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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

You and your family could be asylum seekers by this time next year.

477 replies

Nevermay · 14/08/2023 08:35

Just want to point this out, as many posters seem to be of the opinion that asylum seekers are a different species, with different aspirations, different hopes and fears, different medical biology, and different housing and nutritional requirements than the rest of humanity

It could be you and your family next year.

There could be any number of natural disasters in the UK. Meteor strike? Tsunami? Volcanic eruption? All of these are likely in the UK at some point. There could be manmade disasters, war, famine, there could be something more personal that happens to you, you could be a witness being searched for by a hostile government.

You might be a highly qualified professional, ( many asylum seekers in the UK are) you could have worked hard all your life to pay off your mortgage ( many asylum seekers in the UK have) you could have kept yourself fit and healthy all your life and you may also have an assortment of serious or trivial medical needs. You might have french or spanish GCSE to help you, or you might not.

None of these things will mark you out as special, or different, if you are in a crowd of asylum seekers seeking refuge in another country. You will just have to sit and wait and hope with everybody else, maybe for years, your children with you.

I really wish people understood this, refugees and asylum seekers are no different to our own population, some are uneducated, some are criminal, most are decent people, many are highly qualified and come from affluent and successful back grounds.

When ever you think and speak about them, please just keep in mind, this could be you next year.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
15
followmyflow · 14/08/2023 11:46

to be honest, everyone is like us, asylum seekers or no. there is nothing special about any group of people. that being said there are still practical considerations to be made... if we were involved in a natural disaster which cut off our imported food supply, would we be able to feed everybody here? almost the whole place would become asylum seekers then!

KeepYaHeadUp · 14/08/2023 11:47

@GlitchStitch - of course you're not 🙄

SerafinasGoose · 14/08/2023 11:48

Longdarkcloud · 14/08/2023 11:33

I saw a British TV programme maybe 5 years ago. I am hazy on the details but what came through very clearly was that it a dormant but not dead volcano erupted in the Canaries that an enormous piece of land/rock would fall into the sea and create a tsunami that would be channelled to the UK and up the Thames
valley. It would be the like of which we have not seen and much of the Southern part of the country would be inundated and uninhabitable for years.
The premise which was put forward by geologists etc was well researched but there is nothing we can do to prevent it.

That's a very old theory which apparently has since been debunked, but the story persists.

Tsunamis can theoretically happen anywhere. Apparently even the North Sea has had them in the past.

KeepYaHeadUp · 14/08/2023 11:48

Jamtartforme · 14/08/2023 11:34

So, those who are in favour of granting asylum to an unlimited number of people -

Where will we house them, and who should be kicked out of their homes to facilitate this? Because we don’t have enough houses as it is?

Equally, who Should be pushed down an NHS waiting list because of an influx of people needing treatment? Who takes a backseat then?

And which other service shall we strip back to fund their benefits and social housing?

You sound brainwashed. We could easily build enough houses for us and many others. It's a conscious choice not to

GlitchStitch · 14/08/2023 11:51

KeepYaHeadUp · 14/08/2023 11:47

@GlitchStitch - of course you're not 🙄

I don't stop believing women just because it doesn't fit my agenda. It's been a documented problem when you house large numbers of single men together, often from cultures with problematic views on women. Refusing to acknowledge the issues just alienates people from the cause.

pleasehelpwi3 · 14/08/2023 11:52

Totally agree with the point you're trying to make.
Sad to see so many of mumsnet seem to be Daily Mail readers and are deliberately misunderstanding the point you are trying to make.
You can't debate the racism out of someone. But well done for trying!

Jamtartforme · 14/08/2023 11:54

What we need is to work together with as many other countries as possible to create a joint economic migrant and asylum system so that people can make applications (where possible) from their own countries and not have to risk dangerous sea crossings.

Why are countries obliged to accept ‘economic migrants’? Is it right to deprive their country of their workforce? Would this mean I get to apply to the States and New Zealand?

It wouldn’t work anyway. The migrants want the U.K. - that’s why they’re making the crossing from France which is perfectly safe and even more prosperous. If they get granted asylum in for example Bulgaria what do you think they’ll do?

underneaththeash · 14/08/2023 11:54

OP you do realise that the vast majority of the people crossing are doing so for other reasons that being worried about their personal safety.

An enormous amount of Albanians crossed in the last few years and a significant percentage of those are involved with organised crime.

you also only have to listen to the families of many other people who have paid to cross and they’re doing it for economic reasons rather than worries about their own personal safety.

if you are a genuine asylum seeker, living in a boat for a few months or being send to a third country shouldn’t both you. If I was fleeing war, I would be okay with that too as the aim would be to ensure my family’s safety.

pleasehelpwi3 · 14/08/2023 11:54

Xlap · 14/08/2023 10:10

Mmmm, sorry to break this to you but what you have stated is utter BS.

Sorry to break it to you, but taking the piss out showing compassion to others- that's the BS, not the op!

fullbloom87 · 14/08/2023 11:55

And only the most wealthy will be able to afford to leave judging by how much the asylum seeker men pay to come here on the boats. Not many uk people will able to afford £6k each.
Maybe that's why only men come on the Boats and leave the women and children behind 🤔

Jamtartforme · 14/08/2023 11:55

KeepYaHeadUp · 14/08/2023 11:48

You sound brainwashed. We could easily build enough houses for us and many others. It's a conscious choice not to

Show quote history

Oh well when you put it that simply… I mean there was me thinking building that much housing would cost many many billions, take many years and bulldoze over the precious little greenfield land we have left as it is. Silly me! Just snap ya fingers and there it is, housing for all!

pleasehelpwi3 · 14/08/2023 11:56

underneaththeash · 14/08/2023 11:54

OP you do realise that the vast majority of the people crossing are doing so for other reasons that being worried about their personal safety.

An enormous amount of Albanians crossed in the last few years and a significant percentage of those are involved with organised crime.

you also only have to listen to the families of many other people who have paid to cross and they’re doing it for economic reasons rather than worries about their own personal safety.

if you are a genuine asylum seeker, living in a boat for a few months or being send to a third country shouldn’t both you. If I was fleeing war, I would be okay with that too as the aim would be to ensure my family’s safety.

Sorry, you are categorically wrong!
92% of small boat arrivals from 2018 to March 2023 claimed asylum; of the small share who had received a decision by March 2023, 86% received a grant of protection.
Source: https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/people-crossing-the-english-channel-in-small-boats/#:~:text=Ninety%20two%20percent%20of%20people,received%20a%20grant%20of%20protection.

People crossing the English Channel in small boats - Migration Observatory

This briefing examines the phenomenon of people crossing the English Channel in small boats.

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/people-crossing-the-english-channel-in-small-boats#:~:text=Ninety%20two%20percent%20of%20people,received%20a%20grant%20of%20protection.

loislovesstewie · 14/08/2023 11:59

We can't keep building houses,we don't build enough social housing anyway, which is why we have so many people languishing on housing registers. We can't build where we farm. We don't grow near enough food, so can't cope with a growing population, as I keep saying we are NOT rich. Most people in this country, apart from the south east, don't live affluent lifestyles. This country makes bugger all, we mostly make money from the finance industry of the south east.People who work in that sector might well make money;both for the business and for themselves , but huge numbers of people are struggling. We can't support a larger population, it's just not feasible.

pleasehelpwi3 · 14/08/2023 11:59

Jennygosoftly · 14/08/2023 11:56

Show quote history

Had a look at your article- for a start any article from a rightwing tabloid on migration isn't exactly a great source- and it's just a repetition of every slur and cliche about asylum seekers that the DM trots out on an almost daily basis.

Jamtartforme · 14/08/2023 12:01

loislovesstewie · 14/08/2023 11:59

We can't keep building houses,we don't build enough social housing anyway, which is why we have so many people languishing on housing registers. We can't build where we farm. We don't grow near enough food, so can't cope with a growing population, as I keep saying we are NOT rich. Most people in this country, apart from the south east, don't live affluent lifestyles. This country makes bugger all, we mostly make money from the finance industry of the south east.People who work in that sector might well make money;both for the business and for themselves , but huge numbers of people are struggling. We can't support a larger population, it's just not feasible.

Yes but this will fall on deaf ears. They’ll just keep on with the incantation ‘we’re a very wealthy country’ or ‘we can look after and house as many people as we want if the will is there’.

followmyflow · 14/08/2023 12:01

all populations of men rape women not just migrants. however, we dont exactly need more of it. i would prefer to prioritise female migrants, female children, male children and then male migrants in that order

GlitchStitch · 14/08/2023 12:02

There you have it, victims of rape can be discounted if its reported in the Daily Mail.

Jamtartforme · 14/08/2023 12:03

followmyflow · 14/08/2023 12:01

all populations of men rape women not just migrants. however, we dont exactly need more of it. i would prefer to prioritise female migrants, female children, male children and then male migrants in that order

I think that’s why the Ukraine scheme went down so well.

LadyGnome · 14/08/2023 12:03

Name changed for this post

DH was a refugee from a Civil War. He was granted asylum and was a stateless person for about 10 years.
Like many of his friends we is well educated and most of them have built successful lives in the UK. So I am well aware of the reality of refugee experience.

Around a quarter people travelling now are not refugees (Approx 74% of applicants were granted asylum or other leave to remain) but economic migrants and the two should not be treated the same way. Being a refugee is not a choice and has profound implications (being stateless means you have rejected and effectively been rejected by your place of birth - you don’t belong anywhere).

Economic migration is a normal part of human history and I do think we should have more straightforward processes to allow for it.

see section 4
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-system-statistics-year-ending-march-2023/summary-of-latest-statistics

Summary of latest statistics

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-system-statistics-year-ending-march-2023/summary-of-latest-statistics

pleasehelpwi3 · 14/08/2023 12:03

loislovesstewie · 14/08/2023 11:59

We can't keep building houses,we don't build enough social housing anyway, which is why we have so many people languishing on housing registers. We can't build where we farm. We don't grow near enough food, so can't cope with a growing population, as I keep saying we are NOT rich. Most people in this country, apart from the south east, don't live affluent lifestyles. This country makes bugger all, we mostly make money from the finance industry of the south east.People who work in that sector might well make money;both for the business and for themselves , but huge numbers of people are struggling. We can't support a larger population, it's just not feasible.

Your post is nonsense. We are one of the richest countries in the world, taking per capita one of the lowest amounts of asylum seekers.
Turkey and Lebanon for example- much poorer than this country, support many more asylum seekers.
I have even met- and given money to- Syrian asylum seekers in Ethiopia! The idea that 1) the UK is poor and 2) and should do less than other much poorer countries is both selfish and nonsensical, especially given that the UK has colonised so many of the countries that asylum seekers originate from.

Pandaflop · 14/08/2023 12:06

I think the government need to sort out the process for applications rather than being against asylum seekers. I'd much rather see families, women, children and a proportionate amount of single young men rather than the skewed demographics the broken system currently has. Also agree that there are differences between genuine asylum seekers and economic migrants, and processes should be separate for the 2 rather than whatever it is the gov are currently doing. Of course there are issues with groups of men being dunped en masses in areas- especially when some are from countries where women aren't valued at all, those beliefs don't shake off as they cross the channel.

Pandaflop · 14/08/2023 12:06

Basically imo the issue is the government.

Jamtartforme · 14/08/2023 12:07

pleasehelpwi3 · 14/08/2023 12:03

Your post is nonsense. We are one of the richest countries in the world, taking per capita one of the lowest amounts of asylum seekers.
Turkey and Lebanon for example- much poorer than this country, support many more asylum seekers.
I have even met- and given money to- Syrian asylum seekers in Ethiopia! The idea that 1) the UK is poor and 2) and should do less than other much poorer countries is both selfish and nonsensical, especially given that the UK has colonised so many of the countries that asylum seekers originate from.

Show quote history

Here we go, the incantation being chanted again…

I will leave this here in the hope you will read it:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/07/18/stagnant-britain-needs-growth-if-it-wants-to-be-a-rich-country/a9f39bd6-2526-11ee-9201-826e5bb78fa1_story.html

Coriolise · 14/08/2023 12:07

JaukiVexnoydi · 14/08/2023 09:04

We are very fortunate in the UK that the vast majority of those things couldn't actually happen here.

However the point is still valid because british people aren't qualitatively better or more deserving of comfort and security than those who are forced into thr position of being asylum seekers. They aren't any different from us just because of having been born in a country that is now unstable and unsafe.

There are 37 million refugees in the world out of a population of 7.8 billion (about half of one percent of the world's population)
The UK's "fair share" of that 37 million would be about 320,000 whereas in fact we have 230,000. As a prosperous nation with a culture of freedom and acceptance of diversity we should be doing more than our fair share, not less.

On what basis did you calculate our ‘fair share’? Seems odd that we’d be responsible for 8.6% of all refugees when we are less than 1% of the worlds population ourselves?

And as far as a ‘prosperous nation’ goes we are in a recession and are only the 18th richest in the world out of 190 countries behind many countries with much higher populations, so barely in the top 10%. We don’t have a culture of freedom in the sense that we are one of the most monitored populations in the world via our vast CCTV and electronic surveillance systems- every persons online activity, emails, messages are logged and recorded by the government, our movements logged and recorded by tracking our cell phones) its freedom on a leash. We are not that accepting of diversity have a look at the threads on racism and xenophobia and the hate crime reports.