To think that the idea that no one wants to watch middle aged women on TV/Film should be OVER

[littleripper]

I was speaking to a man who works for Amazon streaming service yesterday and he was repeating the idea that no one wants to watch middle aged women, therefore no one invests in shows/films about them.

In the last year Happy Valley has been the stand out smash hit British TV show and Everything Everywhere All At Once did very well and took the awards. I challenged him and was told I was wrong and didn't know what I am talking about (which I don't)

I spoke to DD18 and DS 19 about it later and they both said that not only did they think I was right, but that the current reality TV choice in their groups was Race Across the World and everyone was rooting for the 2 middle aged women!

I am sure some of you do know what you are talking about. So am I unreasonable to suggest that if they make good quality TV starring women, people of all ages will watch and enjoy it?

Exactly, @DejaVoodoo!

Older men can continue to hope for, and get, leading parts, in spite of the fact that they’re middle-aged and for the most part, young women in real life don’t go for that.

But older women? You must be satisfied with supporting / bit parts only…… 🙄

Should read “Hags” by Victoria Smith. Women over 40 who no longer have the 3 Fs (fertility, femininity and fuckability ) should keep quiet and stay out of the spotlight.

Fuck that shit.

I bloody love watching older women in films and on TV. Especially when they are acting in stuff written by women. One of the best examples I’ve seen in the last few years was Olivia Coleman in The Lost Daughter - written by Elena Ferranti and directed by Maggie Gyllenhaal. Outstanding

I think this is why that Emma Thompson movie from last year was so important. Even if it wasn’t totally brilliant — it was fine, not a classic — it was notable because it subverted that trend of older male ‘established’ star and ‘nubile’ female ‘starlet’. (Words used with tongue firmly lodged in cheek.)

In Good Luck To You Leo Grande the formula was flipped on its head — Thompson was the established star and the older of the two, whereas Daryl McCormack was the much younger partner. And it had more interesting things to say about women, men, sex, power (and race, incidentally) than 99% of those Hollywood films where young women have to go gaga over their dad’s mates (conceptually speaking).

That said I think the 90s were particularly bad for this and I think — I hope — it’s getting better now. Something like As Good As It Gets or Six Days Seven Nights or even American Beauty wouldn’t get made now. I hope.

(I actually really like As Good As It Gets. The script is great and the performances excellent. But the younger woman/older man dynamic was pretty grim even back then.)

My "favourite" example of this 90s horror was the film "Entrapment" in which a beautiful young Catherine Zeta Jones is the love interest of Sean Connery, who was 39 years older than her.

39 YEARS!! FFS

Admission of shame time. I saw Entrapment at the cinema. 🫣 I went with my mate; she had a stonking great crush on Catherine Zeta Jones and was desperate to see it because leather catsuit or something.

It is a truly terrible film. Execrable. I think if CZJ hadn’t done Traffic — which is genuinely great — it would have sunk her.

Yes, but conversely older men ARE being given the romantic leads, generally with a much younger and more attractive woman.
Because there's nothing more irresistible to a beautiful young woman than a flaccid, forgetful, jowly old git, is there?

Hmm...not sure I buy this!

The sort of male actors who do get romantic leads with a much younger woman (can't think of anyone currently) aren't 'flaccid, forgetful, jowly old gits, though, are they?

flaccid, forgetful, jowly old git

Coincidentally, that’s the first line of my CV. 🤣

Yes and I think this is what drives the problem - it’s led by these vacuous individuals ‘insight” rather than what audiences want.

True, true, they tend to be attractive for their age, but not the tight, energetic, non-grey haired young things they used to be, or that would better suited to the female love interest with whom they are invariably matched.

The female equivalent just doesn't happen: attractive older females are interesting characters rather than love interest; if they do have a fella he certainly won't be young.

Of course there’s also Hannah Waddingham who, as well as switching up the age gap trope in Ted Lasso, is doing a fine job at Eurovision so far.

Well, arguably maybe not. But sometimes, yes, they actually are.

But they’re trading purely on their once-youthful good looks and bankable name.

Sorry, but Brad Pitt, Johnny Depp, Harrison Ford, et al - are nowhere near as good looking as old codgers, as they were as young men.

The only man who’s maintained his attractiveness into older- age IMO is George Clooney.

Can recommend Little Fires Everywhere on Amazon prime, Reese Witherspoon is amazing as usual.

I'm sure his employers would love him for disregarding half of the companies' shows. What a lot of old tosh.

Also Nine Perfect Strangers with Nicole Kidman and Melissa McCarthy

Arsenal women just sold out the Emirates for the first time- think 60, 663 or something close.

Also a thread recently on middle aged women in books-my bookclub just finished Miss Benson's beetle

Hopefully people in charge are seeing this and scheduling accordingly

Older actresses are amazing, they are more complex and interesting. Don't know if anyone has mentioned Toni Collette, I think she gets better and better.

Agree @Sandybabey!

Women are incredibly ageist .

Not strictly on topic, but I always remember a comment about the the 1999 film "Entrapment" starring Catherine Zeta-Jones (29) and Sean Connery (68) - "A man old enough to be her husband"

I think it's always interesting to see what happens with second and subsequent seasons of a series that contains some older women. After audience feedback, do they become more or less prominent?

As already mentioned the later seasons of Picard vastly increased the numbers and prominence of roles for older women. And similar seems to have happened with The Equaliser - in the first season the main characters were McCall (Queen Latifah, 53), a male detective and a male CIA contact. In the current one the CIA contact is gone, detective is less prominent, and there's more screen time and plot for the characters played by Lorraine Toussaint (63) and Liza Lapira (a mere 42).

"I was speaking to a man"...

'nuf said.

I can't believe anyone would say that about Suranne Jones, Toni Collette, Helena Bonham Carter or Tilda Swinton, and the list goes on.

I’ve just finished watching Somebody Somewhere, packed full of middle aged women, and excellent.