Is universally still worth it ?

[Timeforanap02]

Hi
more of a curiosity post than anything else.
we ga had my brother and his son around yesterday who is currently 16.

we were discussing his plans and whether he would be looking at going to university. He said no as my brother is very against him going and that going straight in to full time employment can have just as much benefit.
it got me thinking about our own situations, our income is not so different.
He is a manager of a store with no formal qualifications but worked his way up from shop assistant.
I went to university and had further training to work in a specific field with in the MET police.
Is he correct that this is the norm and actually despite me having more student debt / time studying etc we have both landed really financially the same.
I can see where he is coming from on giving this advice but still can’t help but think it will limit his options ?

Oh I’m sorry for some reason auto correct kicked in, it was obviously meant to say university!!!

It really depends what he wants to do - a lot of places are also offering degree level apprenticeships these days which could be the best of both worlds?

It’s not as simple as that is it. My daughter wants to be a teacher so has to go to University, medics, lawyers, Architects etc need a degree.

Doesn’t it depend on their career plans.

On average, university graduates earn more than non graduates (although of course this isn't always true for individuals, as proved by you and your brother) - see link below. Some degree courses / universities will add more value than others.

www.statista.com/statistics/1191970/annual-salary-of-graduates-in-england/

This is where I think they are limiting his choices. The plan seems to be to follow my brother in going straight in to shop work and hope he progresses the same way, rather than discussing other Careers that he might enjoy better.

Depends what he wants to do as a career. As others have said there are other alternatives. He could also get a job for a few years then go to Uni as an older student if he decides he needs a degree (and isn't on a degree apprenticeship).

It depends.

Some professions, you need a degree and the only route is to go to university full time from 18.

Sometimes you can start degree apprenticeships which combine work and study. These can be good as your employer will pay your fees and your salary, so will be ahead of those who did the traditional route in the first few years of your career at least.

University is not right for everyone and many people can earn a good living without a degree, especially if they learn a trade and/or start a successful business.

However, what your nephew does is his decision, depending on his aspirations and aptitude. After all, if he wants to go to university full time, it is him that will need to put the work in, benefit from any increased salary, and pay back his student loans.

The crucial sentence in your OP is

He said no as my brother is very against him going

Perhaps if your brother had gone to university he might have learnt about free will and self determination? It’s an absolute crying shame that your nephew’s choice comes down to ‘What dad says’.

I think it very much depends if it is a career that has to have a degree then there’s no other option. But for other jobs it can be better to get the experience of working your way up and doing relevant qualifications along the way.

I am a nurse so had to go to university, my DH is an engineer on double my salary, he didn’t pass GCSE’s or go to university.

Your DN needs to have a say in what he wants to do though and how he wants to get there.

It sounds like your brother is far too involved in influencing his son’s choice. By ruling our university he will severely limit his choices later on. And you need to consider more than just salary - will he be fulfilled working in a shop? There may be a far more interesting or fulfilling job out there for him.

I’m not sure that my DS year 11 will go to university. Certainly not ruled it out and it will be for him to decide but his predicted GCSE grades are below 4 and he needs extra time, scribe etc. He wants to work in computers so may need to look at different routes.

Many of us had the luxury of growing up knowing we could work anywhere in Europe if we wanted to which is no longer the case. Many countries worldwide require a degree or many years relevant work experience in order to get a work visa. A degree opens doors both in the UK and abroad.

He said no as my brother is very against him going

URGH I can't stand parents like this who see their role not to guide, advise and encourage, but to make decisions and state very strong opinions. Your brother has had his chance or going to Uni or not going to Uni, it is not his "place" to dictate what his son does.

I have a DD who is currently applying for places, although most of her friends' parents are encouraging, she has lots of tales about Kate's mum who "won't let her" apply for places outside her home city, or Jo's dad who "insists she applies for law".

Let me guess. Your brother is one of those massive chip on his shoulder, "university of life" wankers.

Answer is, it depends.

If he is interested in a profession like Architect or medicine then he has no choice.

If he wants a degree with a wide variety of career choices then STEM subjects are the best choice and value, particularly ones that contain a significant maths component (physics, electrical engineering, civil engineering, chemistry, maths, computer science etc). With a degree like this you can go on to working in lots of different technical areas, IT, engineering, R&D, accountancy, law, because getting the degree "proves" you can handle the maths.

If he is not up to doing STEM (a lot of people struggle with the maths) then I would say probably better not to go to university and concentrate on something vocational. Trades (heating engineer, builder, electrician, plumber) are all in short supply at the moment and are well paid, but many require some level of maths.

I would think very hard about doing humanities, languages, social science etc.

I would also strive very hard to get to the university with the best reputation possible. Because it won't cost that much more than one of the lesser ones, and degrees from good institutions are valued much more highly by employers despite what a lot of people will tell you.

He said no as my brother is very against him going

Given that parents are expected to finance their adult children through university, I can see why someone would be opposed to university as a concept when they've done perfectly fine without attending.

There's also the question of prospective career paths. I'd do anything to support my child if they had the aptitude and desire for a profession that requires a degree as a mandatory basic. I'm not so inclined to support either of them for a learning jolly that will cost thousands just for the "experience"

For a direct comparison. Everyone I work with has a degree, none related to the field we work in. I don't. I'm one of the higher earners on my team and my career path is just as open as theirs if we stay in our field. I do think university is a waste of time and money outside specific professions.