To think my friend is in the wrong for putting down her daughters appearance?

[FrozenInThyme]

Hey, so I have a friend who has a teen daughter, just like I do. Lately, she's been talking to me about how worried she is that her daughter is "losing her looks" and that she doesn't look conventionally attractive. Honestly, it's made me really uncomfortablr. I meanbI think we all think our kids are beautiful in our own way, even if they're going through an awkward phase? Or at least if we don't we keep it to ourselves and know that there are more important things? My friend has brought this up a few times "losing her looks"/"not what she used to be" etc she's even informed me that she's has sleepless nights over it. I'm thinking if she brings it about again about telling her that I disagree with her or that it's not really a nice thing to say. Do you think that would be okay, or should I just stay out of it? I really feel bad for her daughter I think I would be crushed if I knew my mum had said something like that.

That’s awful

It's not nice, but is there some truth to it?

I would absolutely mention something, not sure of the best way but I think it is really important to make her realise the implications on her daughter's self esteem when her daughter picks up on her mother's feelings.

Truth how? Even if she is, what is she going to do about it? Cosmetic surgery? Or just listen to her mum telling her how she's losing her looks and end up with body dysmorphia or an ED

I'd be pulling her up on it but then I'm a bit of a bigmouth and say what I think a bit too much tbh. It might affect your friendship.

It's so messed up though. Losing her looks?! That's the sort of thing people say when women get old (also not acceptable)!

I'd be tempted to point out:

1. It's not necessary for a girl to be beautiful
2. A bit of acne/temporary weight gain/greasy hair/whatever is not the end of the world, there's bigger stuff to worry about
3. She would do SO much damage to her dd if she knew this is what her mother thought.
4. She's messed up to think her daughter's beauty or lack thereof reflects on her as if she's her mum's accessory and they're some kind of Barbie-Kelly pair.

Actually point no1 is enough.

Wtf.

In my eyes, my dd is a toddler Helen of Troy, a goddess of beauty, and always will be. This is a normal viewpoint for a mother.

I think if your friend is having sleepless nights about it, then she is very concerned. She's not saying it in a jovial or flippant way. This suggests to me that's she having some kind of weird unrelated anxiety thing and it's manifested itself in being worried about her daughters looks. I think she's probably in need of a bit of therapy. But obviously it's the most important thing in the world that her daughter doesn't overhear or pick up on any of this vibe from her mum.

to bully her own daughter, wow.

The sleepless nights bit stood out to me and I agree with @crostini .

I remember watching this reality show (don't rememberthe name of it) where Gigi and Bella Hadid's C-list celebrity mother was commenting on their appearance and weight. My kids were so shocked and thought their mom was terrible. But little did they know, my own mother - their sweet little grandmother - did the same thing to me! Because this mum you mention is losing sleep over her daughter's looks it does make me wonder if maybe she's dealing with some more serious mental health or anxiety issues. I realize now that my own mum had some mental health problems which has enabled me to forgive her. Still, her comments about my looks really hurt and made me feel like she loved me less because of my appearance soI do think it's important to tell this mum that her words can really affect her daughter and she should stop. Also absolutely make sure your own daughter doesn't overhear it either! And don't tell your own daughter, ever.

Well I would hope she's not saying any of his to her daughter! I interpreted the post as the friend confiding in the OP about her anxiety over this, not her telling her daughter she thinks she's ugly.

Like it or not, women's looks do matter in the real world. Pretty privilege is 100% a real thing.

@Aquaphant her daughter will pick up on it
I did. A lifetime of disordered eating, knowing I'm not good enough because I'm not slim or blonde
I can't change what isn't good enough about me without lots of money and expensive surgery so that just left me knowing I was never good enough or pretty enough for her
Than it moved on to her actually saying I was fat, ugly, no man would ever want me etc

Pretty privilege might be a thing but what are you going to do if you're not, change everything about yourself? If you can't afford to you're going to be feeling pretty shit

She sounds like an idiot and she's going to seriously fuck her daughter up, poor girl. You have to say something, I couldn't sit back and listen to anyone talking about their own child in such a negative way. And honestly, if the friendship doesn't survive it, can you really be friends with someone who would say such things?

She’s saying this about a teenager?!! She sounds lovely.

Losing her looks as in her actual features have changed as she's got older? Or the way the teenager is styling herself?

Jennifer Lopez has a daughter that was pretty but as a teenager has often been photographed dressed in awful clothes and an unflattering hair style.

That's just a phase she's going through like a lot of teenagers do.

gosh. maybe remind her we no longer live in a society where the only value a woman has is in her capacity to attract a man?

this is truly horrendous.

nothing wrong with helping children learn about good skincare/personal hygiene/dressing well.... but this is another level.

if this was my friend I would be having very strong words

Vile

I grew up with my mum telling me how I could be beautiful if I lost a bit of weight / did my hair a different way / wore what she chose.

It's done me a world of harm.

My dd made a drastic change to her appearance.. I was gutted tbh. I never say anything except to moan how much it's upkeep costs me!

Has the daughters appearance changed, could your friend really be worried about an eating disorder or poor hygiene/mental health and trying to articulate it in a way you'll give her reassurance it's all fine?

It's not nice on the surface but only you'll understand the dynamics of your friendship and why she's bringing it up.

My mother wanted a daughter who looked like Shirley Temple.

She got me and spent all of my life telling how I was too fat/too thin/hair should be curly (naturally poker straight)/blonde (naturally mousey brown)/should be taller/didn’t know how she had such a plain Jane daughter, all made worse when as a teenager I had to wear glasses etc etc.

I have never ever commented negatively on how my children look or choose to dress.

I’m in my 70s now have no self confidence and loathe looking in a full length mirror for any reason whatsoever.

This potentially is what your friend could do to her daughter.

Yes put her in her place. My mum always made it quite clear she doesn’t think i’m beautiful. We don’t have a close bond.

I used to work as a bra fitter and also felt really angry when mums used to bring their teenage daughters in and refer to them as fat in front of me.

I would go as far as to say I would no longer be friends with her. It might seem over the top, but it says a lot about your friend’s character and she sounds incredibly shallow and cruel.

Some mothers are just obsessed with appearance. Saw it in dc primary school where 2 mums who put lots of effort into their appearance for all occasions were very focused on their dd looking their best all the time. The dd were very critical of fellow female classmates who didn't have their hair styled or the right kind of school shoes etc.

I think its worth saying something for her DDs sake. Next time she says it I'd say 'what about that worries you?' and see where that takes you. You may be able to get a better gauge of whether she's just incredibly shallow and dramatic, or if she has some real issues going on. She obviously has the need to talk about it and you may just be able to say something that helps her see sense. At the very least you can tell her how damaging it would be for her daughter to hear her say it.

I would say it's more about the mother's own insecurities and lack of self esteem than her daughter.
But it will obviously affect the daughter if she finds out.
Yes, there is such a ridiculous thing as "pretty privilege" but we should all be teaching our kids to value themselves and others for qualities other than just their looks.
If she is a good friend I do think you should say something or at least ask why she feels that way. Maybe she had pressure put on herself regarding her looks when she was younger?

As she's a friend, I'd try to feel out where she's coming from - could she have been picked on for her looks as a teenager, and worry that her DD appears to be taking after her and will therefore get similar treatment?

I will be a bit gutted for my kids if they develop my oily acne prone skin - it's calmed down nowadays but has left me with scars and did get nasty comments. I remember when I was 17 and working in a shop, a customer told me to wash my face more as though I was dirty.