Is it lazy for supply teachers not to work in the school holidays?

[strwmofthebnak]

If someone is in their early 20's, graduated from uni last year as a qualified primary school teacher, moved back home with parents and is currently looking for a contracted teaching job. So applying and going to interviews but has so far been unsuccessful in securing a job. Therefore since they qualified they have been working for an agency doing supply work. This means they have 12 weeks a year they do not get paid in. Would you expect them to find alternative employment in the school holidays as it's not on to have 3 months of year not working and not being paid?

Holiday pay is factored into the rates supply teachers get though, but obviously they need to save it to cover their holidays.

If they want/need to work through the holidays, they'd get work at holiday clubs/camps, but likely not at qualified teacher rates.

Is this the parent who's posted here before convinced that their teacher child is lazy if they're not filling every moment with paid work though? Teaching is exhausting, they should have their holidays if they possibly can.

It depends on which council you work for.

I’ve done supply work in two councils.

One paid me an additional amount for each supply day I worked to cover the holiday I accrued on that day, which was itemised on my wage slip, and I just put the money aside.

Another one (when I was on a fixed term supply contract) withheld my holiday pay and paid me a proportion of it on any months with holidays.

I’ve never not had holiday pay though.

As long as they are paying their bills people are allowed to be as lazy as they like.

(If as some have guessed this is a supply teacher living with parents then it's fair enough to expect their rent or bills contribution through the holidays. It's good for them to get used to saving when they have income to pay out when they don't).

Quote from every weekly payslip I get as a supply teacher.

The holiday pay is calculated based on 5.6 weeks statutory holiday pay per year equivalent to 28 days holiday over 195 work days

But that is the exact same as what non supply teachers get. Summer holidays are unpaid for all teachers.

Considering there is a severe shortage of teachers, I’d be more concerned about why a teaching graduate can’t find a full time teaching position.

It took me 5 years to get a permanent teaching job. I’m a good teacher.

The shortages aren’t evenly spread across sectors/subjects.
The shortages aren’t evenly spread around the country - cities; particularly university cities which offer teacher training, are often tripping over teachers; but rural areas have shortages.
Schools often can only recruit fixed term contracts due to inability to commit long-term.
Because teaching is still a female dominated industry; many jobs are part time. If you accept a part-time position and end up having to do supply in a different local authority to top up the difference; you will be taxed at 20% on all of the “top up” supply work.

I did supply and usually ended up on long term contracts in primary where I effectively became the class teacher. I did all the planning, marking and assessment, dealt with parents, sorted classroom displays etc. In two of those contracts, OFSTED came in and treat me exactly as they would any other teacher. I was paid exactly the same rate for this as for day to day cover. Initially the pay was OK. The agency ran a payroll and I was taxed on PAYE. However, after a while, they outsourced this to a payroll company which classed supply teachers as self employed so from my daily rate I would pay both employees and employers national insurance contributions and a fee to the payroll company. They encouraged you to send mileage claims and food receipts in as they said these were tax deductible but apparently it's a tax grey area so I never felt comfortable doing it.

This was ten years ago. I imagined it hasn't changed.

I had some savings and used these to help me through the summer holidays and the supply agency used to get me some work in private day nurseries which helped too (although as a primary school teacher, with no children of my own, I was very poorly qualified for the baby room. But that's another story 😀)

I wouldn’t expect them to do anything, it depends on each persons personal circumstances, if they’ve worked a full year supply they’ve probably earned equivalent of a full time salary so may or may not choose to work, if they have a second income then they might choose to enjoy a longer break, if they are saving then they might choose to work, they can do whatever suits and I wouldn’t judge any of those choices

Tell your child to look at working in holiday clubs.

I am a supply teacher. I cannot work more than 3-4 days a week due to my health. I live off my 3 days a week work and then work an extra day whenever I am able - this means I have enough to live off during any holidays. Sometimes (like this entire academic year actually) I’m on long term so I have to do the same work as a permanent teacher over the holidays. Even when I don’t, I usually spend it catching up on doctors appointments and recovering. I would love to be a supply teacher for the rest of my career as I enjoy it so much. I don’t think I’m lazy. I’m not expecting anyone to pay for me or do my work for me. Weird attitude to have tbh - should other people get a job during their annual leave?

I don't think you can compare other careers with teaching because most people only get 5 weeks off a year in annual leave. I'm not having a pop at teachers but saying should other people get jobs when they are on annual leave isn't the same.

Back to the original question, I don't know if they should or not and it's not my place to judge but I do know one of my sisters friends is in the same position and she works at a hotel in the holidays on a zero hour contract. It suits her and the hotel because they are busy in the school holidays and she wants the money, she worked there throughout uni as a student so I suppose it is possible to find a job if they needed the money.

It really depends on the circumstances, imo. How much they have saved, if they're counting on someone else to support them during those three months, how that person feels about it, etc. It's not the easiest thing in the world to find decent pay for such a short period of time. If they could use the money and have an opportunity to earn during the holidays, maybe they should, but it's not automatically 'lazy' to choose not to work every minute available.

Actually agencies will often hold back some pay for you to get over the holidays.

I've found work in the summer holidays but not other holidays.

@rc22

You cannot claim expenses any more. I'm not working anymore but I have been offered huge daily rates in an attempt to make up the difference.

I know the reasoning is that normal employees don't get to claim travel but when I could claim I did one placement 300 miles from home so my only option was to stay in a hotel.

No, I’d assume that need a break. Supply teaching can be exhausting.

As does all agency work, not just teaching. Whole swathes of healthcare, factories, hospitality and many other sectors of the economy use agencies. If you work for them you build up holiday pay entitlement based on hours worked.

This. Plus where will you get a 12 week job from?

My dad is a retired teacher and for years and years he worked other jobs during all of the school holidays….. on fishing boats, building sites, picking fruit & veg, factory work etc

i don’t know how the hell he managed to just keep going all year round with no breaks at all.

No, I don't think it's 'lazy' for supply teachers not to work in the holidays. Also applying for professional jobs is a lot more in depth than you realise.
l suspect what you really mean is though is my adult child has offered me no board as they say they don't have a job and can't pay.

The hourly rate for supply teachers will include holiday pay or it could be paid as wages when you leave. Either way if you worked Sept to Sept there's an element in there deemed to cover the summer holidays.
If you're just pissed off that he gets to socialise/take days out/holidays whilst you're up at 6:30 everyday then cooking and cleaning when you get home....you might want to reconsider his living arrangements.

Everyone gets holiday pay. It's illegal not to pay it. It might be incorporated into their hourly rate but it will be clearly marked as AL.

Why?

Teachers only get 28 days annual leave per year. The rest is completely unpaid.

It really doesn’t pay to do this these days, the second job is taxed at 20% - and now that we have had a pay rise here in Scotland, the entire second job would be taxed at 40%.

And all zero hours work too.

I suspect it was likely cash in hand…. 70s / 80s very rural area, working for mates.

my mum couldn’t work as she was carer for my disabled brother who had very, very high needs, so I think he was trying to earn as much as possible.

you’re definitely right though, it wouldn’t be worth it now.