To think shops don’t have CCTV in changing room cubicles?

[Lucysmumma]

Yesterday a friend and I went shopping and popped into Primark for a few bits. In the changing room a hand reached under my friends cubicle and tried to grab her phone. When we spoke to the manager he said he would check CCTV in the changing rooms and I assumed he meant they had cameras in the entrance or something but he said no they actually have cameras in the cubicles. My friend and I were shocked as we had been trying on stuff and friend had tried on a few bras 🫢. Does anyone work in retail and know if that’s correct or legal?? I’m kind of a bit freaked out as I assumed cameras weren’t allowed to video people changing. Also there were no signs up stating there was cctv which I thought was a legal requirement?

Surely not in the changing cubicles themselves?
You read about cases when hidden cameras have been used and the perpetrators have wound up in court for voyeurism, surely the same would apply if cameras were inside the cubicles and no warnings?

however, I seem to be in the minority but I would absolutely rather my breasts were flashed on a CCTV than there be none at all and I was potentially sexually assaulted because shops want to make changing rooms gender neutral

You obviously aren't aware of CCTV making its way onto the web. You'd not only be flashing your breasts on CCTV. There'd be a high likelihood that whoever is in charge of the CCTV would not be able to resist the lucrative world of fetishists who get off on watching spy cameras - ie women changing (or using the loo..) when they don't know they're being watched.

And the changing rooms can't be gender neutral, I think you mean mixed sex?

There's no excuse for mixed sex changing rooms, unless each cubicle is fully enclosed, (walls and a door, all floor to ceiling). It's well documented that once men have access to women changing, the number of abuses increases. Total shocker of course!

No, cctv in the cubicle area so they would be able to see someone reaching under the door for your friends phone, not inside the cubicles themselves watching people change.

When the hand came under the cubicle wasn’t there an automatic instinct to stand hard on it? How did she stop it being stolen, it’s too slow to bend down. Didn’t she open the cubicle door (or curtain since it’s crappy Primark) and see the thief or call them out?

Presumably that the laws which govern indecent images of children are far stricter than those which govern indecent images of adults?

Erm, why? If they don't have a bag or pockets and have been carrying it around where do you suggest it goes? There's often no seat in there even. I mean you've picked an odd but to question but obvs your thing isn't it. Even if they do have pockets or an bag if it was in their hand to take pics of whatever and it's quicker to place on the floor for a couple of mins

They don't have cameras in cubicles 🙄

They meant the communal area not inside the cubicle surely? The female toilets in my local pub have CCTV in the handbasin area, which I'm convinced from it's position would see over one of the cubicles. It's a well know chain and hopefully its set so it doesn't, but I avoid that cubicle none the less.

The communal areas are often covered with CCTV but the cubicles are not for obvious reasons. The person who tried to get the phone would have presumably been in the communal walkway outside the cubicles?

yes i did read your link. it mentions changing rooms but not specifically the cubicles.

Law - Article 8 of the human rights act gives me the right of a private and family life. "It also includes your right to control who sees and touches your body. For example, this means that public authorities cannot do things like leave you undressed in a busy ward, or take a blood sample without your permission."

Although there is no specific law in regards to CCTV, it is regulated by Security Industry Authority. There was a FOI request for clarification on the law in regards to CCTV in toilets which i believe individual changing cubicles require the same level of privacy.

It states:-

2.1 Session 2: Legislation

Aim: To understand the different types of legislation and how they impact on Public Space Surveillance (CCTV) operations.

Objective 1: Identify how the Data Protection Act impacts on to the role of a CCTV Operator.

The meaning of “confidentiality” as it applies to the role of a CCTV operator:
compliance with 6 principles of the Data Protection Act
not disclosing information to any unauthorised persons relating to all operational aspects of the system and data security
no unauthorised recording e.g., using mobile phones or similar devices
no unauthorised copying of footage
body worn cameras
UAVs (drones)
Repercussions of breaches, for example:
dismissed, fines and potential prosecution

Objective 6: Identify how the offence of voyeurism impacts on public space surveillance (CCTV) operations
Safeguarding requirements:
safeguarding children and young people, and others including voyeurism, limits what you can view and record
what considerations to take before viewing CCTV material
voyeurism falls under the Sexual Offences Act 2003
[Reference: FOI 0351]

full article can be found here - www.gov.uk/government/publications/use-of-cctv-cameras-in-toilets/use-of-cctv-cameras-in-toilets

YANBU.

I would consider contacting Primark's head office. I find it hard to believe they would have cameras in the cubicles, especially as most CCTV cameras are plainly visible, and think it more likely the manager was either lying or mistaken.

Holy crap

I'm never trying on clothes in a shop again 😐

For a start it's essentially indecent photography of children 🙄

If I ever found out anyone was taking footage of my child getting changed I'd have something to say about it!

It does matter. Children have a higher level of protections as they are vulnerable users who may not be able to understand the impacts of cctv and their right to privacy.

When we spoke to the manager he said he would check CCTV in the changing rooms and I assumed he meant they had cameras in the entrance or something but he said no they actually have cameras in the cubicles

I very much doubt that Primark has CCTV cameras in each of the cubicles, he probably meant in the cubicle lobby area so, depending on the layout and where the person reached under from, they'd either be able to see it happening if it was done from under the door in the "lobby" or they would be able to see who went into the cubicle they reached under from.

I work in a store with customer changing rooms and they are the place many people use to steal because they know we don't have cameras in the cubicles. It is set up in a straight corridor with cubicles either side and we have CCTV directly outside the entrance to cover anyone coming in/out but there is also a CCTV camera at the end of the corridor so it captures anyone walking to/from the actual cubicles but not inside them. If someone asked us to check the CCTV for whatever reason we refer to the different feeds as the "lobby CCTV" and the "cubicle CCTV" because whilst both cover the general vicinity of the changing rooms only one shows inside the actual changing room area.

I think the manager has just phrased it badly. Your friend said did they cover just the entrance (meaning the corridor with the entrances to each cubicle) but he's been thinking she means the entrance to whole changing room facility (like that bit of the shop) and said "No, in the actual cubicles" meaning in the corridor. But not necessarily in EACH cubicle. Poor phrasing. I remember on Watchdog or something years ago that had complaints that one camera in one department store high up on the roof could unintentionally see very slightly into a couple of cubicles and there was uproar. And me being horrified by it have always looked out for them since just incase. Never seen one.

Ahh, previous poster to me has explained it much better. Lobby and cubicles. But not in each cubicle. Once again that'll teach me to read the full thread!

I've now said the word 'cubicle' so many times it's lost all meaning as a word and just sounds like a noise