To wonder if I actually have ADHD after all?

[FlipsFlops]

I was diagnosed with ADHD last year at a private clinic after getting nowhere with the NHS. I did a fair bit of research and went to a named psychiatrist who specialises in treating ADHD and went in with an open mind not necessarily expecting a diagnosis.

Somewhat to my surprise I was diagnosed very quickly (I'd filled in lots of very lengthy forms before my assessment and off the back of that was told I was a clear cut case), and strongly encouraged to try medication (I haven't yet).

It's taken a bit of courage to tell family and friends - some have been supportive, some a bit sceptical ("but you seem completely normal?" "yeah I've seen all those TikTok videos too").

I still struggle a bit accepting the diagnosis and am prone to beating myself up about it (it's not ADHD, I'm just lazy, don't try hard enough, etc...).

Then I've seen this BBC news report today about the "ADHD private diagnosis scandal" suggesting people are being diagnosed by private clinics who don't actually have ADHD.

ADHD: Private clinics exposed by BBC undercover investigation - BBC News

Have I just been taken in by all the TikTok nonsense (even though I don't use TikTok) and exploited by an industry trying to sell me expensive drugs?

Or do I have a genuine neurological condition that's being called into question by journalists looking to turn everything into a some kind of scandal?

I don't honestly know what to think any more.

@Philthefridge - so much of what you say here is extremely relatable.

My apparent “success” is either due to the scaffold provided by other people (particularly my long-suffering DH)) or achieved at the expense of my mental health and wellbeing.

@Philthefridge thank you for sharing that. I was also a school refuser and used to feign illness to get out of it from a very early age. It was so, so boring but overwhelming at the same time. I didn’t relate to anybody so had no friends. I had my first breakdown at 12 and tried to kill myself by taking a massive overdose of pills. I very nearly succeeded and was in hospital for three weeks. All anyone ever talked about was depression and antidepressants, nobody listened to me. I was so overwhelmed and frustrated I started to self harm as a means to vent some of my anger. I never went back to school.

The same patterns repeated themselves with work. I would work for a year, struggling the whole time, then burn out and have a complete depressive breakdown. I’d go back to work after a few months and it would all happen again. Same with university, I’ll manage a year or two and then wham, can’t cope anymore. It’s nothing to do with anxiety, I’m not a particularly anxious person, I just fall apart from the constant unbearableness of having to focus when I can’t and all the guilt and shame that brings.

Nope, no qualifications, zero, nada. Because I have ADHD, and Autism and Dyspraxia, shame really as I have such amazing insights. I am sure my brain could be really useful in a research field. Being told you are stupid from the age of four doesn't really do much for your future academic achievements, as you were!

@KingsHeath53 and @Daftasabroom Thanks. Yes it makes sense. I'm actually autistic and have some adhd traits although I don't think I have enough to meet the criteria for diagnosis but my dc have both. So I understand the concept of the wheel and spectrum. I only wanted to summarise that post to be sure I understood it because I've never really seen it explained that exact way before, even though I already posted something similar (to what i wrote) on this thread already.

I appreciate the clarification still because it does help me see things a different and clearer way too. So thank you.

@YourTruthorMine

I wasn't trying to have a go, just curious if professionals think as you do. I'm unsure but I have a diagnosis of both autism and ADHD so it interests me that it could just be one and the same.

@KingsHeath53 @IHadADreamBut a spectrum is a bit like a flattened out radar diagram.

Apologies then plasticpens, I assumed you were one of the 'Not permitted to have an opinion, unless you are qualified brigade' there seems to be loads of them on Mumsnet, particularly noticeable in the medical profession. These folk have obviously not seen autisitc/adhd hyperfocus in action

Neurodiversity is commonly used to create a ‘them and us’ regarding autism vs not autistic. It often lumps together all non-autistic individuals as ‘neurotypical’ and this is harmful to those with a wide range of conditions - including those I listed. Neurodiversity can be a useful concept - as a consideration of the diversity of thinking of the whole population. There are few people who could be said to be truely ‘typical’ of a population. I often get frustrated by it as it can come across as a way to add weight to the autistic cause by involving others, whilst simultaneously dismissing those who are not autistic as ‘neurotypical’ despite the neurodiversity of this group including many with high needs.

As for the argument that some of the conditions I listed are not neurodiverse - an individual cannot be diverse, only a population. If you mean ‘divergent’ ie ‘not typical’ then everyone with one or more of the conditions I listed that affect thinking are not ‘typical’. Though I agree that some may only have subtle affects (I was being slightly provocative including left handedness).

Yes, exactly. If I didn't have such a fantastic husband scaffolding me, I'd have ended up having a mental health crisis. Like the previous poster, my kids wouldn't be fed it put to bed at a sensible time, the right washing wouldn't be done, packed lunches not made,washing up not done, bills not paid, library books not returned. Women with ADHD who look like they are a success either have supportive people behind them or they're falling apart behind the scenes and keeping it outwardly secret as they are so ashamed.

I have a degree and post-grad qualification and a professional public sector job but the degree is a 2:2 as I lost marks on essays that were handed in late and I pulled marks up a bit as I was good at cramming for exams under extreme pressure the night before. post grad was done by distance learning and took a humiliating 7 years. I got deferrals, but ran out of time to make it a full masters. People accept it, as I had young kids at the time, but I had childcare, no job and plenty of time to study - I just procrastinated all the time even knowing we were paying for that childcare. My job is easy. Fortunately there's always changes and I'm great with change, but I've never gone back to full time post kids and they're leaving home age now. I don't dare change my job even though I'd love to. I do awfully in interviews as my poor working memory (poor executive function) makes me inarticulate. It's not the same as forgetfulness.

I've moved house so many times, on a whim, it's been detrimental to finances, putting down roots, making friends. Outwardly, this looks like adventure to other people rather than impulsiveness, boredom etc...

I live under a cloud of shame that runs through everything I do. I hear the voice of my parents, friends, bosses, spouse in my head repeating my life's fuck ups. It can be cute and funny up to the age of 25 to appear ditsy, but not after that.

However, I can see what it must look like to outsiders. Yes, loads of people procrastinate when they're studying, loads of mothers get overwhelmed with the house and kids, loads of people find their job boring etc... It's so difficult to articulate the difference succinctly. One has to tell their whole life story to paint the picture of living with ADHD. So that's why I don't bother telling people.

i am just putting this out there though (as i do not know you and cannot comment on your diagnosis) - do you not think that’s the same for everyone? I have a successful career. I accept that this is a lot in part to do with the support of others (no one is an island etc). Success is always always traded for mental wellbeing. I work in a sector where lots of people earn megabucks and all of them have a trade off for their mental health because you can’t have it all. It’s a teeny minority of people who are mega successful and totally chilled and happy.

Equally for me exams were hard. Time management at uni was hard. But these things are supposed to be hard. They are hard for everyone! Just as we don’t pathologise people who find learning french easy, or who are rubbish at drawing, or natural at styling hair, some people find deadlines, or stress, or focussing on boring stuff harder than others. I get it as i’m one of them :-)

I’m just noting that in this thread a lot of people are using examples of their neurodiversity things which are most of the time just normal things people find hard. My son has ADHD and absolutely cannot live a normal life. His condition is debilitating. When we talk about ‘masking’, this is where he might be on best behaviour for a few hours then have a huge meltdown after. The idea someone with this debilitating condition could successfully mask day in day out for years on end I find really difficult to comprehend because then it’s not really masking. It’s just ‘being’. I’m not denying that many people have missed diagnoses. But those people are not likely to have had successful lives, if they had adhd it would have come out in some way (eg: education or relationships or career or substance abuse etc).

That’s wonderful you had a diagnosis and treatment and it’s worked so well for you.

I would say yours is exactly the type of case which would require a diagnosis as you have a history of mental ill health as a result of your neurodiversity.

But in real life its perfectly understandable that people view it as mild or severe.

Someone so badly impacted that they may never live independently is entitely different to someone who has a successful career/family life etc. and isn't impacted to anywhere near the same extent.

A spectrum may not be linear but they are not comparable.

@KingsHeath53 but you are not the gatekeeper, you don't get to dictate who is allowed a diagnosis based on your sample size of 1. It's not a black and white adhd is exactly as your son experiences it and you are not advocating for him by putting other people down.

Masking is complex, and in general girls and women are 'better' at it. Girls are less likely to be diagnosed in childhood because they mask so well.

And no, it's not 'just being' it's an endless effort above and beyond what NT people experience. Time management is hard yes, but there is a difference between struggling a bit studying and being completely overwhelmed by even small things, having little to no executive function or emotional regulation. Someone with adhd might compete the degree yes, but the cost of that is so much more than an NT person (and I'm not saying everyone NT sails through life with no struggle).

My own experience is that education was not an option, it was too much and I avoided almost all of high school and couldn't manage college or university. I have a history of depression, GAD, self harm, excessive risk taking, poor impulse control and suicide attempts but also a reasonable career, supportive DH and now, after years of conflict, a supportive employer but that doesn't mean the other issues are gone. I have support in place that means I have better strategies to cope, the mask is still very much present and often results in burnout because it's exhausting.

I agree completely.

The idea someone with this debilitating condition could successfully mask day in day out for years on end I find really difficult to comprehend because then it’s not really masking. It’s just ‘being’.

But what is 'successfully'? People are talking about feeling suicidal, poor relationships, burnout as a result of masking enough to achieve things? The energy that it takes to more or less get through the day only to collapse at the end.

If only people so severely affected that they can't manage any sort of functional life deserve the label of ADHD, what value are you placing on the very obvious poor quality of life of people who don't meet your criteria?

I've got ADHD and DH doesn't. I wouldn't claim for one second that he doesn't find some elements of life difficult, or encounter horrible things. We're not in a race to the bottom in our house; we support each other. But it's really obvious that I find things difficult that he never has to think about, and that getting them done (or failing at them) takes a daily toll on me.

I’m in my 40s. I went to Oxford, have had a long career in some highly selective environments and currently work for a Big Four firm.

A neurotypical person would not go to Oxford, would never get into highly selective environments and would not be able to cope if they did, would not work for a Big Four firm. A neurotypical person attempting this would develop mental health difficulties and burn out.

Just to add that I have children with ASD. One is unlikely to be able to live the same sort of life to the others. I hope it'll be a happy, secure and fulfilled one but it will look different, and be shaped by some of the limitations that their autism brings.

The others are not, at this stage so far, likely to face the same level of challenges but I can't deny for one moment that their ASD presents constant obstacles to living their lives 'normally'. I don't think that this means that their diagnoses are not valid, just because their sibling faces more barriers than they do.

@Shelefttheweb are you suggesting everyone at Oxford is ND or everyone is NT?

@Willyoujustbequiet so STEM isn't real life?

Misinterpreting something doesn't make you right just because lots of people do it.

@Shelefttheweb

A neurotypical person would not go to Oxford, would never get into highly selective environments and would not be able to cope if they did, would not work for a Big Four firm. A neurotypical person attempting this would develop mental health difficulties and burn out.

That's quite the statement there

Do you think a typical person, who has an IQ of 100 +-15 points, is capable of attending Oxford?

I think @Shelefttheweb is just continuing to make the point that Neurodiversity includes options beyond ADHD and/or ASD.

Oxford is about a lot more than IQ.

I'll ask again: are you suggesting everyone at Oxford is ND or everyone is NT?

@KingsHeath53 I'm sorry to hear about your son's struggles. It sounds really hard for him and for you. I think I understand a little bit where you are coming from. I have two DC awaiting assessment for suspected ASD/ADHD and one DC with a severe and debilitating learning disability not further defined. The DC with LD may very well also in fact have ASD but that is tricky to unpick (apparently) (and perhaps also the will to try is lacking among clinicians given DC's sex and IQ).

On the one hand, the idea that all the DC are autistic makes a lot of sense of our family history and how we ended up in this position. On the other hand, it is easier in some ways to hold the ASD and LD very separately - two separate problems that are not related - because they manifest so differently and mean such different things for my DC that it is hard to see in what ways they are 'the same.' I certainly feel very strongly that advocacy and support is much more vital for the DC with a learning disability than for the two who are likely to be able to navigate life independently.

I am willing to say, because of the evidence in front of me, that for some people ASD and/or ADHD can be extremely debilitating, and for others less so. I do not think any of my DC are having a 'normal' experience of the world and in that sense they have something in common. But actually, if ASD and ADHD were only utterly debilitating, surely as heritable conditions they would cease to exist. Children can only be diagnosed if some people live 'successful' and 'normal' enough lives to reproduce.

I do also wonder, and hope I might put this out there without causing offence, because I was in a similar position and went through a similar thought process... Since your son has ADHD, has it ever prompted you to consider if others in your family have ADHD too? If you feel that struggles described by adults with ADHD are common experiences, should that suggest that they do not have ADHD like you, or that you might in fact have it like them?

I don’t think anyone who gets into Oxford is neurotypical. Yes getting into Oxford is about more than intelligence but you have to have a minimum standard of intelligence to achieve academic results that are beyond the reach of a typical 18 year old. And of course, by being 18 so still having a maturing brain is itself ‘neurodivergent’ from the thinking patterns of a ‘typical’ member of the population at large.