To think we simply can’t compete?

[Molehillminnie]

Mid 50s colleague selling house. On the market for close to £1M. Bought for 1/5 of that 30 years ago. Always going on about how the younger generation should save and be like her.

We’re 15 years younger, have pretty decent jobs etc but there is no way we’ll be able to benefit from property price increases in the same way. The huge jumps between 2000-2008 will never be replicated. Nothing more to say really, just having a rant!

Having a house for a million pounds is not average. You are comparing yourself to someone very well off.
The population is predicted to decrease in the future and house prices will fall.

The real test isn't interest rates etc its the ratio between average earnings and house prices in a given area

yep

YABU because it's cyclical

What's cyclical, wages haven't grown in real terms since the 08 crash...

I have no idea how a young couple could get a deposit together for that amount of money.
parental help much likely which makes it harder for those who don't have it despite good jobs.

@peachgreen I'm sorry.

I think you are being envious. There will always be someone better off and worse off.

Yep. I grew up in a council house and the only reason I got on the property ladder was that my Mum died and I bought it (worked for a bank so 5% mortgage when interest rates were spiralling in the teens)

We're in our mid 50's and feel exactly the same way. We were lucky that we could buy our house in our early 20’s when at the beginning of our careers and still have money to holiday and enjoy life.
I worry for young adults and especially for my 3 adult children who have professional careers and are having to negotiate this housing situation.

I don't disagree. But riddle me this. How are people buying these houses for said half a million when they come onto the market?

I think a lot of people are getting on and are managing to compete. There are a lot of good jobs around. And they aren't always the same jobs that bought those houses 30-40 years ago.

How are people buying these houses for said half a million when they come onto the market?

Because loads of people have hundreds of thousands in equity. And loads are helped by parents. I sold my first flat to a brother & sister in their early 20s who were bought it by their parents. My brother sold his flat last yr to someone buying it for their daughter.

you can't predict the housing market and it's never fair because life isn't.

I bought for the first time in 1984. The flat had doubled in price by the time I sold it in 1988. Our next house did equally well and doubled in 2 years (TBF we did a lot of work to it) .

But the next house we bought was in 199O. It needed rebuilding from the ground up and interest rates were 13/14/15%. We lived on pulses and veg from the market and our kids wore second hand clothes. Then the 1992 crash came and we were in negative equity for over 10 years. We kept it 18 years and when we sold it we broke even. It had gone up a bit but the huge mortgage costs and the extensive refurbishments ate into any potential profit. It didn't matter. We had 18 years in a family home we loved.

we've been in our current home 15 years and it's increased in value about 25% since we bought it. But that could change tomorrow. Again, it doesn't matter. We didn't buy it to get rich. We bought it to have somewhere nice to live.

Owning a home in the U.K. isn't about potential profits on paper - for me it's more about stability and security.

Owning a home in the U.K. isn't about potential profits on paper - for me it's more about stability and security.

I think young people who can't get on the ladder are in complete agreement.

@watersprites Thank you, that’s kind. I’ll be okay, just a bit of downsizing required!

Just when I thought things couldn't get any more ridiculous.

That's not how the economy works. It's the other way around. It used to be that
necessities were affordable and luxuries were expensive, so the average family
could easily buy a house, but very rarely go on holiday abroad.

Now, buying a property is a completely impossible goal for lots of people, because they simply cannot raise the deposit they need while renting, but the things that used to be considered luxuries are much more achievable.

I pay £1100 a month on my mortgage, which is still less than I'd pay if I were renting. I could fly return to New York for less than half of that. This is the issue. It’s not that luxuries are cheap – it’s that basic human necessities are so incredibly expensive that they have essentially become luxuries now.

@peachgreen good luck 😊

@Mygrandadwasmywingman It's a shame you waited until your last line to point out that your parents were council house profiteers.

The disparity between what was paid for the purchase of council houses and the value today isn't down to us 'boomers', it was down to the government of the day. I don't blame the people who bought the houses - why wouldn't you? It was pushed as a way to leave an inheritance for your children, but they should have made it law that the money received was used to build more social housing.

I do despair for my poor grandchildren who are now on council waiting lists for properties to come up. What's disgraceful is that the financial sector allowed these increases in income vs mortgage which has driven the property values we see now. Finally, I'd love to see a ban on foreign investment in UK property (another market driver). It feels like property can't find the value it should because so many are invested in making sure they get their cut.

It used to be that necessities were affordable and luxuries were expensive
No. Necessities were expensive and luxuries were few and far between. Why do you think people had wedding lists when they got married? - because it was expensive to kit out a house!

Now, buying a property is a completely impossible goal for lots of people, because they simply cannot raise the deposit they need while renting, but the things that used to be considered luxuries are much more achievable.
It sounds like you are agreeing with my argument.

Yes, sure, it was more expensive then to kit out a house than it is today, but what does that matter if you can't afford to buy a house in the first place?!

Most people could happily make do without a microwave, a sofa or a freezer for a while. That's not the issue. The issue is that they can't afford to buy a house to put them in! Not because those things are "too cheap" but because property prices have risen to many, many times salaries!

What I've spent on decorating and furnishing my flat is a ridiculously trivial amount compared to what it cost to buy it. Yes, I have a Nespresso machine, a big telly, a nice sofa, a microwave, a nice toaster...so what? It probably cost me about a month's take-home pay to buy ALL of that. You're acting like people somehow wanting these things has anything to do with buying houses...it doesn't.

I'm not agreeing with your argument at all, no. I can't believe you actually think it makes any sense whatsoever.

I agree, of the people I know who own houses it's because of inheritance or a handout from their parents for the deposit (to the tune of tens of thousands). Without that it's nearly impossible to save enough while renting.

To all the people giving deposits to their children, I commend your generosity - but it really shouldn't have to be like that. People who get a good education (along with student debt) and a decent job should be able to aspire to owning their own home - but even the prices of small crappy homes in not very good areas have shot through the roof and are out of bounds to many.

In my city most of the new apartments being built are either for student accommodation or rental only, charging extortionate rates and owned by foreign investment companies making huge profits while availing of government tax breaks.

That combined with wage stagnation for the last decade or so means that most average people are priced out of their own city, never mind trying to save for a deposit. It's so depressing.

It's the old 'just stop buying avocados' all over again...
Hey everyone, if you just stop buying coffee and avocados you could own a home!
All you have to do is never go out or have a social life, make sure you scrimp and save everything you have for the next 10 - 15 years, and by the time you get just enough of a deposit (never mind the 40 year mortgage that will take you past retirement age) for a dingy studio flat that smells and has no windows, the sale price has shot up and you need another few grand for the deposit... living the dream eh?

The real test isn't interest rates etc its the ratio between average earnings and house prices in a given area

yep. FIL worked as a postman in the 1970s, MIL was a SAHM: they were still able to buy a three-bed semi-detached in a good part of town. There is no way that could happen now, no way at all.

We were luckily enough to be gifted a very substantial amount of cash to put towards our home. Without that and with one of us working and the other at home with the children, we'd be renting a 2 bed apartment in a rough part of town and struggling to boot. Eternally grateful. The market is fucked up.

I think the biggest problem is actually salary multiples - and we need a way higher deposit than £15k!

I have saved £20,000 while paying rent in London. It’s taken me 5 years. The problem is actually that I need more like a £100k deposit and a salary of over £60k to even think about getting a one bed flat.

I agree that what we thought were luxuries back them are seen as necessities now.

i posted upthread about buying my first flat in 1984. I didn't have a phone, a washing machine, a wardrobe or even a bed.

I hung my clothes on hooks on the wall and slept on a mattress on the floor I had a second hand Baby Belling 2 ring hob with mini oven and a second hand fridge freezer. My "table" was a shelf propped up on 2 x trellis and my next door neighbour gave me two chairs.

I was working for an electrical retailers at the time so I was able to get a damaged tv at a discount and for music I went to the library to rent cassettes for free. I went to the laundrette twice a month to wash and dry my laundry. Luckily carpets were included in the price of the flat but I was never able to buy curtains.

Looking back my years there were more like camping than living but I 'owned' own home and I felt like the queen of the world.

I've made a lot of money on my current flat, purchased 1997 - but my first flat I sold after 10 years for exactly the same price I'd paid for it (& I'd spent money on double glazing, extending the lease, installing heating...)
I was lucky - lots of my friends got stuck with negative equity.