That my mum is hardly talking to me because she thinks I see my MIL more than I do?

[Extremelymadmoter]

It really is that simple. My mum had never taken kindly to any of my siblings or I getting on with our inlaws and despite constantly saying 'they're no threat to me' (when no one else mentions a threat), she will mock us if we get on with them 'oh you're in love with them aren't you! Aren't they wonderful (sarcastically)' and then if anything positive has ever been said about our in-laws, 'well I must be the awful parent then! Oh yes, what an awful mother I am'. Any time she happens to see my mother-in-law she watches out for 'crimes' that she commits in order to point score. For example, a few years ago my MIL took a fairly long phone call at our son's birthday party and that has NEVER been dropped.

The last couple of years as my children have got older, I have gone back to work full time. I don't have time to see my mum in the week anymore. She has never helped with childcare etc, so there is no regular visits

In the last month just as an example, we've been out for a family meal, I took my mum out for a birthday lunch and last week I went round for the day with all the children. During this say, I popped out to the shop and my mum quizzed my children on how often we see my MIL.
Now my mum has form for trying to catch me and my siblings out. As I child I remember watching in terror when Mum was talking to other school mums incase some wrongdoing of mine came out. My children immediately told me they'd been quizzed, and that they'd said they that they see my MIL at my son's football matches.

My MIL is a very autistic lady, who lives alone, has literally no friends and we see her on average every 6 weeks. This is because my MIL wouldn't cope with anymore 😆 My Mum simply doesn't believe this is all we see her. My mum also believes that my MIL 'gets away with bad behaviour without being taken to task', but that I will always pull my Mum up on things. This is again absolutely not true, but tbh, my MIL doesn't do alot to 'pull her up on'. She places no demands on us and lives a very simple life. She comes and watches the odd football match and occasionally has a cup of tea after.

When I got back from the shop, the atmosphere had changed and my mum was very off with me. I am very tuned into this behaviour after being trained through childhood and predicted she had 'caught me out' on something.

Yesterday, I got a text asking me why I told her I only see my MIL every 6 weeks, and how 'amazing' my MIL must be to be invited to our son's football matches as 'she never is' and again how it makes her mad that we don't 'pull your MIL up on her behaviours but she is fair game'.

I just sat in disbelief and once again confirmed that I do only see my MIL every 6 weeks, and that it's almost a year ago that this last blew up. She doesnt believe me, but whatever.

I am just in utter disbelief. For a start, it IS the truth and I now understand why 'little girl me' self harmed out of pure frustration. But secondly, what if I did see my MIL every day FFS..why does it matter??

My mum is absolutely ruining our relationship with this, not to mention her general twattery with thijfs like this that I've spent a fortune on therapy for.
But genuinely NOTHING I say to mum would stop her. She is ALWAYS right and will never back down. In her imagination, I am with my MIL 24/7 and I can't stop her as she thinks I'm lying

AIBU to be sick of this? She text me today about something unrelated and I just can't be bothered to reply. But of course, I'll be to blame for that too as my mum is godlike (in her mind)

God she sounds awful, and very similar to my mum. Does she also go all lut toxic about them like my mum does?

I need to get better at shutting it down and not desperately trying to prove that I don't see my MIL more.

The weird thing is, my parents are still married, have lovely holidays, friends etc. My mum simply cannot share affection. She has even tried to isolate her son-in-laws from their mothers....if there has ever been a fall out, my mum is overjoyed with the opportunity

Your poor MIL, so young 😔

The weird thing is, it's my parents who ate the 'successful' ones whereas my MIL lives a very lonely life, although it's what she wants.
My mum simply cannot stand to share any affection. It must all be hers.
She definitely has NPD

I am just exhausted with it.

www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/science/2022/aug/31/grey-rocking-how-to-bore-a-toxic-narcissist-out-of-your-life

Wow, this is excellent. Thank you

I have a similar issue. I had to go grey rock and it has worked. It's easier if she is the same with your siblings. My mum treats me very differently to my brothers - however my brothers are aware and frequently call her out for being cruel towards me.

Many of my friends have similar issues with their mums too. The mothers are all mid 70s so they'll never change.

We don't arrange visits unless DH is around as she never says a bad word if DH is here to witness it!

It's very sad and exhausting.

I can empathise my mum is an impossible woman to please, jealous, extremely toxic, and the reason we have been NC for a number of years. Been the best thing ever tbh, to be free if the drama and hearing all the details of her affairs, of which there have been many. Thankfully my late MIL was a wonderful woman, very supportive & caring, and just the best nanny my DS’ could ever have asked for. Let you mum just get on with it, don’t engage in ridiculous conversations, you are an adult you do not need to explain your movements, none of her business. Sorry you are going through it OP. I put up with my mum’s unreasonable behaviour for far too long, due to FOG. So pleased to be free of it, I wouldn’t dream of being like that with my boys, ever.

I just think you need to disengage and not get drawn in to any discussion. Possibly consider having hard line boudaries about her talking about your MIL or being rude to you. Eg “you’ve called me a liar and been rude so I’m hanging up the phone and won’t be talking to you for a while”.

I just sat in disbelief and once again confirmed that I do only see my MIL every 6 weeks, and that it's almost a year ago that this last blew up. She doesnt believe me, but whatever.

^ I think you need to switch tact. You don’t need to tell her how often you see your MIl. It’s none of her business. A reply along the line of “I can see who I want when I want. If you don’t stop questioning me about who I see and when then I will leave”. - Then follow up with leaving.

Have you spoken to your mum about her quizzing your children? I’d have been furious with her for that. Was she attempting to make them feel bad.

I’ll be honest op in your shoes I’d struggle not to take the low road and say things like…:”oh we see her all the time. W elite spending time with her”…”yea she was probably a much better parent than you. I wonder why you weren’t as good as her”.
I’m not suggesting you do that because that I a really toxic way to deal with things. However I started replying to my mum in those sort of tones and it seemed to work. However I was prepared to fall out and have no contact with her.

Same here. I absolutely dread being on my own with my mum.

Another graduate of the Crappy Childhood Fairy school of upbringing.
You have been conditioned to anticipate (and become anxious doing so) your DM’s response. You have been trained to try and mitigate these responses by placating her and feeding her ego.
Stop playing that game.
Grey Rock is the communication style you need with her.
“Whatever… Believe what you want.”
You’re leaving the ball in her court and telling her that her approval isn’t important to you.
Don’t engage further until she communicates in a positive way.
(Learn never to answer immediately, and always answer a question with a question so you don’t get hooked into doing something you don’t want to do. ie, “Are you busy tomorrow?” - “I have no idea, why?” “I need you to drop me at the take me to the supermarket and then the garden centre.” “Let me check my diary. That’s going to have to be some other time. I’m running the kids to birthday parties/soft play etc.”)

My Mother was an extremely jealous person and everything had to be about her. She had been a dancer and model when young and loved attention and woe betide anyone who had a light shine on them. She played up at weddings, christenings and get togethers. I went low contact, no announcements or trying to reason with her. It will get you nowhere. She used to have horrific propaganda campaigns against people.

I would not engage or justify anything but I have confronted my mum more than a few times about other behaviours not to do with in laws but she just doesn't get it. Some views are intrenched and your mum seems to think the reason she doesn't see you more or that you are not on the same page as her is because of your MIL. If your MIL is autistic maybe your mum just can't relate to her. It is bitchy nasty behaviour. She sounds toxic so I would disengage and just shut down any conversation with her by saying I am not discussing that with you mum. Don't leave your kids alone with her to be quizzed then have words thrown back at you. Does she know you have had therapy to deal with the things she has done or said in the past?

Agree with her, every single time.

’You love your MIL more than me.’ ‘Well, she is pretty awesome and easy to be around’

’You see your MIL all the time.’ ‘Not as much as I’d like, but she has her own life going on. She’s great with the kids though - very kind and enjoys spending time with them.’

’She goes to all the football matches.’ ‘It would be brilliant if you could come too. I’ll make us all a flask and some sandwiches. I’ll pick you up for practice at 7.30pm on Tuesday.’

Just keep leaning into it. Agree with her as much as you reasonably can. It’ll really get on her tits, especially when she’s standing in a muddy field at 7.30pm in November.

And the ‘what an awful mother I am’ shtick can do one. ‘You can be bloody awful to be fair. Listen to you banging on about MIL again - I swear you’re obsessed with her. Do you want me to invite her round here for tea? That way you can get to know her a bit better.’

I'd just be brutally honest at this stage and tell her you are absolutely sick to death of this shit and that you won't be responding to anymore sarcastic messages or comments about MIL. If she goes off in a strop so be it. Sometimes people just need to be told to pack it in.
From then on do exactly this. If MIL is mentioned don't respond. If she quizzes the kids then she doesn't see them alone. You don't have to put up with this as an adult. It's your life, you can see and talk to whoever you want, however much you want.

My mum has some MH issues, but her behaviour is nowhere near as bad as your mum's.

I think I recognise the "aren't I awful" behaviour though - or at least it's mirror-image. Because my mum had a toxic mum herself, but instead of saying "aren't I awful", she was absolutely petrified at the idea of being wrong, or being responsible for anything bad.

The smallest thing - forgetting the mayo for the picnic - would set her off into a massive spiral of it not being her fault, one of the rest of us was to blame, she does everything so well.

You can't fix her, but you can break the cycle. One, by limiting contact for yourself, and two, by modelling a "normal" person to your children.

Annalisa Barbieri's podcast is also good, especially the episode about talking to difficult old people.

She clearly has some experience of this. 😁

Grey rock is very good. Mine is 80s just gets worse ladies. In her eyes she should be priority not mils. !!! Only thing is i cant lie as she forgets nothing. I call once week its enough.

My mum does this. She likes to make snide comments about my MIL and expects me to agree with her, but I don't, my MIL is lovely. I read a book called "adult children if emotionally immature parents" which was very helpful. Your mum is behaving like a 13 year old. It's exhausting isn't it? All you can do is hold her at arm's length and see her poor behaviour for what it is.

Thank you so much for so many wonderful replies and so sorry others experience this.

I definitely need to stop justifying and excusing when I see my MIL. I need to be much stronger

Plus if it was two kids having a conversation, you'd see it as bullying, which it is.

And I'd agree it doesn't get better with age.

That said, I pushed back and my DM has improved somewhat, tho she slips sometimes.

Dr Ramani is good on utube. Yes its tiring. Mine was pandered to all her life. It didnt help matters.

My mum used to get jealous about me seeing my aunt, ie her sister. Yes her own sister.

It’s emotional immaturity I guess. I too know that feeling in the pit of your stomach when you’ve done something “wrong” and your mum is going to go mad.

Time for a bit more therapy? You are still jumping to her tune

Sounds like you have similar mother to mine. Look up daughters of narcissistic mothers. You aren't alone but it is mind boggling.

I thought this would give you a giggle… My mum was batshit crazy. My MIL isn’t my favourite person either, but that’s a whole other story. I didn’t know her quite as well as I do now.
To set the scene here:- When DD1 was born, things with my mum because intolerable, with her literally driving through our garden in an effort to see DD RIGHT NOW… She had never had boundaries and had no intention of respecting ours. We had to threaten to get a restraining order to stop her from turning up and banging on doors and windows and calling incessantly. She got wind of MIL’s impending visit to meet DD1 (about 3m old at that stage), which involved an 8hr drive to the airport and then a five hour flight to our place. (Australia.) DM announced that she would be there to greet MIL. I had to let her know that wasn’t appropriate as MIL would have flown through the night to get there and would be arriving stupidly early. She kept pushing. It was obvious that her intention was simply marking her territory, so I said “You’ve had three months of being the only grandma in town… She can at least meet her granddaughter with just us. Let her have her moment.” My DM piped up with “But I’m more her grandmother than SHE is!”
Ummmm…. Riiiiiiight. God she was exhausting.

“Nope. I’m not doing this.” Hang up, walk away, go home. Every time she starts up. Then take a break from her for a few weeks. Starts again? Make it a month or two. Each time, make it longer.

She’ll either stop, or she’ll be on time out forever. Either way, you’ll get a break from her behaviour.