NHS prescription penalty charge

[Knickerbockerglories]

I am hoping someone has some experience of this and can advise me…

my husband and I both take long term medication and have previously bought the yearly pre payment prescription card.

I switched to a monthly direct debit and thought I/we had switched his too, clearly we didn’t and he has been ticking the prepayment option for about a year without realising.

last month he got a penalty charge notice after an ‘automated check’ I phoned and explained and offered to back pay the years card, and they basically said tough he would get the fine. Fair enough, our mistake. I went online that day and set up his direct debit for the monthly option which auto renews each year- we won’t be caught out again!

problem is he’s just had another charge notice for the month after the last one… so probably another penalty fine… will these continue for the full year or so he missed so be about £1,000 in total?

if they look at the system they can see it was an error after paying the annual charge regularly for years before…. Do I ring them again or will that just highlight the other times (which he’s more than covered in the first fine).

I know he’s technically in the wrong but it was a genuine mistake and he’s paid the fine and set up the DD option to make sure it doesn’t happen again…

any advice? Has anyone had anything similar?

Sorry thought it was £1000 per script.
😂

I think the pharmacist can check if you have one but they will just take your word if you say you are exempt.

Then a few months later you get the fine.

Neverdropyourmooncup

I never get an email, not without hunting in spam usually - despite clicking to say it's not spam. And sometimes just doesn't come.
Last time I managed to find a link online to find it - but no record, which is why I bought a new one. No idea what the number and expiry date in my calendar is for though as that doesn't appear to exist!

This time I've screenshot my confirmation page as 'evidence' as still didn't get an email!

As said before, I haven't been asked to show it for years p bar this last time when I went to a new out of area pharmacy,

Fraud is deception to gain... if there's no deception it can't be fraud. Its simply an error

Why do MNers post rubbish about things they know nothing about?

www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/fraud-act-2006

There has to be deception, which has to be intentional. It is not a strict liability offence (look up what that is).

However, the issue is different with prescriptions, where you are fined if you do not pay when you are supposed to. That is not fraud and is a stand alone issue.

I used to be eligible for an exemption based on my low wage (part time working due to a health condition). I got a tiny salary increase one year and I was no longer eligible, which I didn't realise. It took me a couple of months to register I had not had the renewal letter as I was very sick at the time. I bought the annual prepayment certificate that day, but it was not soon enough, and sure enough a fine and nasty letter arrived. I tried calling and explaining that there had been no notice, that I had been very ill etc. They were not interested, just lets find a way to penalise the poorest and sickest in society as usual.

According to the website, you should have received a letter asking them to confirm their entitlement and give you 28 days to respond. However, the problem is, your DH WASNT entitled, so would be fined.
www.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/penalty-charges-explained

Nobody is charged because of fraud. They are charged because there is a law that says they must pay a penalty if they don't pay the correct charge at the time, unless:

"...he shows that he did not act wrongfully, or with any lack of care, in respect of the amount recoverable..."
www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1999/2794/regulation/2/made

So anyone who says 'Oops I didn't realise' or 'Oops I forgot' would be deemed to have shown a lack of care.

Sooooo I was accused of wrongfully getting free NHS treatment twice:

1. I paid for my Band 1 appointment, however the dentist ticked the wrong box on their paperwork which made it seem like I got the treatment for free. I received a letter stating I wrongly claimed free dental treatment and that a penalty would be imposed. I sent it to my dentist essentially asking “wtf”. The dentist emailed the NHSBSA explaining their error. I sent over my receipt confirming I paid too. The NHS looked dimly at my dentist as they essentially claimed for the cost of my treatment through them and got paid twice.

2.I had a prescription pre-payment certificate and used it. I then got a letter in the post saying they could find no record of it and I would have to pay a penalty. I called the NHSBSA and they could see I had a valid certificate, it’s just that the address didn’t match the address on my prescription. I was a student at the time and lived between halls and my parent’s home. They fixed their error and nothing came of it.

overall I just think their fraud detection seems quite high?

This happened to me. I was paying monthly but whilst pregnant I cancelled my direct debit as I stupidly thought my matb1 was the same as a maternity exemption form. I received multiple fines and had to pay the prescription charges for all of them even though I could prove I was entitled to a maternity exemption certificate at the time.

Can the email certificate not be printed off and trimmed then laminated, so it fits in a purse/wallet? If it shows an expiry date then it could be more easily checked.

(I don’t have a a prepayment card and don’t know what this email would look like, so apologies if this idea isn’t feasible).

why? you can show the certificate including expiry date directly on your phone which takes seconds. Printing it doesn’t add any legitimacy. I’d imagine it would be very easy to fake a paper, printed certificate. People can’t tamper with a genuine email retrieved from their inbox in real time, or with the live NHS website.

Why - because emails can be lost and it’s a visual reminder to the person who has paid for the certificate. An alternative would be writing the expiry date on a calendar. There seems to a number of posters not knowing when the certificate expires, and not always getting the reminder email.

Do you have to show the original email on a smartphone when collecting a prescription then? (Asking as I don’t have this certificate nor knows anyone who’s does, so I can ask them).

I only show my certificate once per year. My pharmacy records the details on their system. I confirm that it's renewed each year. I get 8 medications per month so it would be crazy not to pre-pay.

How do you know if the midwife did the form? I remember asking for one from the midwife, but never received anything physically - I’m panicking now as I had to have quite a bit of dental treatment.

That was @WingingIt101 sorry!

This is an error and the system for fines and reminders is crazy.
I would see your MP and contact a newspaper

It is digitised. It's called Real Time Exemption Checking. It means most exemptions can be checked when you collect your prescription. But if the pharmacy hasn't done the check, you won't flag until a retrospective check is done when the FP10 is sent to NHSBSA.

www.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/help-nhs-prescription-costs/real-time-exemption-checking

I needed a dentist, emergency one (as for many years, even for my DC, never been able to get an NHS one) at the time i was claiming JSA (contributions based)
After the treatment and still in discomfort and without my reading glasses, i was handed a form, i said i couldn't read it, so the receptionist did, she asked if i claimed JSA i said i did, she said "no charge"
I didn't even know there was a income based version.

A few weeks later i got a £123 fine.

As far as they are concerned there are no excuses whatsoever, its all "fraud"... their website says differently about genuine errors but in practice, that is not the case.
I appealed but once the form is signed, thats it.... Ignorance is no excuse.

Strange how these "errors" don't attract fines for MPs when they claim their expenses incorrectly, even when it is fraud, return the money & an apology is all that is required.

One rule for us.....

@Knickerbockerglories

You will not be getting a PCN charging you for anything above the prescription charge unless you have not responded to an Enquiry Letter within 28 days of it being issued.

Call them and explain. Only if you ignore an Enquiry Letter will the PCN charge come. Only if you ignore that PCN for 28 days will an additional surcharge be added.

The service is very busy currently but ring them and talk to them.

So frustrating. I've received a fine which I'm contesting as am pregnant.
The pharmacist never asked for any documentation as I'm clearly pregnant, he just said ''are you pregnant?''
After discussing the fine with my midwife i was issued the certificate, however it only backdates a month so doesn't cover the period when fined.

www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/nhs_penalty_charge_notice_number

Looks like they rarely take anyone to court so you could just ignore it and hope for the best

Interesting but as the page says "we are trialling with a small number of pharmacies ", it's not widely active yet. Perhaps it will improve things when it's eventually rolled out.

Are you a pharmacist or just a random googler who doesn't read their links?

My pharmacy certainly doesn't check: it's a little Lloyds. They ask if I pay for my prescriptions, I say I have a prepayment certificate, they never ask to see it and I just sign the back of the green slip.

Ours used to check and ask for the certificate number but they seem to have stopped again

But if the pharmacy hasn't done the check, you won't flag until a retrospective check is done when the FP10 is sent to NHSBSA.

I imagine it is not uncommon that pharmacies don’t bother checking.

I had a PPC that ran out in early January, the pharmacy never checked the number/expiry date with me.

I didn’t renew it as I turned 60 last week.

However, I had to insist that I paid, the pharmacist just said ‘Oh you have a PPC’….No, I don’t, it has run out. I need to pay.