To think by now non-commercial platforms for buying and selling goods and keeping in touch should have been developed?

[unsureatthispoint]

Inspired by a few current threads

I'm not a big user of social media (as in FB or IG), just mainly to be reminded about events I may want to attend or buy second-hand items occassionally

But I've noticed for instance the frustration with IG about how they now push posts by users you don't follow - making the platform annoying and time wasting (plus the known change to non-cronological algorithms)

Other tools started as 'friendly' buy/sell virtual spaces but quickly have gone all dictatorial, blocking accounts for no reason or deleting someone's good ratings if not enough sales are made regularly (hence being heavily geared to big businesses that can drive commissions whilst small businesses are punished)

And don't get me started with the latests trend to require uploads of IDs and biometrics to global sites with users having no control whatsoever where such sensitive data is going!

Aren't IT people familiar with the technology already? Couldn't we develop non-commercial platforms that would enable all this genuine, much needed, community activity without all the aggravation and grief? No ads, no moderation, no commissions, no frills, run by volunteers?

Forums like MN and the big players would continue to exist, and are a different 'beast' IMO

The novelty of the early days has pretty much warn off already, right? Isn't it time we went back to basics?

Why would I donate money to a website running costs rather than say, to a charity that helps homeless people or disaster relief or clean water, etc

Are you the charity police? Anyone can (and does) donate to whatever or whoever they want. I'm sure you know that

Also, it odd that you think that someone thinking about a current issue and how it could be done better cannot be genuine. Do you doubt the charities you support in the same way?

OP you need to use Mastodon. You get a reverse anti-chronological feed, no ads, no random "you might like this" posts. But you need other people to use it as well of course.

OopsAnotherOne

It's true that legal costs would be massive. Also the hacking attacks could be an issue as many would be trying to bring it down, I'm sure

Though if it were truly aimed for smaller 'fish', more communal activities, perhaps it would be left alone?

Yes, I'm having a look now. It seems interesting

I'm not ignorant or naive. Just pondering and doing a bit of pie-in-the-sky thinking about how things could be better.

It's funny how such a simple act can make people so furious

While we are at it

Why should I pay for food ?
Would t it be good if that was all not commercial ?

Though if it were truly aimed for smaller 'fish', more communal activities, perhaps it would be left alone?
I'd the infrastructure has vulnerabilities, a lot of times its automated tools being run looking for weaknesses, so it being community based wouldn't mean its left alone, its true its less likely to be actively targeted like the big bragging rights ones.

I created an account when Musk took over Twitter. I still use Twitter as some people haven't moved over, but a lot of people in my sector now use Mastodon so there are enough of them to make it worthwhile.

Instagram and Facebook are maddening with all their pointless and unrelated "you may like" posts. Why on earth would I be interested in Ladbible Australia (as a woman in the UK?) for example? And once you look at one cute video of a guinea pig they serve you millions of them.

"IT people" don't develop a robust website that can host thousands of users in five minutes. It costs money, and they are busy getting paid for their skills...

@midgemadgemodge it does seem as if an awful lot of people have emerged from furlough with the idea that paying for stuff is a bit old fashioned...

We had Usenet, but people preferred the glossy, centralised, commercial options. Like a big shopping mall opening up — very attractive compared to the city centre because it's warm and shiny and there are carefully-selected shops and a cinema and a food court and nice clean toilets and lots of benches and a big free car park and security people and no smoking indoors. But your independents and discount shops and market traders can't sell there, you're entirely at the psychological mercy of the mall owners and how they choose to manipulate the environment to influence your behaviour, and if you set up a stall and try to speak about politics/Jesus/whatever you'll be moved on. Private spaces might be nicer in some ways, but you lose the freedom. And if enough people prefer the mall, nobody will use the public space of the city centre any more, with its pricey parking and slight sense of grubby chaos, and it won't be worth going.

Buying and selling IS commerce.

And you can stay in touch by writing a letter, emailing, texting or picking up that nasty, hard telephone and actually ringing someone.

Buying and selling IS commerce

True BUT, there's a difference between the local market charging £100 for setting up your stand on a Sunday and they demanding you give up 20% or your takings. Small operations have absolutely no clout on these platforms

Also, selling a second-hand pair of trainers is arguably not a commercial activity

Someone was complaining the other day their account was blocked due to presumably someone reporting that the items were fake (they weren't). The user could not get through to a person to argue their case, being left out of the system for good

I'm shocked that some of you find all of this acceptable TBH, and anyone questioning this 'must not be genuine'

You're being very naive on the costs of running a website. Volunteers aren't realiable - and why should someone do a £75k job for nothing? Do you not think people in their 50's (I am guessing you are very young if you think people in their 50's are very old with nothing else to do!) are still working?

Hosting is expensive. A large, social media site, even if really basic, you're talking hundreds of thousands a year. You will need A LOT of insurance as you will be sued. You need tech support 24/7 for problems, when it goes down etc. You will need in country, and off continent live back ups. And this is just the start...

Ok, let's establish that it wouldn't be feasible to make it completely free

How about a non-for profit cooperative-style structure (some volunteers, donations plus a small £5 monthly fee)?

That would give small businesses the possibility to sell on a platform with no commission plus individual users the social/community aspect, communicating only with other whom they have actively chosen to follow

No spam, no silly 'suggested contacts', no dodgy 'upload your passport and biometrics', no extortionate commission fees

Do you think people would not pay for such a platform? Plus, it would all be on the same site

I've seen many influencers who have gone down the route of forming 'membership groups', charging e.g. £5 through 'Buy me a coffee' for instance. And apparently many actually subscribe. So £5 may not be much for the convenience of being left alone and sellers being able to sell

I also feel as if we're at some sort of tipping point but I don't know what we're tipping into!

Unmoderated - sounds like just the sort of place you'd find on the dark web. Buyers, sellers and unmoderated content galore. Never mind the illegal content, hey.

Basically OP it'd descend into all sorts being bought/sold if there was no moderation. This is just what people do when given a complete free rein - Facebook et al are bad enough and that's with an army of moderators!

Basically, anything like this as you've suggested would soon have millions in operating costs to keep it running and keep it safe. You can't just have volunteer engineers doing bits here and there, that would be chaos and the platform would be unusable in no time at all.

You're not unreasonable for wanting something like this but are unreasonable for thinking it's remotely possible without a revenue stream from ads etc.

Buying and selling - the closest I can think of at any sort of scale is gumtree. Social media - it simply wouldn't work due to Costs.

That doesn’t answer my question

That doesn’t answer my question

I think you asked how do you know if others are genuine?

It's quite simple. You come into contact with an organisation IRL(a country fair organiser) or on the web (e.g. the Association of Estate Agents), they provide you with something akin to an IG account and you start following them and their posts. You would know they are genuine. You wouldn't be spammed with 'suggested contacts' or other dodgy users, so no danger there.

For small sellers, you do something similar to FB and pay with cash on collection. No need for biometrics or other kind of risky ID process

Who’s going to do all that work for free? Ads pay for everything.

So why don't you just start a non-profit and figure out how to employ people who are IT gurus and still offer your product free of charge to all comers?

Excellent analogy. This is why your idea won’t work, OP (& once again, that’s capitalism for you!)