Another bail out whilst the rest of us suffer

[Tryingtofit]

Fed up listening to news, tax payers bailing out another company whilst the rest of society has to bare the brunt of real life.

Water bills have been on the rise, with the annual bill for an average household in England and Wales hitting £448 in April.
Bills are set to rise again in 2025.
It came after the Times reported bills could rise by as much as 40%, a figure Mr Eustice dismissed, saying it would be "far lower".

Shadow energy secretary Ed Miliband said the situation at Thames Water was "an absolute scandal".Asked whether the company should be nationalised, he replied: "I don't think the answer to the water company's crisis is to pay out billions of pounds to shareholders, when that money could be going into sorting out what is happening in the water industry".

Fair enough!

Since the Govt power grab in 2020, I’ve worried that they don’t know or care how the economy works to feed us all.

Maybe too much worry too soon!

Really? I'd have never worked that out for myself 🤔

But it still doesn't mean those who also think a roof over our heads alongside it are being silly.

I don't think I'm a developed country expecting both to be affordable is asking too much!

Reading

And let’s all sing the chorus line “when’s the next general election? Can it hurry up please?”

We are with south east water and recently had no water for a week (third time in a year). SEW blamed customers for using too much water when we've just had one of the wettest springs. If they stopped paying out millions to shareholders and invested in the crumbling infrastructure and stopping leaks then things would be much better. Time for them to be renationalised.

Sorry, you actually get billed for water in England? I thought my sister had been taking the piss years ago when she briefly moved down there.

Can’t actually believe I’m having to recommend this to people that aren’t in a third world country but stick a couple of buckets outside, boil it, filter it, you’ve now got usable water to cook and wash dishes with (don’t recommend drinking it but the boiling and filtering will make it usable for cooking and cleaning).

That takes time and the government can't be arsed to suddenly run a water company

Thames Water does not just supply drinking water. They also do sewers, for a larger area than they supply water.
I am in an area where water is from Affinity but sewers are by Thames. One local sewer is blocked and they have been pumping 24/7 for about a week now.

I think it's coz otherwise the people aren't going to have water as the government can't be arsed to nationalise it. They let the companies have a monopoly and now they are stuck.

Yes so there's a few ways - some people just pay a flat rate whatever they use. Other people have a meter.

During to cost of living people some people on meters are already getting inventive and doing things like you suggest. And reusing water they've cooked with/washed with. Which I guess is good for the environment but feels very much unlike the way it was a couple of years ago.

This is a company that has been accruing corporate debt whilst paying shareholders billions in dividends this is a criminal offence in some countries but lets all argue about semantics

It's a complete and utter fucking disgrace. Not sure why 17% thinks that the OP is being unreasonable? Perhaps they hadn't read the first post properly?

No, just contrary, polls on here are rubbish

It’s extraordinary bad management.

On paper what TW did made sense - debt could be paid by the bills.

But the corporate debt was sensitive to RPI while the utility bills are pegged to CPI - two different inflation indices that have diverged. Any competent CFO would see that you needed to hedge the divergence.

After the financial crisis, the regulators brought in personal accountability for senior managers of UK banking entities (even if international companies) and that has focused minds entirely. For instance in recent public banking failures the UK arms were actually okay. But it has also given London a hard reputation to work in and to do business compared to New York, Hong Kong etc.

But in so many other sectors there is no accountability at all: the auditors should have flagged this risk for instance and they get off every single time.

PWC did the accounts in 2021. Questions there for sure.

Then there’s the bosses of train operators, utilities, councils.. It’s endless.

London started to gain water pipes across the city from the 1600s and by 1700s most people connected to it. The infrastructure started to struggle in 1800s and was replaced by iron pipes. Nationalisation in 1900s meant universal availability, but also a priority order for repair and replacement. Thames Water area was particularly struggling from underinvestment by the time it was privatised in 1989, full of leaks and lead replacement plans. It has never quite got on top of the huge programme of work. Privatisation was specifically hoped to bring investment first, and it did bring some, but the trouble is that nobody has been willing to let water bills go up enough to actually fund the replacement of all the pipes and treatment centres that London needs.

I'm so angry about this. The shareholders have had dividends and they haven't reinvested. Now we pay, again. Who's going to bale us out?

I do believe the water company should be nationalised and belong to the government. Water is essential, without it, we'd all die.

Don’t blame the investors which by the way includes most of you through pensions.

The investors/pensions providers invest in companies exactly for price growth (unlikely in a utility where takeovers are rare) or returns. If there is none then they sell and the company can’t fund itself as the share price drops.

I believe water shouldn’t have been privatised and I am an ardent capitalist.

This.

These scalping shysters have been letting the infrastructure fall apart while making sure that shareholders got massive dividends, ending up with an insolvent company, while polluting our beaches and waterways with untreated sewage and not even managing to keep the taps running.

In 2019 alone, they paid out more than £60bn in dividends.

Absolutely time for them to be renationalised.

100% agree @Tryingtofit
The company has had all the money taken out via dividends and no investment in new infrastructure and fixing existing issues.
Tax payers shouldn't have to pay for this.

Some things are natural monopolies . Water is one of them for obvious reasons. Rail is another.

A private company should never be allowed to run something like water supply since a monopoly supplier can have no competition.

And private companies always prioritise their shareholders above their customers. The end.

I read it wasn’t a bail out? That the government is going to take over, as in renationalise Thames Water

“While the Government has stressed that any rescue plans are currently within the contingency stages, one of the options reportedly being considered is placing Thames Water into a special administration regime (SAR).
SAR was introduced in 2011 and would essentially mean temporary public ownership. It was used for the first time in 2021 for the rescue of energy supplier Bulb, which was then sold on to Octopus Energy after a year.”

”The Government said to be drawing up contingency plans for the firm’s emergency nationalisation. Environment Minister Rebecca Pow moved to reassure Thames Water’s 15 million customers that their water supplies will be protected.”

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/companies/who-owns-thames-water-what-we-know-about-its-ownership-amid-collapse-fears-and-how-much-it-pays-in-dividends/ar-AA1dar5P

I worked for a water company for years. the top bosses joke that they cannot fail and every single one has done no capital investment since privatisation. It is revolting.

Aren't Thames water the ones chucking a load of sewage into rivers? I think we probably need to nationalise the lot but not sure it's the cheaper option short or long term

Where was ofwat when all of this was happening? All the mechanisms are there Tom prevent this sort of thing happening. Unfortunately we have incompetent civil servants who fail to do do their job and regulate time and time again. Bank of England, ofgem, home office being just a few other examples.

Presumably because you had water? We can't live without water, whereas we can live without houses as such, though obviously shelter of some sort is required in bad weather.