To think the HMRC self assessment website is one of the worst designed websites ever?

[bluebeach]

It just seems like a mess. I’ve filed my return, now going back a few days later to pay and it says I owe one amount, then on another page I owe a slightly different amount that’s apparently late (despite me being up to date with payments), but overall I owe another amount, which isn’t the sum of the other two amounts. I want to see a proper breakdown and see what I need to pay now but it’s all such a maze and half the time the website is down. I’m more than happy to pay what I owe but every year I get the same frustration over a completely rubbish system. Is it just me?

At the end mine said they owe me a rebate then on the front page it says I owe them a completely different amount. It's infuriating. The forms are so logical and easy to fill out I don't understand why the next step has to be so difficult!

I think its because spme bits of the site can access the payments database and others can't.

So for example when it does your tax calculation, it cannot access the payments database, so does not know that you have made payments on account.

So it asks for the full payment of the previous year (neglecting any payments on account) as well as the first payment on account for the current tax year !

This is why people end up paying too much.

Go to "Current Position" to see what you have to pay and when you need to pay it. As @DogInATent says, this might not update until a couple of days after you have submitted your return. But it does give a clear payment schedule of what you have to pay, what it's for and when you need to pay it.

At the end of the form it needs to clearly state, 'Now go and have a nice cup of tea and come back in 48 hours' or some such.

Oh and I just got logged out of my form while inputting figures. I thought I'd twat about on MN for a bit to bolster my courage to go back in.

They change their amount about the on account amount though - eg they tell you don't need to pay it because you pay PAYE and only earn a bit via freelance work and then change their mind.

I am pretty switched on - it's not easy, it's a badly thought out site, especially if you have PAYE and self-employed income.

I've given up. I pay a nice man £180 a year to suffer on my behalf. I'd probably pay him triple that if he asked me. Just to save myself.

The Guernsey one was tears/anger-inducing. Not just the UK!

YANBU but just be grateful you're only doing self assessment income tax.

If you think SA is a nightmare, try using it as a business for VAT, PAYE, etc - it's virtually unusable, especially for employers PAYE where it's nigh on impossible to see an actual "statement" of what's due and what you've paid, especially with numerous unexplained and opaque "transfers" of money between PAYE months.

HMRC really isn't fit for purpose and hasn't been ever since Brown merged the various tax departments and then closed down all the local tax offices.

I can imagine. I suppose for VAT and the like they really do expect you to use an accountant.

I hope that I won't get caught by this MTD malarkey, I only earn a small amount of freelance income so having a Xero account and submitting that way really isn't worth it for me.

I remember the days when you could 'pop in' to your local tax office and actually talk to somebody sensible (and pleasant, usually).

I agree. The UI is shite, whichever company designed it needs to be sacked. Also finding where the relevant SA302 and corresponding tax calculations always seems too convoluted!

And the near daily emails throughout January are relentless! 🙄

And the 42 character limit for description of business is a pain in the ass.

chiming in to completely agree! I pay my tax monthly to try to stay on top of an estimate of what anticipate will be the yearly amount. As such I have always usually paid the amount in advance. But trying to adjust the figure I owe to calculate what I really owe is completely confusing, as it seems to forget this.

I just want to know what my current tax owing position is based on my payments to date and an estimate for this tax year e.g. tax position as of today's estimated earnings, up to date! But I find it baffling.

I don’t find the personal section too bad, although I agree it’s not obvious, but then I have pretty straightforward affairs with no poa and worked in personal tax so that probably helps. Definitely give it a week to update after you do anything. Which is ridiculous. You should be able to do your tax return and just pay what you owe immediately if you want to, instead of having to go through the whole arduous signing in process again.

But Omg whoever mentioned the employers PAYE. That is a true nightmare! I do the payroll for DH business and my parents business (both only 2 employees) and I have no idea how it spits out the numbers it does! I’ve no idea why the months never seem to line up, but it’s all very unclear.

Yes, it is absolutely crap, and has been for years. I'm so glad I am no longer self-employed and don't have to do it any more.

DH still does though, and it took him four attempts before he could get the payment to go through. He will no doubt get either a final demand soon, or a letter saying he's overpaid and here's a refund.

The only other website I know of that is similarly dreadful to negotiate is the Royal Horticultural Society's one.

You obv haven't shopped online with Boots. Absolute car crash of a website.

I'm always confused because I pay them monthly £200 and then they say they've received x but upfront payments are still y . I'm sure if i stopped my business tomorrow they would owe me about £1k (but I'd struggle to work it out!) Really wish I didn't have to pay upfront and just pay what I actually owe.

I pay a nice man £240 a year to submit my forms but you still have to pay HMRC. And then I pay it and they keep sending me texts and emails reminding me to pay it even though I have.

Yep! It’s still not clear what I owe so I paid the larger amount and hoped for best. I also got a tax bill from PAYE incorrectly applied 4(!) years ago but that’s not included on the self assessment system so I have to do a bank transfer into the ether for that one and hope for the best it’s not a scam..

I've tried. Many times. But never managed it. It's like time travelling back to dial up in 1995.

Yes it’s shit. That is all.

Oh yes!

I had a slightly different issue, in that I don't need to complete a SA form any more (and I don't have any tax to pay) - as advised by my IFA but also by the HMRC online questionnaire too.

Once you complete that questionnaire, you'd think that the results of that would automatically say you don't have to submit the form - but no! You have to go through another process telling HMRC that you don't need to submit a form - which can take up to 15 days for them to process.

I submitted mine on 3 January, and by yesterday still hadn't had a reply. Went online, on to my personal account, to find that the process had been completed by them (but they hadn't told me), but that they would write to me with the outcome, and to expect that within the next 14 days! (Which would obviously take me past the 31 Jan deadline.

Girded my loins and called them this afternoon - after 50 minutes on hold, I tweeted about it. Lo and behold, my call was answered 4-5 minutes later. A chat with a (very nice) adviser, that probably took less than a minute, confirmed that I don't have to submit a form.

Why is it so complicated?

2 years ago I submitted my self assessment return online in October and immediately got a confirmation reference.
Hmrc then continued to tell me to fill in my SA.
I rang several times, they advised ne to submit a paper copy and then said I would be fined for a late return!
Eventually 3 letters and six phone calls later, in the February and after being threatened with all sorts of fines I spoke to a woman who knew what she was talking about. She sorted everything in 20 minutes.

My DH says the same.
It’s sounds utterly deranged especially under the government that wants to suppor bussiness .

Mine also says I owe a small-ish amount for last year that's apparently overdue but I paid everything they asked for last year 🙃

Then there's the larger amount due by 31st Jan and I can't work out if the above is included in that so I've just paid and hoped for the best. Paid by bank transfer yesterday and it hasn't updated on the HMRC website yet though...

I have a question one of you can possibly help with

I have a balancing payment of £158 to pay for 21/22 (by end January)

I avoided paying ANYTHING on account last May as I knew I was stopping self employment and going PAYE - which I did in May

So I don't owe them the £3500 - how do I get them to realise that

I thought starting a job with PAYE would trigger this but apparently not...