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AIBU?

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Original poster

To say that travel to various work locations count as work time?

64 replies

Beaniesmumsie · 30/03/2023 20:51

I just had a very good job interview with a big organisation and I’m feeling like they’ll offer me the job, they have many offices dotted around the country including Scotland, it’s a WFH position with HQ down south (I’m in the Midlands so about 3 hours drive). I was asked how comfortable I am with travelling and I said fine as long as it counts as work time. However they said they expect people to travel during their own time (not for big trips like to Scotland but they expect me to travel to HQ twice a month) and then do a full work day. Is this normal? In my previous jobs any travelling away from your place of work counts as work time.

I know if I get offered I’ll clarify with them to make sure I’m not misunderstanding them, but it’s gonna be a big sticking point for me.

YANBU - yes you should travel outside of core work hours
YABU - you had it lucky with previous jobs where travel to different offices count as work time

OP posts:
Howdoesitworkagain · 30/03/2023 21:22

It’s usually a bit of both in practice.

It would be silly and pointless to count 3 hours each way as part of your work day. On the other hand if you were going somewhere and staying over for a few nights, it would be petty to wait until after 5pm or whatever to start your journey home.

Not sure that it’s a conversation for an interview; I’d find it a bit odd if a candidate asked about this, but I suppose it depends how senior you are too.

youshouldnthaveasked · 30/03/2023 21:23

If you’re WFH the other days of the month you are saving on daily commuting time. I travel 30 minutes to my job so that’s an hour a day which is pretty reasonable I think (unpaid travel) 5 hours a week. 20 a month. Your 12 hours travel doesn’t seem to bad. And motorway miles too.

MsMcGonagall · 30/03/2023 21:45

I had a similar work situation in a previous job. On a day in the HQ I would be on the 7am train (that was the earliest train), work in the office 10am to 5pm, home at 8pm. Its a long day but I would count all of those as work hours, and use flexitime to work slightly shorter hours on another day.

My work paid for my train tickets. I would mostly work on the train as well, certainly on the way there, so it really was working time.

I did agree these terms with the organisation. The frequency of going to the HQ was discussed at interview, I dont remember when the paying for the train tickets was agreed but it was no issue - the organisation had precedents I think.

I had a recent interview for a similar situation, working from home with say monthly/fortnightly trip to office 2-3 hours away. They were not sure in the interview whether they would pay for the travel. I didn't get the job but it would have had to have been an issue to get agreement on, because it would have been lot of money for me to pay otherwise.

This type of organisation is looking for someone with the right skbeing restricted to who's available in one locality, plus they don't have to pay as much office costs for you as a work-from-homer, so my opinion is they should be up for paying for your travel.

But you should be up for making it a longer working day when you travel so you can maximise your time in the office.

MsMcGonagall · 30/03/2023 21:47

looking for someone with the right skills WITHOUT being restricted to who's availability in one locality...

TheFireflies · 30/03/2023 21:48

If it’s travel to my named office it’s classed as commuting and not part of work time.
If travelling to other offices not my named place of work, or to other locations, it’s in work time.
I guess yours might be a similar arrangement if you’re travelling to HQ.

roses2 · 30/03/2023 21:49

Where I work travel to HQ is your own time. Travel to other locations is work time within reason ie try to be at the location for work hours but not if its a 3+ hour journey to get there.

ghostyslovesheets · 30/03/2023 21:50

Travel to and from home to work at the beginning/end of the day is on my time

Travel from home if WFH in the middle of the day is their time and paid

If I have a meeting past work first thing I start my working day when I pass the turn off for work (as if I went into the office first and them left it would be works time) and if it's end of the day my time starts when I pass the office turn off for home

If that makes any sense at all - if I was travelling to a meeting 3 hrs away I'd deduct my usual time to get to work from the over all time - or get the train! That's all work time because I can work

Mortimermay · 30/03/2023 22:03

In my role, travel to HQ would be seen as a normal commute, which would not be paid for or counted as part of my working day. It wouldn't matter if I was WFH most of the time, HQ would still be counted as my "base" and travel there would be my commute.
Regarding travel to other places, if it was at the start of the day then I would only be paid travel expenses for any miles over what I would have done as my commute to HQ. So if HQ is 20 miles away but I have to travel to work somewhere else 25 miles away one morning, then I would be paid only for the extra 5 miles.
If I did any travel between places during the working day, so commuted to HQ but then had to travel somewhere else - then the full mileage and time for that journey would be counted because I'd already done my commute.

Original poster
Beaniesmumsie · 31/03/2023 04:41

Thank you wise ones of mumsnet. I guess I didn’t think that travelling to HQ is different to travelling to other sites, and some of you have put into perspective that my overall ‘commute’ over the month is pretty minimal really. I guess we will see if I do get offered the job or not!

OP posts:
EarringsandLipstick · 31/03/2023 06:45

Agree with most posters. The key line is they expect me to travel to HQ twice a month - that's not travel to a location outside of your work location, that's being asked to work your usual working day in the main office of the company and is therefore not 'work travel' but commuting, which is done in your own time.

coffeemoon · 31/03/2023 06:53

It's a bit of both and you need to be a bit flexible.

If you have a meeting that starts at 10am and it takes two hours to get there, you just leave at 8am without claiming it as work time.

If the meeting starts at 12, then all the travel would be in work time because you'd set off at 10.

That's just how the timings fall and no one makes a big deal of it in my workplace.

coffeemoon · 31/03/2023 06:55

Also, if travel to HQ twice a month is in your contract/ original job description then no, you don't get to claim it as extra time.

It counts the same as travelling/ commuting to your normal workplace.

coffeecupsandwaxmelts · 31/03/2023 07:19

If it's in your contract that you're expected in the office twice a month, then that's just your commute and you shouldn't be paid for it.

But if you're travelling to other locations for work then you should be compensated appropriately - that's always been the case for me, anyway.

carriedout · 31/03/2023 07:22

In my sector it would be normal to travel on work's time in this situation.

HelpMeGetThrough · 31/03/2023 07:32

We have various offices around the country. One I go to is 400 mile drive up, so if I'm in the office the next day, I'll drive the afternoon before, probably leave about 2pm and get to the hotel about 7pm, do the next day in the office, leave at about 4pm and drive home.

One that's 200 miles from home, I'll drive up that day, be in for 9 finish at 5 and then drive home again.

Depends where the office is to be honest. The 200 mile one I can be there in 2.5 hours, so very doable up and back in a day.

mozzierella · 31/03/2023 15:09

Depends on pay and contract

HouseIsOnFire · 31/03/2023 15:19

I think it depends on the general hours too?

I have a fully remote contract and am 250 miles from hq. If I'm expected to go to hq, I'll leave at a reasonable time in the morning and drive back sometime after lunch the next day (hotels etc are expensed).

If the travel infringes my personal time, them I accept it because they are very flexible about me taking longer lunches, appointments, leaving early etc.

If they were rigid 9-5, then I would be rigid about travelling only during work hours.

WindUpPenguin · 31/03/2023 15:54

In my job we have a 'home' office. You must travel to your home office 2 days a week. This counts as normal commuting and you are expected to travel on your 'own' time and do not have your expenses reimbursed. We have other sites, and if you need to be at one of those, you would be able to travel on work time (either in the work day, or taking flexi time) and you would book your travel through the travel system. You would also be entitled to claim back meals within the policy (which is something like £5 for lunch and £5 for breakfast if you have set off before a certain time).

pussycatinfluffyslippers · 31/03/2023 16:02

Book a quiet carriage on a train and work there?

No way should you have to give up entirely your own time if the job is home-based.
An hour or so extra to get an early train/one later finish is fair enough, but not a 6hr round trip drive on top of a full working day.
They need to split it over 2 days and pay for your overnight in a hotel.

JudgeRudy · 31/03/2023 16:24

I would say if you're expected to go into the office twice a month, and that has been stipulated before hand, then that's standard commute to work and like working anywhere else is up for you to facilitate. If you're occasionally being asked to eg attend meetings at the other end of the country, you'll likely get paid mileage and get TOIL however in my experience that's harder to agree. If you live in Birmingham and your meetings in Scotland then really you need to go up the day before. You'll likely be booked accomodation and a flight/train. The reality is though they'll let you leave at lunch on Tuesday to arrive at 8pm. Already you've worked 2 extra hours and you're stuck in a hotel. Up early, off to meeting, train/flight back, home for 10pm if you're lucky. Chances are you won't get anything 'back' for that.
Worth checking where your official base is. If it's HQ and that's 50 miles away, if you get sent somewhere else you'll only get paid for 'excess' mileage ie over 50. If you feel awkward it's perfectly reasonable to frame your questions around car insurance. If you're being paid mileage that's not a commute, that's work usage and you'll need business insurance.
Good Luck 👍

anniegun · 31/03/2023 16:27

Its a point of discussion before you take the job. Its not an unreasonable condition but you have to weigh it up as part of the overall package

Thatladdo · 31/03/2023 16:49

So a 3 hour communte either side of a shift once a fourtnite a problem?

Entitled much? 😆
Quite a few folk do that every day ya know...
Take it or leave it, stay over, whatever.

KrisAkabusi · 31/03/2023 16:57

TheFireflies · 30/03/2023 21:48

If it’s travel to my named office it’s classed as commuting and not part of work time.
If travelling to other offices not my named place of work, or to other locations, it’s in work time.
I guess yours might be a similar arrangement if you’re travelling to HQ.

Exactly the same for me. It's up to me to decide how far away I want to live from the main office, and it's my choice to do that commute.

Season0fTheWitch · 31/03/2023 17:22

Your commute to work is your problem to deal with. I chose to live 30 mins from my HQ so it's my personal time I travel in.

Aprilx · 31/03/2023 17:23

Albiboba · 30/03/2023 20:58

It’s usually a bit of both. Once you get to a certain pay grade it’s expected based on your contract that you work until the job gets done, rather than being contracted until X time. So while lots of the travel would also be in work time it would be highly unusual for someone to be travelling from the south to Scotland for work but refuse to get on a train until their normal work time, or to demand to leave at 1pm so they arrive home by 5:30.

I agree that it is a bit of both. I have in the past done a lot of business related travel, when I lived in London I travelled to New York and Zurich a lot, when I lived in Australia I travelled between the main Australian cities a lot. Whilst I might turn up in the office I was visiting at say 10am and maybe I would leave at 4pm, this still meant a lot of the travel was on my time and some on the employers time.

I also would sometimes travel to say New York on a Sunday so I was ready to work on Monday. When I was visiting Zurich, I usually took a flight out at about 7pm so definitely “my time” but I would book a flight home say 4pm and so it was a bit of my time and a bit of their time.