To expect the cleaner to clean for the time she’s paid?

[Annatinks]

Hubby and I both work full time (my hours exceed full time vastly - my choice) We have a two year old son and a late teen who has MH struggles.

Whilst we’ve always tried to be tidy, I’ve been constantly frustrated by the deep cleaning things taking the minimal free time I get and how tired I always am (autoimmune disease). My husband is good at general tidy but doesn’t really notice things like skirting boards, glass cleaning, light shades, door handles etc.

When he was promoted recently with a small but noticeable pay rise he spoke to me about the idea of employing a cleaner to do those deep clean things fortnightly and to mop/hoover etc so on the day before/day of/day after we have a bit more family downtime. I was quite negative about it because of feeling like “we’re not that kind of people” but then feeling horribly judgemental and saying yes we’d try it.

The cleaner is amazing 🤩
She came and had a look round visit and suggested things she could do in the two hours she proposed she comes each fortnight. She polishes the taps so they look new and her hoover is soooo much better than ours!

But…

She’s only been 4 times and last fortnight she left arrived late and left early (about 20min less time). Hubby said a mild “oh are you off already?” (I wasn’t there, he WFH) and she explained how yes she’s got to know our 2bed house better now so it doesn’t take her as long. She then made some comment about having to drop some clients before because they didn’t understand that.

Is this normal? Should a cleaner who quotes two hours and is paid two hours be able to knock off early regularly?
Neither of us get to knock off early for efficiency so it seems unreasonable to me?

Hubny wants to cancel her because he feels like she’s going to take the Mickey ongoing but I’ve appreciated the help soooo much I’m reluctant for it to stop.

You say she's amazing and you couldn't do without her so don't! If she completes everything to a high standard in less than 2 hours, she deserves to get rewarded!

What more do you want exactly? She pretend to dust for 20 mins? Clean an area that's not part of her job?

Or you could replace her with a mediocre cleaner who does an ok job for the full 120 mins.

On another note, you could stop your voluntary, unpaid extra hours at work you chose to do and give yourself some more free time. Sounds like you're trying to apply your bonkers standards to your cleaner!

As she is paid by the hour, I would say that DH has mentioned that she said it isn't actually taking her two hours to do the jobs you agreed so could she also do x, y or z whenever she has spare time? Though I'd keep it friendly if she's good - decent cleaners are worth their weight in gold!

Ours is trustworthy and reliable, and does a decent standard clean, which is what I need her to do, but she's not all that at deep clean work (have asked sometimes when we've been on holiday), I'd forgive her an earlier finish if she was fantastic at that!

We felt like it was the former but perhaps our inexperience misunderstood the latter. She told us her hourly rate, we said we could afford two hours and she suggested things she could do while here

Shes taking the piss. Paid for 2 hours, should be staying 2 hours.

My cleaner used to do 2 hours. We've moved house and she said it would take an hour longer more or less. Some weeks she'll get it done it 2.5 hours, some weeks it's messier and it will take the 3 hours. Some weeks she'll do things like hoover and put a damp cloth over the headboards, or start cleaning out the fridge. If I want a specific job done I'll ask her. But I'm paying her to clean the house and not for the hours. I'd say that's what she's saying to you about the 2 hours- you're paying her for a job, if you want to charge by the hour she might not be interested. It's up to you- is the house as clean after 1 hour and 40 mins?

Depending on if you feel comfortable doing so I’d hugely appreciate a PM of your list so I could copy the things relevant to our home.

We literally clean before the cleaner comes because we don’t want her to think of us as untidy 🙈 🤣 We feel a bit outclassed in the knowing how this works!

So many stingy taskmasters on here. The OP said the cleaner is amazing! I repeat amazing! Where is the thanks? Perhaps I'm missing something and she's paid £50 an hour or something. I'd imagine it's more like a tenner though.

We felt like there were some short cuts. Eg she says she general cleans the kitchen (we always have the washing and dishes done already) but it’s only externally and I was surprised that she didn’t wipe over the blinds or clean the inner microwave. But then perhaps we were looking for improvements because we felt short changed?

She hasn’t ever stay over and doesn’t chat much because hubby is usually in zoom meetings and I’m usually in the office

I’ve had cleaners for years and, in my experience, a good one is worth their weight in gold.

My current cleaner has been with me now for 2.5 years. She does three hours once a week and I wouldn’t even think to see what time she arrives or leaves. All I know is that my house is spotless, she’s lovely, and I trust her.

Our cleaner also does 2hrs. I employ her to clean (no tidying) living room, kitchen, dining room, 3 bathrooms, sweep & mop all downstairs, Hoover all upstairs. These are core jobs and always get done. It never takes 2hrs, sometimes it's more, sometimes less depending on how much traffic the house has had that week.

She brings her own equipment, she buys my cleaning stuff when she's doing her shopping, if I ask her to do an extra job such as clean the fridge/microwave or windows and/or blinds she will happily oblige.

So if it's just been me & dh at home and there's no extra jobs I don't begrudge her leaving earlier than the 2 hours.

How much are you actually paying her? If it's £30+ for two hours then, yes, she needs to find something else to clean. If it's more like £20-25 then you're underpaying her and I can see why she's leaving early once the basic work is done.

I think since you negotiated the arrangement based on her hourly rate and your being able to afford 2 hours, then you should hold her to that. Her shortening the time and saying she had to drop clients because they didn't understand that, is her attempt to get out of the deal she sold to you and that you consented to. I would consider that to be out of bounds and I wouldn't trust her. I would feel like she was always looking for another angle to wiggle out of what she said she would do.

What is the normal hourly rate in your area and is she in that range?

It’s £15 per hour.

I think she’s amazing because she’s saving me doing things that I never have the energy to do. Having said that I have zero cleaner experiences to compare it to? She does miss things that I would presume would be done (eg we have a fancy soap dispenser in the bathroom that our 2yr old sprays toothpaste on because he turns the brush on when it’s not in his mouth yet, I kinda thought if she’s cleaning the bathroom that sort it of thing would be done but it isn’t)

Yes it’s £30 for the two hours which seemed mid average for our area

I agree with the PPs who say she’s taking the piss. It is also a personal pet hate of mine when a cleaner makes a veiled threat like yours did about other clients she had to drop because they didn’t understand her leaving early. It’s happened to me before and is a power play to try to put you in the weaker position of needing her more than she needs you.

It’s very unpleasant to say the least when you’re paying her the hourly rate she asked for and up to what you can afford.

My advice is you need to stand up to her now or these power plays will continue and probably get worse over time. It might seem crap now when you think she’s doing such a great job but honestly it never goes well when someone you’ve hired to do a job makes you feel like they’ve got you over a barrel/like a mug.

I run a domestic cleaning business. This is one reason why we don't charge per hour but quote for a full house clean. After attending for a while cleaners will naturally speed up as they get to know the house, deeper jobs such as tackling limescale/ mould etc is on top of so quicker each week to clean. Obviously some jobs may then take longer one visit if things are particularly untidy, heavily soiled etc. it's awful to feel someone is timing you to the minute if you are fully cleaning what is agreed and working hard and taking pride in your job.
I would clarify if you are paying her per job or for her time. Obviously if it's for her time then she needs more jobs to do as 20 minutes is a long time to be finishing early in my opinion.

I think £30 is a good salary outside central London and middling in it. If you aren't in an expensive part of the country (sorry if I've missed this) and if she isn't working for an agency (taking possibly a large cut) then you're perfectly reasonable to insist on her staying for the full time. Cleaners do take time to learn about your house but it's more that they aren't able to work efficiently, even if very experienced and good at the job, for the first couple of weeks. £15 is a reasonable p/h wage for cleaning for the entire hour if it's paid in cash, she keeps all of it, and you aren't in central London. If you are, then I would consider paying £16 / £17 p/h and insisting that she works for the two hours, cleaning whatever there is to clean.

It might also be that your house is already very clean and there genuinely isn't much to do! I have no experience of this...

I know.

If her work is satisfactory, I wouldn't quibble about a few minutes here and there.

People who are paranoid about being "ripped off" perhaps shouldn't employ household workers.

👏

If a good worker i wouldnt worry too much but might leave a list, i just fired a student who was meant to help me with the garden but he just stood about and watched my bees.......very slow...got rid !!

Thank you @tigerbear0906
It’s helpful to have your perspective.

Do you have any templates of what you would guess is a suitable achievement in 2hrs if all tidying is completed in advance of arrival on a small 2bed terrace? (Only thing bedrooms have done is hoovering/mopping)

We live in Sussex so definitely not central London. No agency involvement and she’s paid cash (whether she declares it or not I don’t know)

The house is tidy and surface clean but on closer inspection definitely not clean. That kinda level where friends could pop in unexpected fine but I’d be mortified if my mother did.

@ZeldaWillTellYourFortune @squidgybits this is precisely WHY I’m asking. I don’t want to be too picky but neither a mug and we have zero experience hiring household workers. As previously said to @Jk987 I think she’s amazing because I’m not having to do these things but there are things missed that I’m surprised aren’t done (eg only outer microwave is wiped over not inside) so I’m trying to get a balanced view

YABU you’re paying her for a job not time. If it is time then why ?

I would consider the inside of a microwave to be an element of a periodic deep clean, not part of a weekly 2-hour clean. (Weekly full day clean, yes to inside micro.)

The toothpaste spray is gross. It's essentially a bodily fluid and you should clean that yourself.

Wow. Two cleaners doing a total of 5 hours each! Do you Iive in Downton Abbey?