Sorry posting for traffic need urgent EHCP help

[Annoyingnamechangerperson]

I have a tribunal tomorrow for a high school place.
Local authority viewpoint is that child has significant and severe learning difficulties however is academically very bright.
young person has ASD, ADHD, Sensory Processing disorder, severe speech delay, severe social and emotional delay (of child around 6 years old) however academically exceeding age related expectations.
Dont actually think anyone knows where to go.
Mainstream has been named as academically able however child is not safe to even walk down road without holding hands due to social / emotional age and impulsivity.
Has zero independence skills, can’t wash / clean self or make own drinks. Can’t even ask for help as doesn’t realise they need it.
Been told ‘too bright for SEN school’ however everyone in agreement (apart from LA) that child will not manage high school without coming to serious harm.
still has toileting accents (bladder / bowel)
Massive risk of bullying and manipulation

Can anyone offer any help as to how to argue that mainstream cannot meet needs?
It would involve teachers using picture cards and social stories etc, in every single lesson. Extra lesson time being allowed, every lesson, someone to provide assistance with toileting accidents and EHCP states that member of staff is required to support child for every single transition from arrival at school until home time. Child to have twice daily check ins to see how emotional state is as cannot grasp when they are upset / why.
EHCP reports small group of teaching staff needed. Assisting everywhere they go so from lesson to lesson and to the bathroom etc. Child wouldn’t be able to manage these transitions without support.

Can anyone point me in the direction of any policies, evidence anything that helps me to prove that it’s going to be impossible for a mainstream school to manage to this in place.
School also inadequate due to students having poorer outcomes there than in comparable schools.
Apologies if this makes no sense or is rushed I’m desperately looking for info and trying to bullet point so I don’t waffle.

From your own Mencap link: “A learning disability is a reduced intellectual ability and difficulty with everyday activities – for example household tasks, socialising or managing money – which affects someone for their whole life.”

Which is exactly what I explained unthread. In the UK, a learning disability is diagnosed after the age of 18, when there is the presence of an IQ under 70 (moderate learning difficulties) plus difficulty with daily living tasks following assessment.

I’m not making it up; this is what I do for a living and have published in this area

@Annoyingnamechangerperson there are different sorts of special schools though. And while many have a lot of students who are below average, they do have able students too and decent special school will provide the support that your son needs while making sure he reaches his academic potential. You just have to find it.

Specific learning difficulties aren’t about IQ, that is correct. (Although many years ago, dyslexia was diagnosed through a discrepancy with general leaning ability, thankfully those days are gone!)

Moderate and severe learning difficulties have everything to do with IQ; indeed, that is how they are diagnosed.

I didn’t dispute the fact learning disability is also about everyday activities. I was disputing that fact learning disability and learning difficulty aren’t the same the thing, and that learning difficulties aren’t about academic ability.

Children can be diagnosed with learning disabilities. For example, GOSH mention children having such a diagnosis here.

A quote from Mencap here “A learning disability is different from a learning difficulty as a learning difficulty does not affect general intellect.”

BTW if you do this for a living you would know moderate learning disability is actually an IQ of 35-49, not just an IQ of less than 70.

Moderate and severe learning difficulties have everything to do with IQ; indeed, that is how they are diagnosed… and to add to that, once the child turns 18 and has proven impairment of activities in daily living (as per the NICE guidelines) then the descriptor for their needs changes from e.g. moderate learning difficulty to moderate learning disability.

This is going to be my last post as this is derailing OP’s thread. But as I outlined above, there is a difference between a learning difficulty (singular, specific), and learning difficulties (global, moderate/severe). Have a look at your Mencap link and see which one they are using. They are quite right that a specific learning difficulty is different from learning difficulties/disabilities.

As you can see from Mencap links they talk about both learning difficulty and learning difficulties. Learning disabilities is not the same thing as learning difficulties (generalised or specific).

The arguments in this book might be helpful, as the author uses a large study which you might be able to cite.
https://www.uclpress.co.uk/products/152465 (is free to download the PDF)

My now 16 year old is in a sen school and is very much like your child.
He has been in the school since he was 11.
This school is more bespoke in that they taylor to the individual rather then the class so it doesn't matter if there is learning difficulties or not.
It's a shame that all counties don't have a school just like this one.

I know its hard but it's just one big fight, hopefully at tribunal you can voice your opinion and get the school your child needs and rightly deserves.

Really hoping this doesn’t out me but the ehcp states that

picture cards needed for all interactions

He needs hygiene arrangements (due to toileting accidents)

needs a 1:1 for all transitions throughout the day from lesson to lesson / room to room

All classroom interactions to be followed up by a 1:1 discussion

a small set of teachers

trained staff for his choking episodes

it also has now included that he stims very noisely and has vocal and physical tics that occur constantly and disrupt both his learning and the learning of others

and then lots of vague recommendations the ehcp containing this (updated version) has not been shared with mainstream highschool just the version that got appealed and altered.
Surely mainstream cant manage this.

it feels unfair to not only my child but also to the over worked teachers having to do this and also the students in the class too.

I can imagine it will be really hard trying to sit next to him and concentrate when he is shouting things out constantly due to his vocal tics which is the going to annoy his peers and put him at risk of bullying.

does anyone have any suggestions of how to show mainstream can’t manage this