then they can extend it after the 12 weeks.