AIBU - With this new data on obesity and the NHS is it time to have some honest and difficult conversations?

[IAmADancer]

New data from a ‘landmark study’ has show that obesity costs the NHS around 14billion a year and that 2 out of 3 adults are obese.

I know this is a difficult subject but the numbers are pretty clear. With the cost of living crisis and a general requirement for both parents to work now to support themselves how do we support people to make the right choices and tackle a growing problem?

Im really interested to hear people’s opinions on what we can do with such stark figures laid bare.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/05/17/cost-of-obesity-twice-those-who-are-healthy-nhs/

@Lockheart often because of the psychological issues involved in why they eat too much. The weight is a symptom in many cases of deeper issues. Instead of treating the symptom we need to treat the underlying causes but I have no idea how as a society we'd even start.

Yes but that's rather an extreme and unusual situation - most people who put on weight aren't bedbound or under such severe restrictions.

The situation you found yourself in will only be relatable to a miniscule proportion of the two-thirds of the population who are overweight or obese. What's happening to the majority of those people?

As a nation we seem to have a lot of mental health issues and a lot of disability and illness
I don't know how you sort that but if you could I am sure obesity would drop a lot.
I don't even think its a throw money at it thing

Case study here

Perhaps not overnight, but I gained 3 stone in 3 months, then another stone in the 2 months following that, whilst actively dieting. So 4 stone in 5 months. That's not normal.

And there is increasing evidence of a viral cause to obesity.

I'm currently losing weight, but need medication to do so.

For many people of course that would work, just as rehab works for addicts - people have their own demons that can make addiction (including to food) very difficult to overcome.

At 17/18 stone I'm a 16
At 14/15 stone I'm dropping to a size 14

(This is beside the point of the thread).

This is interesting and has probably confirmed for me that there's such a thing as big boned/heavy bones/big frame and small frame.

I'm usually a size 12-14. Can go to a size 10 top and have been a size 16 years ago but I've never gone past 11 stone. That's what I am right now so I'm surprised that you're a size 14 at 14/15 stone. Does that mean you're heavier or I'm heavier? Because I reckon if I'm 14/15 stone, I'd then be size 18 or so.

I do have a big frame/heavy bones (gotten mainly from my dad but mum is a bit similar too) but it never really shows in my clothes size. Just weight. I go between 74 and 78kg but at my size i think i should be about 68kg but I've always been heavier (in density, not fat) than my peers. I'm mostly a size 12 and even that surprises me sometimes especially when I think I've added some weight, like recently.

Sorry I've rambled but I find these sort of comparison fascinating.

It is certainly not a lifestyle choice for many disabled/ill people.

@dumple these threads aren't a personal attack against you. It's a general discussion. Your situation sounds unique and it's why I recognise you from another thread. I'm sorry you're having such a tough time.

It would be very interesting to be able to take some of the people who insist they cannot lose weight and put them in a controlled environment where their food and drink intake is completely set out
There was once a programme when they out obese people with anorexic buddies and they swapped their diets. Obese people always systematically lost weight.

My experience is that people who say they eat little and just can't lose weight always underestimate what they eat. The best one is one of my close friend who has gone on for years insisting she was eating healthily. Until she broke her four once and asked me if I minded doing her weekly shopping for her. That opened my eyes that's for sure. Probably double the calories of what I eat weekly.

Losing weight is probably one of the hardest thing to do along keeping a healthy weight. The education required is quite intense for most, and gets worse as we get older. In the end, it comes down what we prioritise, comfort and pleasure over being slim and healthy. I just manage because the latter is a big priority for me but it's with me every day, it's very very hard work.

As a nation we seem to have a lot of mental health issues and a lot of disability and illness

I agree and I've always thought of this. I wonder why that is or is it that we seem to be more aware of and acknowledge disabilities and illness more? Otherwise, it would be interesting to know why we are the way we are.

Correlation is not causation. There’s existing association between H. pylori treatment and weight gain.

That's not true. Some medication does indeed make people put on weight and its nothing to do with appetite. Some meds cause metabolism to slow, some cause water retention etc..

Well said.

There seems to be a lot of ignorance on this thread of how chronic health conditions and disability/meds hugely impact weight.

Exactly!

Exactly, they can advertise all the food in the world right in front of our faces, ultimately it's up to the individual to say no to buying it and eating it. Personal responsibilty and choice. Every one of us has the choice not to buy the Pringles. Noone is forcing you.

But how do you know?
It’s typically very difficult for women to manage to have investigations for difficulties losing weight, or for chronic pain or fatigue, which impact weight.
It’s very difficult for women to be taken seriously, and many of us are put on antidepressants as a first step, before any treatment, and on top of depression (which can lead to overeating) you have the effects of antidepressants which can also cause weight gain.
I don’t know one morbidly obese person who doesn’t have either a psychological disorder or a chronic illness treated with drugs that induce weight gain. Not one.
I know plenty of people who have chronic issues that are being well and truly ignored by their GP - see the rise in posts on MN recommending posters to see a private GP for tests and investigations that their own GP should be referring for. See how many have thyroid problems but cannot get their dr to take it seriously. Hormone imbalances, common in women, particularly once you get to a certain age.
You end up being able to find out more on social media (tiktok, YouTube etc) than you can talking 1:1 to your own GP (if you actually manage to see one). There is enough information out there to show that that the eat less and move more thing just doesn’t work for many women, so why are so many coming into this thread spewing this outdated and plain wrong opinions?
Why are drs still handing out advice from bad science from the 1950s? In any other business being 70+ years outdated would lead to you being sacked - not in medicine though!

We live in a society that would rather have swiftly growing numbers of mentally ill people, huge numbers of stress related chronic illnesses, children in primary school suffering from stress (I mean, Jesus, 4 - 11 year olds routinely suffering from stress??), and that’s not just since covid, that’s been going on for the last 15 years or so and getting worse.

Then people have a problem with the number of people reacting to the shitty way society is run, and becoming disengaged from our own lives because we’re taught over and over again that we’re not good enough. The rise in mental illnesses and the rise in obesity is the same thing, from the same roots. With the huge lack of support (MH services in the UK are an absolute joke), what did anyone think would happen?

Until society is shaken up and capitalism more balanced with socialism, and people actually caring for one another and stopping the shitty way they treat those less fortunate, we’re in for a long haul of more of the same.

When society cares more about putting money into the pockets of big business than the people they are supposedly looking out for, and people behave in an entirely predictable manner, well, where are you supposed to go from there.

Yep. Just don’t buy it. It’s not compulsory

I am originally from another country which has very poor healthcare and zero provision for mental illnesses. Most countries in the world are like that. The population is not obese.

That's not to say the NHS should not try and provide as much help as it can, but it can't be perennially blamed for obesity.

Well it was plain over-eating that had me pile on the weight. Slim child, teen and young adult. Even slim after second pregnancy. Then around mid forties I started turning to food to cheer myself up. Only it didn't! A decade later I lost it all and have maintained a healthy weight since. It wasn't easy but it was worth it.
I think I kidded myself for a long time that I was still healthier and slimmer than many people. But comparing myself with the biggest people I k ew was just kidding myself. I had to have strong words with myself and realise it was me: me that was over eating, and me who wasn't happy with the result.

I’m a lucky one. I’m losing weight, I’m no longer morbidly obese.
I know what got me to that state, and I know that overeating to the extent that leads to being over double your ideal weight does not happen on its own, there are always circumstances that have contributed to it, and having spent years dealing with the fallout from an educational system that is god awful and frankly damaging to children with SN, years managing SN children unsupported, something had to give.
Obesity to that level does not happen simply because someone is lazy.
Just like mental illness does not happen because someone is weak minded.

Every one of us has the choice not to buy the Pringles. Noone is forcing you
This is true but at the same time Pringles have been designed in a lab to make them irresistible to humans.

I think it’s fairly clear that obesity can no longer be considered a problem of greed in an individual. The fix cannot be individuals just deciding to lose weight, which study after study has shown does not work.

We need both. Individuals can and do loose weight. You can change the environment and legislation but some people will still not necessarily choose to eat healthy amounts of the right foods.

It’s typically very difficult for women to manage to have investigations for difficulties losing weight, or for chronic pain or fatigue, which impact weight
Because many disorders would get better, or disappear if they lost the way.

Lossing weight is a significant factor to regaining energy, physically and mentally. Same with reducing pain. Obesity is a vicious circle. The more obese you become, the more likely to struggle with energy, suffer more pain, sleep less comfortably, etc....

What WE can do as a society is helping our children not to get there in the first place and society not to be telling so much to young people that being in the obese category is ok because after all, they can still be active etc... What they don't realise is that it will get harder and harder to lose weight as the pain, the tiredness, the depression increase.

Pringles are horrible. Kettle chips are much better!