Page 4 | To wonder why is Mumsnet so anti-car?

underneaththeash · 14/01/2023 10:16

echt · 14/01/2023 08:58

I'd love to see the evidence of one thread a week demonising cars. n
Also, there is no "MN" view, only posters saying what they think.

I agree.

In fact, I honestly can't believe how many people can't/don't drive. (and then oddly have a unsolvable issue which wouldn't be one if they could.)

greenacrylicpaint · 14/01/2023 10:19

whataboutsecondbreakfast · 14/01/2023 10:07

Obesity kills people, but cars cause obesity. The Netherlands save thousands of lives each year by getting people onto bikes and making exercise a normal part of the day

This is way, way too simplistic.

For starters, cars don't cause obesity - they may contribute to it, but owning a car doesn't suddenly turn you obese.

The infrastructure and geography of the Netherlands is drastically different to the UK. It's flat, for starters, making cycling much much easier - it's also set up to be bike friendly. I can't cycle on roads anywhere from my town without going on narrow NSL roads with no cycle path or pavement, or without going up (or down) a ridiculously steep hill.

It might be fine for super fit adults to be cycle on, but it's far far too dangerous for children. The roads are just not safe.

You just can't compare the two in any meaningful way.

the netherlands is bike friendly because there is political will - and cost analysis. it is cheaper overall to build and maintain a cycle network than not to.
much of the netherlands is rural btw and only the coastal regions are mostly flat.

look up Utrecht city transformation. Utrecht is a city comparable to Manchester.

RampantIvy · 14/01/2023 10:19

The Netherlands save thousands of lives each year by getting people onto bikes and making exercise a normal part of the day.

The Netherlands has a much better infrastructure for cyclists, and it is much flatter than many parts of the UK. It is particularly hilly where I live, so you only see really keen cyclists out for a bike ride on the roads.

When I lived and worked in London I had no need to learn to drive. If I had had a car it would have been used for maybe half an hour a week.

@bakewellbride please do tackle your driving confidence. You never know what will change.

DH had a silent stroke and it affected his memory and response time, so now he will only drive on familiar roads, but would rather not drive at all. When we visit DD I make him drive to the services just outside the city where DD lives, then I take over and do the fiddly city bits. He finds using a satnav difficult because his thinking and response time is too slow.

DD went to university a two hour drive away. She was in self catered halls, and there was no way that she could have got everything she needed to her halls by train. I know there is the option to buy bedding and kitchen stuff once there, but how to you then get it home at the end of the year?

And lastly, my workplace moved to somewhere that is way too time consuming and complicated to get to by public transport. It is only 24 miles and takes half an hour by car (2 motorways). Public transport would involve two trains and a bus and would take two hours on a good non-strike day.

I know of too many women whose husbands/partners did all the driving then when the partner became ill or died they became rather isolated.

AlwaysGinPlease · 14/01/2023 10:21

I can't say I've noticed to be honest. Like @underneaththeash I am quite shocked by the amount of people that don't drive. I bloody love my car and I would hate not to be able to drive.

Whewillmylifebegin · 14/01/2023 10:21

QuertyGirl · 14/01/2023 10:16

You don't need to be superfit to cycle up a hill!

Bikes have gears and some are electric.

I'm a short, dumpy middle aged woman and I cycle up hills everyday. Against the wind on the school run this week.

The barriers to doing that are entirely mental for all but those with some health problems or disabilities.

(Cue 25 people shouting at me that they can't do it because they've got a health problem or a disability...)

Well yes, as it happens my child does have a disability. As I predicted earlier, the sneering masses only acknowledge the wheelchair bound face of disability.

But even if I didn't have that to contend with, how would you propose people transport around multiple children safely to school on time and get to work and back in time to pick them up?

Again, yet another person who is lucky enough to have only responsibility for yourself (however dumpy you may be) and live somewhere where you have the freedom to cycle or walk. Bully for you.
Still, if you're still dumpy it doesn't really support the argument that cars cause obesity. I have a healthy BMI and a car. Go figure.

QuertyGirl · 14/01/2023 10:24

@Whewillmylifebegin

I'm not the one sneering here

I'm a disabled working mother as well btw (you missed the school run bit).

Love the fact that you went straight for the personal insult- one down and 24 to go!

Throwncrumbs · 14/01/2023 10:25

Mumsnet is really anti home owners too! According to Mumsnet you should have a rented council house( as all private landlords are scum) and you should be on UC, because ‘they are entitled to it’ and MOST people on UC work anyway, according to them, god knows who they think pays for it, cos taking there crap wages tax to give it back as UC isn’t right ! So if you work full time, in a career you have built up, buy a house and pay mega tax you are seen as unworthy of commenting on Mumsnet let alone starting a thread!!

Sparklingbrook · 14/01/2023 10:27

What does ‘Mumsnet’ unanimously like though? Apart from David Attenborough? 🤔

There are definitely no go ‘bingo ‘ topics where you can see the answers before they appear!

Whewillmylifebegin · 14/01/2023 10:27

QuertyGirl · 14/01/2023 10:24

@Whewillmylifebegin

I'm not the one sneering here

I'm a disabled working mother as well btw (you missed the school run bit).

Love the fact that you went straight for the personal insult- one down and 24 to go!

It's not a personal insult when you used that word to describe yourself. That's why "dumpy" was in quite marks. Notice I said I had a healthy BMI rather than a more descriptive term.

Again, bully for you if you found something that works for you, but you need to acknowledge it's not possible for everybody.

greenacrylicpaint · 14/01/2023 10:29

But even if I didn't have that to contend with, how would you propose people transport around multiple children safely to school on time and get to work and back in time to pick them up?

in the netherlands children from about 7 years old take themselves to and from school. often on bike.
younger children are often taken by parents by bike on a pannier seat. or a taxi if it's not possible for them to take them due to shifts for example.

QuertyGirl · 14/01/2023 10:30

@Whewillmylifebegin

Stop back peddling, bikes don't work that way and you'll do yourself an injury.

I acknowledged that it isn't possible for some, yet you still felt the need to pick a fight and make it personal.

Whewillmylifebegin · 14/01/2023 10:36

greenacrylicpaint · 14/01/2023 10:29

But even if I didn't have that to contend with, how would you propose people transport around multiple children safely to school on time and get to work and back in time to pick them up?

in the netherlands children from about 7 years old take themselves to and from school. often on bike.
younger children are often taken by parents by bike on a pannier seat. or a taxi if it's not possible for them to take them due to shifts for example.

Yes and everyone knows kids pop out of the womb aged seven.

A good solution I think is for those of you who can't see nuance to move to the Netherlands.

Susanthehappytrottingelf · 14/01/2023 10:39

There are plenty of bikes that allow you to transport children - including babies. Many electric to help with hills.

It might not be your preferred way to travel but don't pretend it doesn't exist.

Whewillmylifebegin · 14/01/2023 10:39

QuertyGirl · 14/01/2023 10:30

@Whewillmylifebegin

Stop back peddling, bikes don't work that way and you'll do yourself an injury.

I acknowledged that it isn't possible for some, yet you still felt the need to pick a fight and make it personal.

I'm not back peddling. Maybe you need to make yourself a bit more clear and present your arguments clearly, instead of focusing on being right.

All the arguments you lot come up with just so happen to involve a particular set of geography, circumstance, health and wealth that I imagine just so happens to align with your experience of the world. You are not converting anyone with those arguments, it makes you sound self centered and short sighted.

Still, I guess an improvement on Greta style scowling.

Whewillmylifebegin · 14/01/2023 10:40

Susanthehappytrottingelf · 14/01/2023 10:39

There are plenty of bikes that allow you to transport children - including babies. Many electric to help with hills.

It might not be your preferred way to travel but don't pretend it doesn't exist.

How many children? On motorways? Dual carriageway? That's safe is it and not remotely irresponsible parenting.

Again, written by someone with a short commute and circumstances that allow you to look down on others.

whataboutsecondbreakfast · 14/01/2023 10:41

Susanthehappytrottingelf · 14/01/2023 10:39

There are plenty of bikes that allow you to transport children - including babies. Many electric to help with hills.

It might not be your preferred way to travel but don't pretend it doesn't exist.

Again, that only works if you live somewhere with safe cycle routes. Millions of us don't.

Would you really cycle your child for 5-10 miles along an NSL road in the dark with no pavement or dedicated cycle track?

Because for parents around here, that's the alternative if they don't drive or pay hundreds of pounds for the school bus.

Susanthehappytrottingelf · 14/01/2023 10:43

I chose where I lived because I do want to minimise my impact on climate change. Other people's choices to drive everywhere impact on us all.

I hardly think Mumsnet is anti car...

Oblomov22 · 14/01/2023 10:44

Nope. Not seen any such threads demonising cars, and been here donkeys years. Thinks op is paranoid.

whataboutsecondbreakfast · 14/01/2023 10:45

You don't need to be superfit to cycle up a hill! Bikes have gears and some are electric.

Depends on the size of the hill, how many there are on the journey, and whether the road is safe for bikes. There's a big difference between a well-lit roads with cycle tracks and dark, windy, hilly roads with no lighting or pavement.

Electric bikes are also expensive and far less versatile than a car.

I'm a short, dumpy middle aged woman and I cycle up hills everyday. Against the wind on the school run this week. The barriers to doing that are entirely mental for all but those with some health problems or disabilities.

Good for you, but those aren't the only reasons people don't cycle. Lots of people do the the school run then go on to work 30 miles away. Many also carry equipment in their vehicles that can't be transported on the back of bike.

I can't do my job without a vehicle and neither can DH. That's just the reality and it wouldn't change if we lived somewhere with decent bike routes 🤷🏻‍♀️

whataboutsecondbreakfast · 14/01/2023 10:46

Susanthehappytrottingelf · 14/01/2023 10:43

I chose where I lived because I do want to minimise my impact on climate change. Other people's choices to drive everywhere impact on us all.

I hardly think Mumsnet is anti car...

And that's a luxury many people can't afford. Cities and areas with decent public transport are generally much more expensive for this reason.

SavoirFlair · 14/01/2023 10:47

BunchHarman · 14/01/2023 08:28

This place is very weird about cars and driving:

If you can’t drive, or worse, the man you’re contemplating dating doesn’t drive, you and he should be ashamed and learn immediately, it’s a life skill.

However, if you desire any sort of car other than an ugly, boxy, tiny little electric one that costs £60k, you should be ashamed.

That said, everyone is utterly terrified of going over 30mph, driving in the rain, the dark and don’t even contemplate leaving the house if it’s icy, or worse snowing.

However, there’s apparently nothing sexier than a man’s forearms while he does big manly driving.

And finally, don’t you dare try to park anywhere near your own house if you’re too poverty-stricken to have a driveway with space for eight cars, you entitled wench.

this is a brilliant summary of the batshit contradictory views on here

Whewillmylifebegin · 14/01/2023 10:48

Susanthehappytrottingelf · 14/01/2023 10:43

I chose where I lived because I do want to minimise my impact on climate change. Other people's choices to drive everywhere impact on us all.

I hardly think Mumsnet is anti car...

Hope you are vegan, not a dog owner, don't take holidays as well.
You wouldn't want to be a massive hypocrite after all.

Some of us have to choose where we live down to cost. Some of us live rurally because of jobs. Again, if no one can live or access rural areas who is good g to grow your planet saving organic high welfare food? Are you going to good life it in between cycling your kids to school and working?

pissssedofff · 14/01/2023 10:48

whataboutsecondbreakfast · 14/01/2023 10:41

Again, that only works if you live somewhere with safe cycle routes. Millions of us don't.

Would you really cycle your child for 5-10 miles along an NSL road in the dark with no pavement or dedicated cycle track?

Because for parents around here, that's the alternative if they don't drive or pay hundreds of pounds for the school bus.

Show quote history

Yes well you made the case for why cars are a pia or rather their owners are, they stop alternative ways to travel.

TBH the MN view seems to be the hate for cyclists, though thats the societal view too.

Over 2 cyclists are killed by car drivers each week, 5000 very seriously injured - Govt response is to do nothing, too scared of the car lobby.

SavoirFlair · 14/01/2023 10:48

QuertyGirl · 14/01/2023 10:30

@Whewillmylifebegin

Stop back peddling, bikes don't work that way and you'll do yourself an injury.

I acknowledged that it isn't possible for some, yet you still felt the need to pick a fight and make it personal.

What’s back peddling 🫣🤣

is it some sort of reverse sale?

PoachingEggs · 14/01/2023 10:49

Ticketsto · 14/01/2023 07:37

There is at least one thread a week on here demonizing cars! What is with all the hate? I know they cause pollution and can kill people however they’ve revolutionized the way we live! Not all of us are fortunate enough to live somewhere with good public transport.

They can't make their minds up.
One minute they're anti car and the next they're demanding that everyone should drive because apparently it's a life skill which will enable you to rush people to hospital and do the shopping.