Puppy yoga - unethical

[mymycherrypie]

I understand that with rescue dogs this could be a legitimate thing, the dogs get some human contact and benefit where by they wouldn’t normally in kennels.

But people I know have bred dogs which suffer from breathing issues but are currently in fashion, and as a result of not being able to sell them on (priced them too high and the dogs got old) has gone down this route instead. She is not a yoga teacher or has any interest in yoga.

AIBU to think that this is a bit of an unregulated area really in general. She keeps her dogs well and spoils them but the idea of them being bred for money - not to go to a family but to perform for and get touched up by strangers at classes - makes me uneasy. After we leave these puppies after a class, how do we know what happens to them. Having masses of puppies for this seems unnecessary when rescue dogs could benefit so much.

Do you think it’s unethical?

@Ludo19

OMFG are you actually serious?

Puppy yoga! I've heard it all now. Not on imo. Ok if it's inviting people with their own puppies (although remembering puppy socialisation classes it would be hilarious to try to add calming yoga into the mix).

@mymycherrypie

thanks for your reply.

🙇🏻‍♀️🙇🏻‍♀️🙇🏻‍♀️

Not all horses enjoy being ridden. And those that do - I guess there's no way of knowing whether it would be their choice, or whether it's a horse form of Stockholm syndrome, that they enjoy being ridden because it's the only chance they get to explore a little.

Cats self domesticated. No issues there.

I saw this advertised near me too and thought wtf!. Where are they getting all these puppies from and also puppies grow, fast, so what then?
Not to mention they pee and poo everywhere and have teeth and claws like needles, I can't imagine it would be very relaxing but I'm not surprised at the exploitation of animals to make money sadly.

If a horse didn't enjoy being ridden, it wouldn't let you ride it in the first place - broken in or not. All they need to do is kick you, buck you off or bolt off somewhere.

There's a reason lots of horses end up as field ornaments - because they're not suitable to be ridden for one reason or another.

Horses have been broken in, domesticated and ridden by humans for thousands of years - zebras haven't. Does that not tell you something? If it was that easy to just domesticate an animal and start riding it, why don't we ride zebras too?

If a horse didn't enjoy being ridden, it wouldn't let you ride it in the first place

If that's the case, why are there articles about how to tell if your horse is unhappy about being ridden, and how to find out what the issue is?

If a person is broken, often they will do things they don't enjoy. How do you know horses aren't the same? Maybe they have grown to connect to their captor because it's their best option for survival? You can't possibly know that's not the case, can you?

If that's the case, why are there articles about how to tell if your horse is unhappy about being ridden, and how to find out what the issue is?

Because there's a big difference between being unhappy because of undiagnosed pain (ulcers, kissing spine, arthritis) and not wanting to be ridden in general.

If a person is broken, often they will do things they don't enjoy. How do you know horses aren't the same? Maybe they have grown to connect to their captor because it's their best option for survival? You can't possibly know that's not the case, can you?

You can't possibly know that is the case either - it's purely speculation on your part.

Do you feel the same way about dogs, out of curiosity?

It’s not really the same as baby yoga in that baby yoga is good for wind and stimulates the baby, encourages a good nights sleep etc. puppy yoga is yoga that looks cute with puppies. If there was grown dog yoga, that might make it an argument. Oh yeah there IS grown dog yoga but it’s rescues which isnt nearly as cute and can’t make money for (notoriously greedy) breeders in the same way.

I'm not saying it's the case. I'm saying it could be. The fact that horses need to be broken in the first place would suggest it's not something they are naturally happy. Something that is also the case for people with Stockholm syndrome.

I absolutely feel that dogs should not be ridden. That would be totally unacceptable.

I'm not saying it's the case. I'm saying it could be. The fact that horses need to be broken in the first place would suggest it's not something they are naturally happy.

All "breaking in" really means is that you're teaching a horse how to carry a rider and tack - in the same way you teach sheepdogs to herd properly, or guide dogs to help the blind.

It doesn't mean that they're unhappy doing it, just that they need to learn how to safely carry a rider before they can be allowed to do so.

I absolutely feel that dogs should not be ridden. That would be totally unacceptable

I have trained a pony to be ridden. I think 'breaking in' is often misunderstood as somehow breaking the pony's spirit. No horse person worth their salt would want to do that.
The ideal with training a horse or a pony is to get a true partnership going, similar to the way an assistance dog would work. It should be mutually beneficial.
There are many problems with the way that animals are used by people but I do think the horse world is slowly realising that ethics are important, and we must do better.

All the above is exploitative. I am vegan. I used to ride horses. I know better now. I will never ride again.

I'd prefer to see pets phased out too. And eating animals, obviously.

I agree it’s often misunderstood. It’s really just training and building a bond of trust and affection between you and the horse. I’m not an expert like the horse dancing (dressage) riders.

Those are beautiful horse/human partnerships to watch. It’s an Olympic sport.
m.youtube.com/watch?v=T_9JzbanR3w
m.youtube.com/watch?v=IZfa5Rl2o94

Yes, I agree.

The term "breaking in" really doesn't help and makes people think horses are forced against their will and hurt until they cooperate, which really isn't the case at all.

Horses have to be taught to carry weight safely, in the same way dogs are taught to walk on a lead and not toilet in the house.

the idea of them being bred for money - not to go to a family but to perform for and get touched up by strangers at classes - makes me uneasy

You're going to be really upset when you find out about factory farming.

Are you okay with cats as pets? They are the only animals that self-domesticated.

You say you disagree with pets but what about working animals like police dogs, sniffer dogs or guide dogs? What about dogs used to help find people trapped by avalanches or earthquakes?

Is riding horses cruel if you live somewhere isolated or without car access and you're using them for your only mode of transport? What do you think about all research that says many disabled people benefit from being around animals and even from riding horses?

I'm just interested where you draw the line. If you're not okay with, for example, working dogs, then what do you suggest we do/use instead?

I have to say I don’t know if police dogs are bred specifically for it or if it’s something they fall in to if they show an aptitude. These are French bulldogs bred specifically because they are cute puppies which can make a buck, a police dog doesn’t necessarily grow out of its skill but a puppy doesn’t remain a puppy forever. It’s use for yoga and other money making endeavours is limited. Do police dogs live in kennels or homes?

I feel like money that could be directed at a charity is being thrown at what may be a puppy factory in some cases, as they make better pictures than rescues.

Just try to sit on a horse which doesn’t want to be ridden . Unless you have superglue , you will end up on the ground fairly quickly. It will probably give you a swift quick to make the point, as well.

I’m not really talking about horses tho. More breeding cute puppies with known breed issues, then renting them out hourly under the guise of “yoga” until they grow big enough to sell. Loving a horse/dog/any animal for life doesn’t feel in the same greedy league.

Yeah I've seen it on TV.....can't say it looks all that great from the goats perspective tbf.

What???

So guide dogs, hearing dogs for the deaf and support animals fall into this too aye?

My cats are fed better than me and I meet all their needs. You've obviously no idea that having a pet keeps some people right and gives them a purpose.

I have to say I don’t know if police dogs are bred specifically for it or if it’s something they fall in to if they show an aptitude.

Both.

These are French bulldogs bred specifically because they are cute puppies which can make a buck, a police dog doesn’t necessarily grow out of its skill but a puppy doesn’t remain a puppy forever. It’s use for yoga and other money making endeavours is limited.

Does it matter that it's only doing it for a few weeks, though? The socialisation window for dogs of any breed is tiny btw - it closes at around 16 weeks. I can't see any issue with someone earning a bit of money while they get their puppies socialised before they go to their forever homes.

The ethics of breeding French Bulldogs are a separate issue imo as any breed of dog could be used for puppy yoga.

Do police dogs live in kennels or homes?

Both. Kennels when they're on duty, but many live with their handlers and stay with them until they die, even when they're retired from police work.

I feel like money that could be directed at a charity is being thrown at what may be a puppy factory in some cases, as they make better pictures than rescues.

But they're two separate things 🤷🏻‍♀️

It sounds like your objection is more that they're breeding French Bulldogs than the actual yoga itself.

Frenchies are an abomination health wise but I genuinely can't see an issue with puppies being socialised like this before they're re-homed properly. So many puppies aren't adequately socialised and they end up with lifelong issues as a result.