To think the Northern towns deserve "levelling up"

[EricBartholomew]

It's been a good news day in that the levelling up fund has now been distributed and announced. Today on the radio I've heard much disappointment from those who weren't afforded funding (in Leeds and certain areas in Liverpool, other cities).

AIBU to be pleased that the biggest lump of cash is going to somewhere like Morecambe and not a city or a town of the fringes of a city? They already benefit from the wealth there and the investment that comes with it.

There has been a feeling of being "left to rot" in some of these towns for so long that we have nothing but our communities pulling together. I'm so pleased that there is hope (and funding) today for the beautiful Morecambe Bay and other towns that have got levelling up funding. It's well deserved.

Oh god, Plymouth 😱 I was there the other day, depressed doesnt even cover it. It was levelled during WW2 and basically never recovered 😢

Also bits of Southampton, many towns in mid Somerset, Penzance, Torquay, Newquay, Swindon… I could go on… you’d laugh at the concept of Southern Privilege if you actually visited them.

we should be offering tax breaks to large companies to go to these places, rather than another tech company setting up a headquarters in kings cross.

I agree. I really think that somewhere like Hull is prime to become a new and modern manufacturing hub. It's a great location in the UK to reach the rest of the country, it has a large amount of brownfield sites and moving goods onto Europe/ the rest of the world would be feasible too.

If you could append university courses/ apprenticeships that fed directly into that new economy, favourable taxes or rates for businesses located there and housing suitable for a variety of local workers you could stimulate a reinvigoration of the local (maybe regional) economy. It's what we deserve.

I thought that was an idea with investment zones but not sure if they’re going ahead still.

I agree re being attractive although tax breaks for companies can be a hard sell politically.

@EricBartholomew - my point in lumping all Northern Cities as the same. Harrogate is very different from say Blackpool.

I'm not lumping them as the same. Maybe I have worded it clumsily but my OP was after hearing a radio show where people from Leeds and Liverpool were calling in disgruntled at not having the levelling up funding allocated to their cities.

I was saying AIBU to think the northern towns that got a share of the money deserved it, rather than it going to the northern cities (like it usually does).

Most of the SE / south coastal towns are shitholes. Margate (that's been being gentrified for years, still has massive issues), Ramsgate, Weymouth, Brighton all big problems / poor schooling, it's not limited to the North.

The new flats they have built in the cheaper end of town are being advertised at £850pcm for a 2 bed. It's unfortunately already happening

Well, I literally called out public transport spending in my first post (though I can see how you may have interpreted what I said differently.)

Anyway, public spending and public investment are not the same thing. I would argue that public investment is more akin to capital spending which, on your figures, still sees London above the rest of England, Wales and NI.

And of course, the public infrastructure investment in London leverages vast private investment too. A £18bn project like Crossrail unlocks billions more, enlarging the gap between London and Everywhere Else.

Did the good people of Leeds and Liverpool celebrate getting some £80m in the first round? Did those in the South kick up a big fuss then? I haven't totted up the first round, but it seems to have gone mostly to the North and to Scotland, NI and Wales. Very little to London.

Once again the media and political parties seek to pit one region against another. Let's not allow them to manipulate us.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/levelling-up-fund-first-round-successful-bidders

In the second round Leeds got 40m out of a requested £120m, one bid out of seven, but for bus improvements, which I assume will benefit the highest number of users. Seems fair.

I'm not sure I completely agree with your definition of investment - I think there is a huge overlap of what is included in the 'spending' category which actually lays the foundation for a future service. If the spending element was reduced or done away with, the actual capital cost to reinstate would be higher. That's why I don't think you can just bifurcate the two.

I don't think it particularly matters for what either of us are saying, though. I would probably suggest that there's probably a bit of a false equivalence in something like public transport spending though. The £18bn spent on Crossrail has a much bigger real-world impact than a similar £18bn rail project would have in Yorkshire, not only for the number of people who benefit (which is much higher and includes many more multitudes of people outside of London), but also because Yorkshire doesn't need an Elizabeth line. To unlock public spending in Yorkshire could probably be done with less money to get the same result.

Levelling up seems to be a fancy project in the arts. That encourages gentrification but doesn't solve underlying structural problems.

It never seems to be the things the north needs - better public transport, proper investment in industries which produce things rather than services - practical jobs that offer the prospect of more than minimum wage for people who haven't got a university education, better education opportunities and better housing which isn't in the hands of southerner out to make a killing for their retirement at the expense of others financial security.

Ironically the best thing in terms of levelling up seems to be the one idea Johnson couldn't steal from Andy Burnham and claim as his own (and then fail to follow through with even though he was the one with the ability to do so unlike Burnham). Cheap mass public transport throughout greater Manchester.

"The £18bn spent on Crossrail has a much bigger real-world impact than a similar £18bn rail project would have in Yorkshire, not only for the number of people who benefit (which is much higher and includes many more multitudes of people outside of London), but also because Yorkshire doesn't need an Elizabeth line. To unlock public spending in Yorkshire could probably be done with less money to get the same result."

Suppose it depends what your priorities are. Could at least give the people of Bradford half a chance by putting them on a proper rail network instead of leaving them to die early in the polluted sinkhole they currently live in.

Cardiff cross rail project has been awarded £50m as has Cornwall metro so it’s not all fancy arts schemes for the middle classes

I'm sure deprived communities across Wales will be delighted to hear that more money is going to be spent in Cardiff.

So, basically this thread is: ‘whatever and wherever the money is being spent, it should have used for something else, somewhere else.’

Thank you ladies that pointed out we have our own crappy areas/places south of Birmingham too. People down south are often accused of not knowing what it's like north of watford but I think the opposite is also true - many people up north seem to be of the mindset that 'down south' is London. It simply isn't- London is it's own special case with vast amounts of wealth and deprivation too . There are vast amounts of areas down south with people still on pretty average wages, but often significantly higher housing costs too - it's not all streets paved with gold

Not for me. It's more "austerity economics doesn't work and can't be counteracted by tiny handouts to a few, probably politically influenced, areas."

www.newstatesman.com/quickfire/2022/05/we-dont-hate-london-we-just-want-equality

The benefit the South has compared with the North is accessibility to London. Same applies to poor London boroughs. We all know there is poverty in Hackney and Tower Hamlets etc but people there have easy access to well paid jobs and well funded arts etc. That’s where the true inequality lies.

Have you tried commuting from Barnstaple to London by any chance?

I think it’s actually further away from London than Sheffield is 😂

My mum has just been on the phone saying that - that whatever is done, people will moan. She thinks an Eden Project in Morecambe is a great idea, has visited in the last ten years or so, thinks it will give a new lease of life.

I'm happy to just listen as I am not familiar with any of the areas. I can't help feeling there would be fewer complaints if basic stuff was taken care of more e.g. transport.