To ask what you think your reading level might be?

[2023a]

I think lots of us have had the odd frustrating conversation on here, where the other person just hasn’t seemed to be able to grasp what we’re saying. Apparently, it’s very possible that the posters in question genuinely don’t understand.

A 2011 government survey of adult literacy skills found that 14.9% (or 1 in 7) of adults in England have literacy levels at or below Entry Level 3, which is equivalent to the literacy skills expected of a nine to 11-year-old.

More recently, in 2015, the OECD conducted its Survey of Adult Skills, known as PIAAC (Programme for the International Assessment of Adult Competencies). This survey found that 16.4% (or 1 in 6) of adults in England, and 17.4% (or 1 in 5) adults in Northern Ireland, have literacy levels at or below Level 1, which is considered to be 'very poor literacy skills'.

More info here, if you’re interested: literacytrust.org.uk/parents-and-families/adult-literacy/what-do-adult-literacy-levels-mean/

It's very telling that so many of the posters who have "found" this thread are clearly super-literate in one or more languages, and that many self-taught to read. We would be interesting as a self-selected group to study more closely.

Like others, I worked in communications (advertising, marcomm and B2B/financial) used Flesch scoring, and then did a PGCE. The lack of literacy was a real bar to accessing secondary education. But the example of the Aldous Huxley interview encapsulates how the mass media have dumbed down over the years.

Also, after glancing at the National Literacy website, I noticed that nowhere is there an option to train as a volunteer.

I have been a copywriter in a previous life and am still involved in website content, so I would like to think that mine is also high.

I admit to getting frustrated when posters have clearly not understood what the OP is trying to say, even when it is all written in the first post.

These days, I don't think the mainstream media is much more than thinly disguised adverts, click bait and propaganda telling us what to think and do.

At least you can find good long form interviews and information if you find the right podcasts or substacks.

It depends on what I'm reading.
I semi read posts sometimes and miss things because I'm in a hurry, bored or don't feel its fantastically important. Same with replies, I don't do a lot if any research for my replies on forums.
I have an MSc and a very busy medical job and when I'm home I like to read books and will read all evening, I'm just reading a Hilary Mantel, I like a book that makes you think. I think I have a high level of literacy.

MSM always has a bias, you just need to know what that bias is (though it's often fairly obvious). However, it's only fair to point out that the bias frequently isn't the writer's, it's the medium's – the angle the paper wants to promote is done in the editing process and via headlines, introductions, pull-quotes, and the rest of the page furniture. On newspapers, these are rarely written by the original writer. I think a healthy dose of scepticism is the best approach! Apologies for the slight digression.

Our house is packed with books, including the classics (DH has an English degree) and an awful lot of not-so-classics… And non-fiction too. DH and I both read all the time, but only 2 of my 3 have become big readers. Not sure what that tells us in the nature v nurture debate.

This is interesting to me. I’ve often seen people say ‘I skimmed that and missed X’. I don’t think I’d know how to do that. If I’ve read something, I’ve read it.

And, much as I adore Hilary Mantel, I’m not sure I’d call those ‘books that make you think’.

As the thread title was so clear, I suspect posters who aren’t extremely confident about their literacy have largely steered clear.

However, I do think one or two posters have still missed the point a bit.

This really does explain so much. I've left threads feeling infuriated by how off topic it becomes as the comments come in. One commenter will misunderstand something in the OP, and the proceeding posters will start incorporating that misunderstanding into their reply until most of the the replies are barely relevant to the OP's situation or question. Then the OP comes back to try to clarify things, and is accused of lying or drip feeding. The thread ends up snowballing out of control. It's nuts.

My literacy level is pretty good. I did English literature for A-level and got a First in my degree (not English Literature). I went to a school where we were pushed. We weren't really allowed to speak in colloquial English and good use of grammar was drummed into us.

My parents are both very articulate, with good vocabularies and I grew up in a language-rich home. My mother gave me 'word of the week', where she taught me a new word and we used it in conversation a lot that week. My parents didn't dumb down their communication with me, and made sure to speak clearly and expressively.

However, none of us were very avid readers, strangely, instead preferring to write. I mean, I can read as fluently as the next person, unless the theme is something very technical. However, I much, much prefer to write. I'm currently learning a new language and my spoken skills are much superior to my comprehension in the language. I don't know if the two are connected, but I was a lacklustre reader in school who always excellent at written assignments.

My children are both very expressive and articulate, and yet neither love reading either (but can read just fine for their respective ages). The thing that really propelled my literacy skills was reading the academic papers/research as part of my degree/postgraduate. The language definitely informed my own writing. I would say I'm probably the only person I've ever met who loves writing essays!

There's some interesting stuff on language and thought here:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_and_thought#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DLanguage_neither_creates_nor_distorts%2Cexpress_all_that_they_think.?wprov=sfla1

I'm in the bottom 2% for speed and bottom 12% I think for ability / accuracy. I'm dyslexic. I actually did well though school because I'm "academically gifted", I have a degree. I read for pleasure. I just skip alot to get though it quicker. Not being able to actually read some words doesn't really matter in your head, I just garble over them.

I don't know about adults, but I've worked extensively with young children and the ability to reason from A to B, or extrapolate that if C is true, D must follow, is in my experience a bigger predictor of future success than the ability to decode / read. Some children never get there and continue to struggle with most of the curriculum.

I have a hunch it's related to how many separate parts of information your brain's able to retain and manipulate at once - there's often a day when with children the ability to hold three things in their head just clicks, and it gets better from there. Really interested to read up on some of the links.

I used to hear readers at my sons school and was responsible for moving them up bookbands. (I did have training). It amazed me how some of the very confident sounding decoders didn't really understand the text. Then others would stumble through it and appear to struggle but had great comprehension.

the ability to reason from A to B, or extrapolate that if C is true, D must follow

That is literacy and reading comprehension, though. It’s the foundation for this:

Level 4: Adults can integrate, interpret or synthesise information from complex or lengthy texts. Adults can identify and understand one or more specific, non-central idea(s) in the text in order to interpret or evaluate subtle evidence-claim or persuasive discourse relationships.

Level 5: Adults can search for, and integrate, information across multiple, dense texts; construct syntheses of similar and contrasting ideas or points of view; or evaluate evidence based arguments. Adults understand subtle, rhetorical cues and can make high-level inferences or use specialised background knowledge.

I never knew about the subjunctive, and many other grammatical concepts, until I started formally learning another language. Funny how learning another language improved my grasp of English.

'. I would say I'm probably the only person I've ever met who loves writing essays!'

@Jaslima you've just met one. I loved all of the written work, it ignited my passion for words. I adored writing my dissertation for my English Literature degree, probably alittle too much (had to heavily edit it to stick to the word limit)!

I said the answer was hand. Because you measure a human in feet, and horses in hands. Wrong answer, right answer was hoof.

How do you know you got it wrong, though? The marker might have given you credit for it.

Same here @Natsku.
I had never heard of the subjunctive until I did A level French.

@user1471453601 one of the problems with those tests is that you need to be using the same cultural references as the person who sets the questions to get the answers "right". (This is why those types of tests are accused of being classist and racist.)

So while I can see the connection between your answer and the question, which is a is right answer, when I saw the question I immediately knew what they were asking for.

However I had to train to answer questions that way. It did help when I was about 8/9 one of my siblings was applying for graduate jobs and left some books around the house with those type of questions. I then had a nosey and started doing them.

It is also logic.

At my primary school we use to do "games" which when I started doing stuff in computing I realised they were simple logic problems.

The children who were good at them at my primary school also tended to have good reading comprehension skills.

"I'm currently learning a new language and my spoken skills are much superior to my comprehension in the language."

I find this fascinating. I'm the opposite and stupidly assumed it was the same for everyone.

I've always loved reading , but have found writing and answering questions about literature much more difficult - so, again, the opposite of your experience. I felt I could instinctively understand the nuances in the books I read, but having to explain just how or why the author had chosen to convey their message really was a chore. I didn't, and don't, like dissecting books.

I used to be able to do level 5. After spending the covid years on MN, I don't think I could even do level 4. SM has decimated my concentration levels and just focusing on reading those descriptors tires me out.

You are the normal one! Most people learning a new language start off by understanding more than they can speak and reading is normally stronger than writing. I don't know why I'm such a weirdo!

You’re definitely not alone in this! I suspect that social media has done a number on most people’s literacy.

The reverse is probably also true, though. People are writing more, more often and across more media than ever before (texts, emails, SM platforms). So I suppose in some ways the current generations are probably more comfortable with (and better at) written communication than any prior. It’s just often somewhat inelegant and/or surface communication as opposed the sort of thing covered by the above descriptions.

So interesting.