Cyclists who act like they own the road should pay towards it

[dreamingofsun]

So cyclists get priority on the roads, and are happy to ride two abreast so they hold all the car traffic up. Shouldnt they at least pay towards the upkeep of the road?

Did you pass a driving test?

If so I think it's time to repeat the exercise

Well I would happily use the cycle lanes. Trouble is, it's full of parked cars....

Tractors and poorly parked tourists are more likely to slow down the traffic in rural areas like Yorkshire dales than cyclists. Should motorists also start demanding payment for lost revenue from them also?

Oh no wait. We're all just living our lives in a shared world and sometimes other people are an inconvenience. You will be an inconvenience to someone else too.

I spend a lot of time near a very popular cycling circular route around a big lake.

You know what holds me up when I'm trying to go about my business and which causes massive traffic jams spanning several villages?

Swarms of tourists and caravans, and their parking on the verges of narrow country roads because they're either too cheap to pay for parking or too thick to realise that if all the car parks are full they should probably go elsewhere.

Not cyclists.

I'd trade the lot of them for a couple of pelotons once or twice a year.

I don't use cycle lanes very often because even on the cycle lanes where you're supposed to have priority over adjoining traffic drivers overhang them. Also if you're approaching at the same time as a driver you are often banking on them stopping, and considering so many don't stop (because giving someone 2 stop lines that are less than a car length apart is a stupid bit of road design) you tend to approach them hovering on the brake, which is not a nice way to ride. However riding in the main road, as you approach junctions you can take the primary position and if someone pulls out on you (and they do) you've got much more space to do something about it or take evasive action.

Also where I ride most roads are restricted to 20, and 18-20 is quite a manageable speed for me, so riding with other traffic doing a similar speed makes sense, but people still speed so they can overtake me so they can sit closer to the car in front.

You know as a driver that roads are in a shocking state at the moment, one of those potholes could cost you a tyre if you don't pay attention and if you're sensible you drive round them as much as possible, or slow down for the ones you have to hit. One of those potholes could see me on my arse, potholes often form around drains covers, which are normally at the side of the road, which is normally where you want to force cyclists to ride.

Whether you like it or not this is only heading in one direction. I find that in cities people have mostly been pretty quick on the uptake with respecting cyclists but rurally and in the suburbs you see some shocking driving around cyclists.

If everyone just chilled out and appreciated their own insignificance more then driving and cycling would be much more fun. People should have to take some kind of test to prove they can manage their time well enough that they don't need to imperil others trying to make up 10 seconds on a journey

It would be lovely to just confidently go from A to B (walking, cycling or driving) without some idiot trying to kill you.

@BlackberrySky

Well I would happily use the cycle lanes. Trouble is, it's full of parked cars....

Not quite the same thing I know, but I am astounded by the number of cars parked right up on the pavement where I live. When I am walking with a pushchair, I am regularly forced onto the road to get around them.
There are many very inconsiderate people in all walks of life, unfortunately.

Thing is if more people cycled then when you drive somewhere you'd not have to search for a parking space, the roads wouldn't be as congested and your trip would be simpler. I don't know any driver that doesn't complain about those two major factors about driving.

I noticed this through 2020 and 2021, whilst people weren't allowed out and I was travelling for work the roads were so quiet. As things opened back up the roads became busier. So I reverted back to my 90% off road route which was 4 miles longer than using the roads but far more pleasant than cycling on busy roads.

@MikeRafone

Yep! Congestion and parking (or the lack of) are two reasons why I avoid driving as much as possible.
IMO though, the problem with more cyclists on the roads is that there is currently no means of identifying cyclists who flout the rules of the road or who cycle dangerously. Motor vehicle drivers are held accountable, quite rightly, for committing driving offences but it is galling that those cyclists who also commit offences can get away Scot free through lack of a means to ID them.
Something for another thread though! 🤷

currently no means of identifying cyclists who flout the rules of the road or who cycle dangerously

yet registration doesn't work for drivers as 90% of hit and run crimes go unsolved https://www.psychreg.org/percentage-hit-runs-solved/#:~:text=In%202017%2C%20there%20were%20over,shortages%20are%20also%20an%20issue.

Could say the same about pedestrians

It should be mandatory for cyclists to use cycle lanes and to pass a cycling test to prove their roadworhiness. Too many cyclists vastly over-estimate their ability and then end up blocking single carriage roads, and some panic and get onto the pavement where they hurt pedestrians or themselves. Also in some places cyclists tend to comprise of people who can’t drive for medical reasons or because they have lost their licenses - these people should be walking or using public transport not cycling

I agree on the proviso that car drivers are required to complete this also. Most car drivers have no idea how vulnerable a cyclist can feel and I think would change their attitude towards cyclists if they lived an hour in our position.

@MikeRafone

True, but I don't just mean the hit and run crimes. I have seen posters on these forums boasting about how many drivers they have caught on their cameras then successfully reported for not giving them enough clearance whilst overtaking even if no collision occurred (dangerous ...yes!) The car registrations were, in these instances, easily traceable.
As a pedestrian, this week alone, my husband was a whisker away from being hit by a cyclist who sped through a red light when the pedestrian crossing was on green. I would have reported the cyclist in an instant if I could have ID'd him as that blatant disregard for road safety could have been tragic, especially if someone had been pushing a pram or walking with a small child. Where is the accountability for the cyclists who endanger the lives of pedestrians or other road users?

Cycle tracks are often poorly maintained and impractically designed, which is why many use the roads as they are entitled to do

Yes and often they are very well maintained and very well designed and STILL they aren't used by the MAMILs. I can think of two particular examples - on one, the kerbs are quite high so the charitable view is that if you miss the start of the cycle path you can't get on it very easily. I walk, run and cycle along it, so I know it's well surfaced etc.

The other is alongside the A24 in Dorking. It is a fast road with a 50 speed limit. It is a dual carriageway in sections. But the very good cycle path isn't good enough for some of the MAMILs.

But it's also worth noting that many cycle paths get used by dog walkers with extendable leads which are not safe for cyclists. I think they make it unsafe for cyclists, not the other way round.

I also agree that if you have to stop at every side road, it isn't worth it. But that is no longer the case since the changes to the Highway Code last year. Unless otherwise marked, pedestrians and cyclists have priority at side roads.

Also to the troll who supposedly thinks that if there's no pavement on a road, that means only drivers can use it, does that also mean that drivers will never drive or park on a pavement?

Thought not.

Op don't you realise that you can't ever say anything bad about cyclists. Even when they are on the pavement, going over crossings and through red lights. They are just the best most selfless people on the planet.

Where is the accountability for the cyclists who endanger the lives of pedestrians or other road users

As I said above, the cases of that happening are VERY few and far between.

Also, what about all the dog walkers with extendable leads, and pedestrians who walk along staring at their phones? Why are you only concerned about those terribly dangerous people on bikes? There are far more of the former two categories.

Driver parking on pavements are far more of a menace than cyclists on pavements.

@enchantedsquirrelwood not in my experience.

@enchantedsquirrelwood

As I said above, the cases of that happening are VERY few and far between.

ANY amount of cases, regardless of how few and far between they are, is unacceptable. You seem to think that cyclists committing offences is OK as you keep making excuses for them.

Also, what about all the dog walkers with extendable leads, and pedestrians who walk along staring at their phones? Why are you only concerned about those terribly dangerous people on bikes? There are far more of the former two categories.

Again with the numerical statistics (meaningless and unsubstantiated). I do tend to be less concerned about pedestrians on phones as I can avoid them (similarly with dog walkers) and the risk to injury from either seems less than being side swiped by an adult male riding at speed in a place where he shouldn't be!

Read an article that said broadly it used to be the poor that cycled and the rich that drove cars. Now it’s the other way round…

The poor get the bus

This is a good point. There's a cycle path approaching Richmond Park with a kerb, which is used by a lot of parents & kids wobbling around at the weekend, so the more "serious " cyclists ignore it and use the road, to keep the kids and themselves safe: since overtaking would require dropping off a kerb with no dropped sections into traffic, it's much safer to just start in the traffic and cycle predictably. As a driver and occasional cyclist, I support this approach.

I also agree that if you have to stop at every side road, it isn't worth it. But that is no longer the case since the changes to the Highway Code last year. Unless otherwise marked, pedestrians and cyclists have priority at side roads.

Is anyone going to be brave enough to assert this though? One near me certainly has "give way" dashed lines indicating that those on the cycle track should give way to the side road. Another goes around a roundabout, stopping at every entrance and exit. Needless to say, I just use the roundabout because then you only have to give way once.

I've quickly looked up that A24 one on Google Maps. It looks very narrow. Must be a pain if it's busy with pedestrians.

But by your own reckoning if there wasn’t a collision then what’s the problem? Your dh wasn’t hit.

if you have 90% of registered drivers not being caught when they do collide, then registration isn’t working. Tracking, black boxes would for both bikes and be a useful tool. Hire bikes in London are all registered but no one has used this system to find a cyclist

depends whether your objection is safety or retribution

@MikeRafone

But by your own reckoning if there wasn’t a collision then what’s the problem? Your dh wasn’t hit.

Wow! You don't see a problem with a cyclist riding at speed across a pedestrian crossing in a major city centre when the pedestrian light is on green? Well, the problem as I see it is that a cyclist who is prepared to hurtle through a red light in a busy city centre is dangerous, so yes, safety. I would imagine that this won't have been the first time he has done this but would hope he got enough of a shock on this occasion for it to be his last.
It is much the same as cyclists who report drivers for overtaking too closely. Even though no collision has occurred, they still film and report these incidences. Is that for safety or retribution?