Can work do this?

[SunsetBeauregarde]

I've nc'd for obvious reasons - pom bears, zoflora, penis beaker etc etc.

A few weeks ago I was promoted at work. I have been working there for 5 years, the promotion had been planned since July 2022 and I'd been made aware of the role at that time. I was then actively coached into the role, supported to pick up the skills I needed and then formally promoted during the April review cycle. I had my confirmation letter with my new pay (12.5% raise), confirmation that my start date was 3rd April 23. All fine.

Then, in the second week of March my boss left very suddenly. We were told he would not be coming back and would be retiring. I of course contacted him and said how sorry I was etc and he said he'd been made redundant but not to worry, his was a very specific redundancy and the business was in good health.

A week ago our new line manager was installed and our MD pulled me aside the same day and said 'Sunset I know you'd been having discussions about a promotion but that's off the table now, New Boss will want to restructure the teams'. I was stunned but asked what that meant and he just said 'it means you'll be stepping back down to your old role for now'

I'm devastated, but now I'm over the shock I'm wondering if this is even legal? I have a confirmed start date as 3rd April, and had the above conversation on 18th April. I'm due my first paycheck at my new rate tomorrow, but will that now be at my old wage since they've effectively withdrawn the promotion?

When i asked 'so are you demoting me again?' he said 'No no the offer of the role is being withdrawn' but surely seeing as I'd started, it's too late for that??

Did you sign another contract conforming you new role

I would push back on that. The letter you had confirming your new salary and position was a change in contract, they cannot unilaterally unwind it.

I would show them your confirmation letter, and you have already started performing the role. You don't need to sign a new contract, it's a mutually agreed variation to your terms of employment. The promotion has happened, so it's incorrect to say it's not going to take place as it already has taken place.

What they are trying to do now is unilaterally impose less favourable terms and take away responsibility, which presumably you do not agree to. This does happen at work all the time, but demotion without good reason can be grounds for constructive dismissal. I'd speak to your union or get some legal advice from an employment lawyer.

I'd push back, they'd confirmed a change of contract in writing.

No, they just sent me a letter confirming the changes to my existing contract, start date, salary and working pattern.

https://landaulaw.co.uk/demotion/

That’s as good as.

If the new role will no longer exist and the team restructured then it’s a redundancy situation and they have to follow proper processes for that. They can’t ignore your new contract and promotion, and you should be paid at the promotion salary until officially redundant or you’ve agreed to accept an alternative role.

I'm not unionized unfortunately (service based industry and it's uncommon to be a union member - stupid i know).

I can however speak to an employment lawyer is the consensus is that this is unacceptable. Didn't think it felt right!

Yes so this is what I assumed - if there's a restructure coming (it hasn't been confirmed yet and no one has been told) then I should be given the same treatment as everyone else in the restructure?

The only other complication is in my promotion letter it specifies a 3 month probation period in the new role - does that matter?

Yes so this is what I assumed - if there's a restructure coming (it hasn't been confirmed yet and no one has been told) then I should be given the same treatment as everyone else in the restructure?

Yes, if you've been there a good while anyway. I think they have to do an employee consultation even if there are to be 20+ redundancies. A good employer would consult, inform and not just impose big changes on employees anyway.

https://www.acas.org.uk/your-rights-during-redundancy/how-your-employer-must-consult-you#:~:text=By%20law%2C%20employers%20must%20hold,the%20redundancies%20within%2090%20days

Also if they are restructuring they could be in financial difficulty and I might start looking for another job anyway. It's not fun to be a rat left on a sinking ship.

It’s shot but if you are pushing to go to a post they no longer want common sense would tell you they’ll make u redundant

Yeah I’m not that attached to the role, it’s the 12.5% pay rise I need. I’m wondering whether to try my luck, go back to them and say that on reflection I need some clarification and what this means for me, then push to have my new wage retained even if my responsibilities are returning to normal? Point out that the promotion has gone through so if they want to demote me they need to do that and explain why, or make my new role redundant and offer me my old role?

Or, to save any hassle I’m happy to step back into my old role but would need my terms to remain the same as now?

As you have a letter confirming your new role & salary

I would ask for a letter stating that they are demoting you back to your original role & salary

I would copy everything in writing to HR & your new manager

Or

They demote you back to your original role, but on your new salary

Fight, fight, fight

I plan to - at first I was too stunned and upset (not like me, I’m not emotional about work at all) but now I’m mostly furious. How dare they??

I’ve worked really hard to secure this promotion because I needed the money and it feels like such a betrayal.

A similar thing happened to me last year. I was acting manager and was asked to step up to the role on a permanent basis. I did, and had signed my contract. Then, a few weeks later, I was informed that the role as I knew it was no longer available and I was to step back down, whilst stepping up as acting again until a new person was employed. They did this with several other managers, right across the company. Of course, I was quite rightly upset as I'd given my all to the business going above and beyond.

I refused to play ball, and I would recommend that you do not accept any new terms until you have spoken with ACAS, researched and sought legal advice if you are in a financial position to do so. If you are forced to sign anything (which I would not recommend), you state in writing that it's under protest.

I put in a formal grievance and judging how quickly things turned sour: they were livid and had expected me to just roll over. I'm not a confrontational person by nature, but I felt so badly treated, (lot more background info that I haven't divulged) that I wasn't prepared to just be abused like that. In the end I got a decent settlement figure which I negotiated myself, (surprised myself again there, but I guess you never know the grit you have until you are pushed) and the company by law has to pay for a solicitor to have it signed off. I researched so much that I felt comfortable in doing this and the solicitors fees are very expensive. I got another job so managed to save the money.

I'd been there over two years and this is important. No redundancy, because the role was still there. I also had to sign an NDA. I have no legal qualifications but honestly there is so much information available I would read everything you can find and speak to ACAS. Good Luck!

@SunsetBeauregarde definitely worth an appointment with an employment lawyer.

In the meantime keep doing the job you have been promoted to. Tell them you are getting legal advice.

The 3 months promotion is an issue, but could also be helpful in arguing to allow you to do the job, and get the salary, for the probation period. Once in situ you can be shit hot and they will struggle to say you failed promotion.

Alternatively, it buys you 3 months to find another job/whilst the restructure is done.

As@Elsiedarlingputthekettleon has indicated a settlement agreement may be an option you have to consider.

I work for a trade union and my advice is definitely to go forwards and speak to that employment lawyer. There are a few 'if/but' things that need to be gone in to but I think you likely have a case here. I'd check your pay tomorrow. If they haven't paid you what they have confirmed in writing, it's likely to be an unlawful deduction of wages situation (sorry I always say 'likely' rather than 'definitely' on here because I don't know the full ins and outs).

They can’t unilaterally change your contract once the offer has been accepted. That would be the case even if your start date hasn’t happened yet (but it has, so it’s clear that you are working under the new terms and pay).

If they fail to pay you at the 12.5% higher rate then it’s a fundamental breach of contract and/or an unlawful deduction from your wages.

You should raise a formal grievance first of all but you could even resign and claim constructive dismissal - any failure to pay you properly would make such a claim easy enough to win.

You are absolutely right that what they are doing is unlawful. Re the probationary period - it depends what the terms of probation are. Just a blanket statement of “the first three months shall be a probationary period” is unlikely to legally allow them to demote you.

Definitely contact ACAS. A friend of mine had an employment issue and they were brilliant. Good luck @SunsetBeauregarde -
Up the workers!

Brilliant, I’ll call ACAS tomorrow, in the meantime I’ve called my new manager and asked for half an hour of his time tomorrow morning to discuss and he’s agreed. Meeting is in for 9:30 via teams and he’s agreed I can record the meeting with transcript. My plan is to get him to confirm that they are expecting me to step down from my agreed promotion and how they see that working. I’ll know by then about my pay for this month, so then I can call ACAS after that conversation and have a really clear picture (in writing via transcript) of their expectations.

Great that you can record it! Please keep us updated and good luck.

As it’s on Teams, record using voice memos on your phone as well, OP as sometimes the Teams transcript can miss phrases out or mistranslate them. You can delete the voice memo straight after you have compared the transcript for accuracy but it’s worth making sure everything is documented.

Thank you this is great advice - in all honesty I think it being recorded might signal that I’m not messing about. He answered ‘fine to record, anything specific you’re looking to cover so I can make sure I have answers for you?’ So I replied ‘yes, I’d like to discuss my change in role in more detail’ and he’s not replied.

I'm really sorry, I clicked YABU by mistake! Fat fingers!

Fight this all the way!!