In thinking there probably is something not quite right with how ds is developing

[Worriedaboutitallstill]

I’ve posted here to get a range of views, as to be honest I think it will help to get it out anyway.

DS was 2 in December. For the first year he seemed to be developing ‘normally’, he hit all his milestones, no concerns raised by nursery (he started at nine months) or HV (she did a check at 10.5. Months but we haven’t seen or heard from her since.) I’m explaining that because she hasn’t seen ds at all in a year and a half so probably isn’t the best person to ask.

The first thing I noticed that made me a bit concerned was that I went to a first birthday party with a group of toddlers the same age and all were pointing at things, ds wasn’t, I should add here that ds was smiling, engaging, laughing, just wasn’t pointing. Mentioned this to dh who said not to worry, he was fine. Im not sure when he was pointing regularly but he definitely was at around 19 months maybe? He still does and makes a sort of ‘uh’ sound.

So the next thing I noticed was aggression, a friend visited when our children were both 16 months and ds was awful. Every time her child picked up a toy ds would snatch it from her, he pushed her, he wouldn’t let her look at anything. I also noticed that she was way more advanced than ds. My friend read a book to her dd and she was able to point out the different animals and so on. I thought maybe I hadn’t done enough with ds, I’d read with him but hadn’t said look at the rabbit, there’s a bee. I started doing that and making animal sounds. I think he picked these up again maybe a few months later, at around 20 months.

Also started getting reports from nursery about aggression, specifically biting. Utterly mortifying, but nursery reassured me it was normal. It did taper off, I still get the odd report now but it is occasional whereas before it was nearly every day.

He has lots of words but doesn’t put them together and I never feel we are having a ‘conversation’, maybe that’s normal for this age. He’ll just say things like daddy, car, socks. Still shows aggression to children, lots of pushing. If I say no sternly he cries but then goes back and does the same thing. He regularly just completely ignores me, other times he engages with me but deliberately disobeys, I feel this is more normal somehow, like if I say ds please don’t pull the curtain he’ll grin and pull it some more. If I have to physically stop him doing something or take him away he goes wild and thrashes around manically. He used to attack me sometimes, which was horrible, he’d grab the skin on my face or neck and twist it or yank my hair.

So - my worries are that he seems much later to do some things than other children (pointing, identifying things) and how aggressive he can be, mostly. I know people always look at the parent and let’s face it the mother and I am so upset to think something I have done or not done has led to this. I’m really worried about him not having friends because of how he is and I veer between thinking he’s fine, it’s all normal, he’s fine but maybe I’m not and I need to improve my parenting, and thinking maybe he is ND in some way.

Nursery did do a report recently as he moved up a room a couple of months ago, they did note that he struggled with his emotions sometimes but also said no concerns re development. But nursery don’t know everything? I wish I knew.

He is 2. He sounds like a very normal 2 yr old which is why nursery haven't raised concerns. Biting to express frustration at that age is really normal. Pushing is normal. He only has a handful of words. If someone snatches from him or he simply wants something he does not have the words or impulse control yet to say 'Can I have that?' and wait. So he snatches and pushes. A lot of 2 yr olds do this. My now teen DS did it A LOT. He's very sweet these days (and 6ft tall so good thing too really).

It definitely doesn't mean he will become a bully! This isn't bullying. He hasn't got an agenda to hurt others. He is much too little to understand what his actions are doing, he just knows he wants that toy NOW! So try not to get cross, just clearly say no pushing, hitting and remove him to calm down. As he gets older keep talking about how hitting would make him feel. He'll get it but it's quite normal (sorry) for it not to calm down totally until 4 or 5.

Sorry to see your thread's been overtaken by the tone police OP. I'm autistic myself (yes, one of those quite rare openly autistic SALTs) and also have one child with an autism diagnosis and another on the waiting list for a neurodiversity assessment... I see nothing wrong in referring to normal ranges of behaviour and it's bloody ridiculous to get offended at that - if you don't know what the norms are - how the fuck do you know when someone isn't achieving anywhere near those norms?!!?

There's a difference between "oh they're not quite meeting the typical age-expected range of normal development" from "OH SHIT THEY'RE TOTALLY NOT NORMAL AND VERY ODD AND MIGHT BE AUTISM - BRING OUT THE RED FLAGS GUYS" like you're being accused of on here. Tone policing on autism threads is doing my fecking head in at the moment though in general - work out how YOU want YOUR autism referred to - I personally don't give a shit if you decide to paint mine pink and call it Dave.

https://www.hanen.org/helpful-info/parent-tips.aspx#:~:text=All%20Hanen%20tips%20are%20based,them%2C%20with%20or%20without%20words I quite like some of the Hanen stuff - rather than bombarding the poor kiddo with MN performance parenting and not letting them get a word in edgeways like you might feel you "should" be doing to try to boost language (you'll probably get yourself a thread in AIBU to the bonus) - it's very focused on the child leading, back and forward interactions and not going overboard trying to overcompensate in some way. I forget the actual page URL with loads of resources but that link should hopefully find the way.

I'm not sure whether this is aimed at my comments, which specifically referred to my discomfort with talk of red flags and kids turning out "fine" if they proved to be neurotypical. I wouldn't want my kids to grow up and read comments like that, even if some autistic people don't personally mind them (many do), so it needed to be said and I stand by it. Making pleas for self-reflection is hardly dictatorial and I honestly didn't expect much push back on that. If I hadn't got it I wouldn't still be posting here.

But I worry about the extent to which this is turning into a dispute rather than something more productive. That's not what I want, it feels like we should all be on the same side. we surely all want autistic people to have the best lives possible, the question should be how can we best achieve that. For my part, I'm going to have a good think about how I can do a better job of flagging up language that makes me (and others) feel shit, without causing the people using that language to feel defensive. Maybe that way we can move forward.

@Twofoursixeight
I would suggest adopting a a basic assumption of good will on the part of the worried parent of a toddler as a starting point.

Plus, as you yourself seem to suggest, don't assume you speak for all neurodiverse people.

even if some autistic people don't personally mind them (many do), so it needed to be said

The last bit is the part I disagree with. If the ultimate aim is to help a possibly neurodiverse child to enjoy his best life, then helpful suggestions might be a better idea than general advocacy based on your own personal preference.

Sounds like a normal 2 year old to me!

With all respect, have you read the thread? I explicitly said I wasn't targeting the OP and offered my sympathies to her predicament. I was annoyed by other posters using terms like red flags, because I suspect they harm autistic people - and also, from my own experience, the worried parents of autistic children.

I never claimed to speak for every neurodiverse person (although I know many who object to the phrase red flag; a term used for cancerous moles and dodgy first dates doesn't seem that appropriate for children's identities after all).

And the very first thing I did was offer helpful advice about getting on the assessment pathway. Maybe I'm not the one who needs to assume good will?

Yes, I read the thread.

There was a bit of a pile on.

Some things really don't need to be said on other people's threads. Starting your own is always an option.

Sounds within the realms of normal to me!

I do tell DS off but it’s very hard to know where to gauge it. So today he pushed a little girl at a class we go to and I didn’t exactly shout but I did raise my voice and said DS no, don’t push her or something like that. He burst into tears and sat in the middle of the room as a protest and I did go to him then and quietly say it’s ok, but give her a cuddle if you want to touch her.

Honestly, this is not great behaviour management. You should have ignored the tantrum and been firmer and more consistent rather than delivering mixed messages (strong no followed by quiet it's OK; don't touch her followed by actually you can cuddle her). Pushing is not OK and other small children and babies may not want an unsolicited cuddle from another child any more than they want to be pushed! I go with very short clear instructions like "gentle hands please", and often, all you need to say is "NO". With something like deliberately pushing/hurting another child I would give no more than one warning before instantly removing from the situation. So pushing the little girl would have resulted in "right, we're going home" and hurting your friend's DC when they visited would be a time out, followed by the friend going home. Even very small children soon get to understand cause and effect/consequences if you keep things clear and simple for them.

It will get easier by the way; I hope you'll come back in a few months and tell us how well he is doing. Remember that statistically, it's unlikely there's anything wrong with him - he's most likely just a 2yo doing what 2yos do, and also feeling frustrated by his lack of language.

Sounds normal to me. Some of them are just a bit aggressive still at that age. My DD was and at 4 she still bites, which is unacceptable but not a development issue (more like I've clearly fucked something up).

@mathanxiety
I honestly don't know what to say, as you've simply ignored all my counterpoints. I never piled onto anyone and I've been very polite in the face of some pretty shitty ad hominem insults. I'm also a worried - and exhausted - parent who just wants their autistic kids to grow up in a world that sees them as fundamentally ok.

I wrote something in this thread rather than a new one because otherwise the people talking about red flags etc wouldn't have seen my comment. I never intended to make multiple posts, I've just been responding to a surprising and frankly perplexing pushback on the idea that we should try to speak tactfully about children with autism. I will reply to defend this idea if I have to, but I would much, much rather not have to.

Sounds within the realms of normal to me. How many days a week is he at nursery? If a lot, then his language might not be developing first. Spend as much time as possible talking with him, playing games with him, reading the book and pointing things etc. The attention and the conversation will both do him good