To be disappointed that the free 30 hours for 1-2 year olds won't come in fully until Sept 2025?

[OhwhyOY]

Totally understand the rationale behind needing to delay it a bit to make sure there are sufficient nursery spaces available, to allow for increased government funding to filter through given how financially strapped many childcare providers are atm due to 3-4 year old underfunding, etc. But to delay it coming in for one and a half years feels pretty tough on those who desperately need that support now, and also seems daft when it will potentially offer such a massive economic boost that we also need now. Definitely at least partly selfish disappointment as I have a current two year old who won't benefit at all, but I'm thinking more about all those people who are not in work so the government's primary target, and will still need to be sat at home another year or two. Great long term news though, as long as childcare places are properly funded by the government to avoid a loss of even more nurseries/childminders.

YABU OP to be disappointed, yes.

Of course it's not unreasonable to be disappointed. It would be unreasonable to be bitter, or to say "well they shouldn't bring it in at all then, if it doesn't benefit ME!"
But disappointed is fairly natural I'd have thought.

If only this was backdated roundabout 200k in childcare over the years oh well lol ....

'Jeremy Hunt announced an extension of 30 hours of free childcare to one and two-year-olds in England. But the plan is not being implemented immediately.

Here are the key dates:

Working parents of two-year-olds will be able to access 15 hours of free care from April 2024

From September 2024 hours will be extended to all children from 9 months upwards.

And from September 2025 every single working parent of under-fives will have access to 30 hours free childcare per week.

The number of kids per staff member in nurseries will rise from four to five, but the changes will be optional. nurseries will receive more funding

parents on Universal Credit will have childcare costs paid by the government up front

the maximum amount families on Universal Credit can claim for childcare will be increased by hundreds of pounds

people who take a childminder job will receive £600 while agency workers who take a childminder job will receive £1,200 as part of a pilot scheme

schools will receive more funding to provide wraparound childcare

30 hours free childcare will be extended to parents with children aged between nine months and two years old

Mr Hunt announced some parents with children aged nine months to two-years-old will receive free childcare.

But the help will only be offered to households where all adults are working at least 16 hours per week."

It doesn’t make sense to provide 30 hours to households where people are only working 16 hours a week. That will be the bit that gets jumped all over. Not the funding levels elephant in the room.

I think a lot of parents are disappointed at the slow implementation. They could bring it all forward a bit and start September this year surely? I fear PPs are right and its all just to set up labour

Do you know how legislation works?

Funny how it start just before the next GE and will still be being introduced at that time.

I think the idea is to enable people to take on more hours at work? A lot of the budget was aimed at getting people back into work.

Lots of minor errors here!

This. Or they manage to win the next election then scrap it.

It makes sense that this isn’t implemented straight away as providers will need time to get ready.

However couldn’t the government raise the tax-free childcare allowance and raise the threshold for losing out on child benefit?

Since my nearly 3 year old started nursery the prices have gone up by £10 a day due to cost of living crisis. That makes full time childcare for my nearly 1 year old £200 per month more expensive than two years ago. Raising the tax free childcare limit would help me whilst I wait for some funded hours starting in September 2023 and 2024.

YABU.

It will take childcare providers a couple of years to be able to adapt to these changes so it is sensible to start it Sept 2025.

If it started this September then where on earth are all the extra childcare places going to come from?!?!

Sorry, I’m being silly - can someone answer this please?

1 full time childcare place £2,000.

Roughly 30 children attend. That’s £60,000 a month.

Where does the £60,000 a month go?

Sorry another post, I don’t want to sound mean the salaries in nurseries aren’t great. So if the staff aren’t getting the money, then who is?

@anonymousxoxo i answered this on another thread earlier - based on our costs see below

break it down. Our nursery charges £62 a day/number of hours (usually 10) = £6.20 an hour.

Out of your £6.20 an hour they pay for staffing usually NMW +30% for pension and employers NI and holiday costs. Plus the more qualified staff members (manager and deputy manager) are usually on a bit more, also don’t forget they need to cover staff breaks, holiday, maternity pay, college day off, be a ratio with qualified staff at all times. Oh and a cook too so another person in addition to the caring team.
Training.
Gas and Electricity - these have more than doubled for childcare settings
Food (ours provides 3 meals and snacks every day) ours uses Asda for all food
Rent

Council rates (not subsidised and they are HIGH)
Consumables - those paints and paper etc don't come free
Maintenance work
Gardener

Surely you can do the maths?

All that costs £60k a month?

Don’t they get money from the government?

Did you just hear a number and times it by another random number?

@anonymousxoxo so I checked my nurseries accounts on companies house (dead easy btw) they barely make a profit,
I also know they don’t make 60k a month so not sure where you’ve plucked that figure from.

so here goes - they have 30 children on the reigster, but only 5 of those are full time (£300 a week) = £1500 a week. The remainder are all pt - let’s say 3 days each shall we. £4500 a week. There’s an income of £26k a month.
manager = £1750 a month
Cook = £750
staff x 7 full time at 40 hours a week - £1650 each plus 30% ers pension Ni and annual leave = £15k

total for staffing leaves around £8k a month for rent, bills, food etc etc

(getting there yet?)

Funding in my LA pays £4.60x 30 hours= £138/week.

Yes, it is great news and it’s not just people who have that age children now who will ‘miss out’. You seem to be forgetting those who had to make difficult childcare and financial choices for the last 10+ years.

Oh no. DS will be 3 by then anyway..😞

Post a silly question and get a silly response.

Your post is the reason some children are better in childcare as some parents lack basic cognitive and maths skills to understand the very basics. How much do you think rent, utilities, insurance, staff, training, equipment and materials etc. costs.

I've been chatting to my childminder tonight when I picked my kids up and she currently has 3 little ones (Pre schoolers) then older ones for wraparound care.
She also works some of the school holidays but not all of them.

She was saying tonight that she's very pleased she's further on in her career (late 50's) and has said that when all her pre-schoolers start school (1 this September - mine!) and 2 in September 2024 then she has one baby, not all at the same time, different days, she won't be accepting any more Pre-schoolers she'll just focus on wraparound and holidays as she can't see how it would be viable and the waiting for the money is a pain.
She said she loves having the preschoolers but at the current hourly rate she couldn't possibly afford any more!
The baby she has is a sibling of 2 older ones who also go but she's said tonight she'll be the last little one she accepts she thinks unless it's a good offer on the table.

I routinely see childminders with 7-8 mindees in tow including a mix of babies, toddlers, preschoolers, young primary, even if some of them are "just" wraparound care/drop offs/pickups and some aged 8+ and therefore don't count in ratios. No offence, but this is already the absolutely lowest quality provision. Nobody needs a victorian baby farm.
Proposals to relax ratios are disastrous.