To think that my 14 year old daughter has to be told no sometimes?

[Tallulu]

I’m having trouble with my 14 year old daughter at the minute. For background she’s my only girl; I have three boys (2 older than her, 1 younger).

She was a really sweet little girl growing up. But when she hit 13 or so, the teen hormones hit and she started shutting herself in her room, barely speaking to me, being stroppy and argumentative, all the usual teen stuff I suppose.

Lately it’s gotten worse. Many days she won’t get out of her bed to go to school and prefers to spend all day in bed texting. She stopped doing a sport she played for years. She badgers me constantly to buy her clothes, makeup, perfume, or she just nicks mine. I thought getting a part-time job might help but she flat out refuses. I ask if she wants to come on walks with me or exercise classes, she just rolls her eyes. She refuses to do any chore around the house even though her brothers all do their share.

Recently I found a vaping kit in her room and some alcohol (which she took from her older brother who is 19). I was furious at first but when I’d calmed down tried to have a talk with her and cleared the air (or so I thought at the time).

Lately she will badger me, all day, to get a lift to a nearby town to visit a female friend of hers that I’ve never met. And I mean badger. She will shout, cry, slam doors, moan about how unfair it all is that I won’t let her do “anything she likes to do” or “have any fun”. Today I tried to compromise and asked her why didn’t she invite the friend up to our house, but she didn’t want that. I said why don’t you go with friend to the cinema? “Cinema’s boring.” She accused me of “keeping her locked up” (not true, last weekend she was out to a teen night at a club with aforementioned friend and stayed at her house!) and I tried to explain that I can’t just let her do whatever she wants all the time.

She responded that she hates me, she’s never going to speak to me again and, sarcastically, “thanks for making [her] even more unhappy than she is right now”.

I know she’s 14 so her social interactions are pretty much everything to her, but I have to protect her too. I explained to her my concerns about her hanging around in another town with people I never met and whose parents I don’t know, not knowing where she’s going in said town, and how it’s hard to trust her after finding the vaping kit and alcohol. But she doesn’t want to engage with me at all.

Punishment wise my husband (who is a lot stricter than me) does not deal well with her behaviour; he just shouts at her. I try taking her phone away for, say, a set number of days, or refusing to give her spending money but nothing seems to have an impact. Whatever limit I have set to the number of days the punishment will last, when it’s over we’re back to square one.

The whole situation has left me feeling low and stressed. The tension and the arguments with her are constant. I feel so sad that it’s like this with my only daughter.

Please, any advice? AIBU in telling her no sometimes? She makes me feel like I’m a terrible mum.

Has the school been in touch with you about her absences? Were you honest with them about why she wasn't in?

Imo you need to remain calm and make it clear that you won't be facilitating her social life unless she fulfills her sude if the bargain - i.e. going to school, speaking civilly to you and doing at least something to help around the house.

I went through a phase much like your daughter and my mum bore the brunt of it.

I now realise I was incredibly unhappy at school and under a huge amount of pressure academically and being pushed into a future I didn't want and surrounded by people I didn't fit in with. So I rebelled. Better to be the rebel than feel like an outsider.

But I couldn't understand that at that time and I couldn't have expressed it.
Look to the school for reasons - is she demanding make up etc because she's trying to "keep up" with other girls for example? Is she experiencing low level bullying? In spite of this friend is she actually feeling lonely?

Next time she says "I hate you" tell her you love her.

Tell her until she behaves properly and treats you and her father with respect there will be no phone, no outings, no new purchases of any kind. Set expected grade goals and rewards to incentivise her.

Drive her to and from school until things remedy if at all possible. And do not let her see people you do not know or stay over in their house. You’ve no idea of what influence she’s being exposed to otherwise.

I would suspect the friend is a boy/man.

What leapt out at me from your post was this…

She responded that she hates me, she’s never going to speak to me again and, sarcastically, “thanks for making [her] even more unhappy than she is right now”.

Have you asked her what exactly is making her so unhappy in the first place?

I’m assuming she’s Year 9 which quite honestly is like the academic equivalent of the witching hour for girls (as mum of an 18yo DD and having working for 5 years in an all girls secondary school!)

There is a lot that the school should be able to put in place…counselling, reduced timetable, specialist support if there are deeper/more significant issues.

Is it possible that the friend may be more than that? Teenage girls don’t just slope off to meet boys and I’ve known a few exhibit the kind of behaviour you’re describing at a similar age when they’ve been questioning their sexuality.

Add in the pressure of GCSE choices, social media and the friendship issues that seem to erupt at this age, plus hormonal factors…

I think what I’m trying to say is that it’s not unusual for chaos to break out at this age, so don’t feel uncomfortable asking for help. It’s entirely possible that asking the right questions and getting good support in place will get her back on track.

I would say no, and explain why - then if she asks again you say no, walk away, if she keeps asking Inwould be calm and say - if you ask me again I will say no today and tomorrow - every time you ask will add an additional No day - you have a choice I suggest you use it.

Just rtft, further inclined to agree with others that could be something dodgy going on.

She’s withdrawn, missing school, asking for/borrowing items that are all to do with appearance sexualising her, she’s on her phone all day (when children are in school) - who is she messaging?

The extent of her relationship with J may be a cover up; she may be meeting up with and staying over with someone else. She could point out anyone at school and say she’s meeting them.

If it were me I would keep her very close and cut off possible contact routes to her until you know what is going on. Speak to J’s parents urgently and find out whether she has visited/stayed there. If she has been meeting with an older boy/man she has been manipulated and not her fault.

Whatever the truth, she needs very firm boundaries and protection. Others suggestions to incentivise school/chores are good. Get the school involved to support her too.

Because grooming for gang activity/county lines is a very real thing.

Because men will groom children and their victims will say they're just going to see/stay with the random girl their Mum saw in the distance at school.

Because other girls can be groomed by gang members/men to bring their friends along.

Because a girl who doesn't seem to be interested in boys, whether that's true or is a convenient lie to throw parents off the scent, is a perfect target for grooming.

I think the most concerning thing I've read on here, is that when you remove her phone, she seemingly doesn't care and retreats to her room.

This is not a normal' reaction. Most teens would be angry/horrified to lose their phone and their reaction would be very different to what you're experiencing!

I think you need to seek advice from school asap, there are a lot of red flags in your post and in your shoes I'd be worried she was being groomed. School can then do a referral to early help or you can refer yourself?
I work in social care, so not exactly inexperienced with what you're going through with your dd!

I think the most concerning thing I've read on here, is that when you remove her phone, she seemingly doesn't care and retreats to her room.

This is not a normal' reaction. Most teens would be angry/horrified to lose their phone.

Hmmm maybe. Or she's acting unconcerned because she's trying to trick you into thinking it's not an effective punishment. Or... she has another phone you don't know about.

Yes. When kids absolutely kick off at school because their phone is being confiscated, you know that it's their actual phone. When they shrug, hand it over and aren't waiting to collect from 1s after the end of the day, if not earlier than that - that's when you know you've confiscated a decoy.

With the badgering I've found rather than give the same answer give the answer "you already asked that and you know the answer" followed by changing the subject. Asking them very non descript things. So don't ask specifically about school, friends etc. Ask the, something open ended such as "have you watched any good films lately"

Agree with speaking to school. Agree with making other things dependent on school (but just be aware if it's MH related the not going won't be deliberate so be aware how you make demands and regards).

For example she can't demand stuff during school day if she isn't there.

But she can earn lifts to town or money to spend by doing x y and z.

If she's never allowed out because she doesn't attend school you'll get into a negative cycle.

I would ask school outright if you need to be concerned by her friendship with J. Make it clear you aren't asking them to break confidence and discuss J. It could be as simple as they are in a relationship and either aren't ready to express that or are just experimenting and aren't ready to make an announcements of sexuality either way. They could just be friends. But alienating your dd over the friendship will push her further into it.

I was thinking the same... Search her room when she's out.

Sorry to hear about your teen.

been there - done it - almost ruined my relationship - the challenges - the slams, screams, any authority ignored…

we eventually reduced authority to - (1) we won’t make food for you unless you are telling us you will be home for food and (2) when staying away overnight please let us know you are safe (3) no visitors or drugs in our home.

life was miserable for all of us and our other daughter. It got so bad - we stopped going home - because it felt like a war zone, never a home. We found reasons to be out constantly.

she ignored (1) and went mad because we hadn’t made dinner for her, we were worried because she’d ignore (2) and turn up a few days later and be ‘what?’ And finally we found out she’d had drugs in the house (found the evidence) and youngest fessed up that she’d had a day pRty with 10 people round.

We kicked her out.

it wasn’t something we took lightly - but sometimes it’s necessary. She stayed with a friend, and we sent money to that friends mum and stayed in contact…. Then SS got involved and of course they tried to reconcile us, but both jobs in the family - being around drugs like that is career ending, so we both had to do work disclosures - and SS worked to get her a bedsit for troubled teens. She moved in with boyfriend and his mum eventually - and we started to rebuild relationship with her. we helped towards costs during that phase too. that worked for a while but then relationship with bf and his mum broke down - and we got the call from her ‘mum help’.

we moved her home, tucked her up and she slept for 3 days. She came out of that bedroom a different person.

it took a while for everything to be addressed - not just swept under the carpet - she finally came to us, individually and over the course of 6 months, emptied her heart out, apologised for what she knew she was putting us through.

She can’t explain it, not really, but we think it probably was a developmental issue, troubled childhood with her biological dad, and some very bad lessons learnt from him about how to treat people and disrespect and DV towards mum. She still brings up what went so badly wrong, and still apologises and thanks us for being there when shit hit the fan for her. She says herself, she gave us no choice. And it wouldn’t have matter what rules we had, just 1 was too much for her. I’m pretty certain (both) secondary school and their draconian rules about eyelashes, nails, skirt length, buttons, etc etc, were contributory factors, going as far to put her in isolation on the day of a gcse because of some fake nails, which surprise surprise she failed. I’m sure that the authoritarian nature of school was applied with too much vigor once her card was marked as being difficult.

I know we will get abuse from those who don’t understand just how bad it got - because we kicked her out. Everyone walking on eggshells around her…. If the door opened, the step dad would discreetly hide in the bedroom as his presence seemed to make things worse. The youngest, in tears all the time. The ex, shit stirring behind it all. Each of us just trying to survive another day without a screaming match, silent treatments, barely speaking for fear of upsetting her. At other times, we wouldn’t get home til bedtime, just because we didn’t want another fight.

So…. I don’t have any words or guidance for anyone now, because just getting through a day with someone like that is an achievement. I wish we had found another way to bring it to resolution and been able to help keep her safe in the way a parent must always should. Be we failed.

what I will say - if you can always let her know that when the shit hits the fan you will be there as she makes her own way - because that was the only thing we ever really managed to keep alive when things were at its worst. and that was the very thin strand that brought her back to us.

sometimes - you can do nothing right and you will be hated for everything you do. But hope one day she will come out of it, and you will hopefully be there for her.

wishing you luck & Patience.