To ask for advice about sullen 11yo DD?

[Tusktusk]

Posted in preteens but no replies. Came here for traffic.

A bit flummoxed here. She is my youngest DD. Older one wasn’t as tricky (but had her moments)

She is definitely hormonal. Not yet started periods.

She wants to be with her phone or laptop all the time. On her own, in her room. The content she is accessing is innocent enough - no Tiktok or other social media. She plays age appropriate games and listens to music on Spotify. She likes watching videos of people playing Minecraft

Her time on these devices is limited to an hour on each. But as soon as I go to remove them, she becomes incredibly and increasingly rude and sulky.

She will ALWAYS resist handing her phone to me, asking why, trying to put it somewhere else other than in my hand, trying to negotiate, then getting angry with me when I hold my ground. I do negotiate but never far enough for her satisfaction. She will try to insist - “I WILL have my phone NOW” - which obviously doesn’t get her what she wants so I have no idea why she does this. She will also try to find where I’ve hidden it and get it back. She has even done this in the middle of the night before. This always has the consequence of her losing her phone for a full day or more. She still does it.

Other non phone related behaviours:
Rolling eyes and sulky expression almost constantly; muttering inaudibly so I constantly have to ask her to repeat herself or speak louder; tries to gesture her way through communication rather than actually speak; hardly ever says please or thank you any more; hides herself behind hair and hoodie.

She can be absolutely lovely of course. We enjoy private jokes together, she likes me reading to her at bedtime still. She can be very kind too. And sometimes she is overly needy - wanting constant cuddles etc.

But most of the time right now she is as described.

Any attempt to talk to her about it or call her out on rudeness just makes her withdraw further.

I think her self esteem is quite shaky. I need advice on how to handle her negative behaviours without making her withdraw or damaging her self esteem.

Excessive screw time is not good for children’s mental health. Can you get her to join a sport or some other classes?

Sorry, that should have read SCREEN time

Pretty normal for her age IME, although not a barrel of laughs for you.

Pushing on a firm boundary is to be expected at this age. I do think an hour of screens if this includes watching TV on devices (netflix or whatever) is a bit tight, especially in school holidays, but I wouldn't negotiate while she's being mardy about it.

With the eye rolling or any other behaviours under the umbrella of "attitude" I always cheerfully reinforce the expectation that I will be spoken to politely. No other consequences/punishment as that creates a stand off. But being reminded must get a bit tiresome for them, as over time things have improved.

I have to be honest, at 11 I'm not surprised she's being mardy if she's only allowed an hour a day on devices, that does seem quite restrictive.

With DD12 we are at the opposite end, we let her self regulate on her phone (although it does lock at 9pm on a school night and 10pm otherwise). She isn't on it all the time - she spends plenty of time doing other stuff like sewing, making jewellery, drawing, playing board games etc.

I wonder if you relaxed a little bit on screen time whether she would feel as if she were being treated more grown up and whether the general attitude would improve? Like for example you could move to 2 hours on the weekend and in holidays...you mentioned she listens to music on Spotify, is that limited to within the hour too? Could you get her an echo dot for her room so she could at least listen to music unlimited?

To clarify, she gets an hour on her laptop and an hour on her phone. Then she can watch TV with us in the evening - if she is watching with us we let her choose. So it is quite a lot more than 1 hour screen time. More like 3 or 4 in total.

Ecco dot for music is a good idea.

It is probably age/hormone related.
But have you checked for friendship issues, problems at school etc?
Is she still at primary school? Worries about starting secondary?

Can you up her activities to naturally cut screen time.
I’m a Guide leader for girls age 10-13. We have a phone hand in box so no phones while we are doing activities.

Mine 11 year old has unlimited screen time over weekend - limit goes up 2 hours before bed. We go out, do activities etc but if he's at home he is playing online. The plus side is he never sneaks his phone and when time limits up he knows that's it. His siblings are the same.

If you use Google family link you can set screen time limits and bedtime remotely so they turn off without you having to physically remove the phone. Might save some arguements?

We resort to playing Kevin the Teenager clips and she gets really cross and then cracks and begins to giggle.

If my son has an attitude, I ask him if he would talk to another grown-up, such as a teacher the same way. And reiterate that it's not OK to talk like it to me.
Although he is younger, this is a great argument.

That's so funny. I may steal that idea!

Similar here. Big "treats" seem to backfire too - the more special activities she gets, the more grumpy.
In our case I think loneliness is the issue, and hormones.