Working condensed hours on 80% pay

[Notsure2023]

Recently went back after maternity leave, before I left I agreed flexible working 4 days per week. Agreed my pay would be reduced to 80%.

im in a client facing management position. My clients were changed and I was given more responsibility when I returned to work - I now have our biggest clients (not discussed with me first).

I’ve kept the same job title and I’ve not got a pay increase.

It’s becoming apparent I’m doing the same amount of work across 4 days. No one covers for me on my day off. AIBU to expect full pay?

It's not totally clear if you are doing FT hours over 4 days or not? If your pay has reduced to 80% then your hours should have reduced to 80% of FT too.

80% of 37.5 hours is 30 hours. That is all you should be working per week.

I couldn't find a way to compress my hours enough to keep 100% of them across four days that would work with childcare, and I wouldn't have been allowed to have picking up stuff in the evening as an official part of my contracted hours. I think a lot of people who do this have to fudge it a bit, which would make me feel really uncomfortable. I saw a video on Instagram where the woman was encouraging everyone to do compressed hours and saying how amazing it was for working mums, but she then said that she did hers by 'being available for calls' either on her commute or on the school run - tbh I do think that's a bit of a pisstake, and I can see why it annoys 'regular' FT colleagues.

You should absolutely be getting 100% of the pay if you're going 100% of the hours. I also work in a client facing management role and didn't come back 4 days a week for this very reason, it's so hard to make it work. We have people (all working mums) that work 4 in 5 for 100% pay, could that be an option?

Not RTFT but I think there are two ways of looking at this.

You can either take the view that you are doing five days a week in four, so you may as well have the money and actually work five days.

Or you can say I am doing more hours than I am being paid for, but I do get a day off and I can insist on taking that day off.

I work 3 days spread over 5 and work over my hours. But if I want to turn the computer off at my finish time and do something else I can. So I am happy to take the lower salary. I also work from home and have all the advantages that offers, so the overall package works for me.

Ultimately you need to weigh up what works for you.

For what it's worth, when I worked 4 days, I worked 4 days. But that in the days before WFH, (reliable) remote access etc. If I wasn't in the office, I couldn't be got!

A compromise might be a 9 day fortnight, my boss does that.

If you are only contracted to work 0.8FTE you will be paid accordingly. If you are condensing full time hours into 4 days (for example by working 8-6 Monday to Thursday) you should be paid full time wage.

If the former and you work above and beyond that, that's your problem. That being said, if you are doing that because you simply cannot do what you need to in your contracted hours that's a conversation to be had with your manager.

I thought op meant that she is doing 100% of the work for 80% of the pay. So she works 4 days but has to cram 5 days of work into that time.

That's what happened to me. The employer did not offer condensed hours as an option.

If you are receiving 80% pay then you work 80% of contracted hours.

If you are doing more than this you have to stop. If there are complaints about your availability, ask boss who clients should contact on your day off.

This is a common problem in jobs that don’t have fixed hours - where most people work longer than just 9 to 5. The person doing a four day week often works more hours but still bing paid for only 80%. That has been my experience.

It would help if op came back and confirmed if she's working 4 'normal' 7.5-8 hour days for 80% of full time salary, which I don't see an issue with, or whether she's supposed to be working 4 'normal' days but finds herself working 4 long 9-10 hour days, which adds up to a full working week, but is only being paid for 80%.

If it's the case that she's doing the work volume she used to do in a full week over 4 'normal' days now, again, if she's not having to work any extra hours, I can't see the issue (obviously as long as she's not being overwhelmed and stressed by it.)

In my experience, condensed hours are a piss take. I know a couple of people who do it. They generally just make sure they send a couple of emails at 7.30am to make it look like they're doing something. We all WFH so no one tracks whether they do the extra hours over their 4 days.

My job is four days a week and always has been.

I have great boundaries when it comes to shutting down my laptop on the dot, taking my TOIL etc when I'm flexible, but what is harder to ignore is the fact that basically there is always something big outstanding on my list that will have to be done later or more slowly, because work will simply keep allocating me 90-100% of a week's worth of work, rather than 80%.

It's therefore constantly mildly stressful to have the extra 10-20% work hanging over me, or to have to lower my high standards to cross tasks off.

If you're working less hours then yes expect to be paid less
If you're working more than your hours then protect your time better
If you're saying you do 5 days work in 4 or achieve the same in 4 days than you would have in 5 then youre great in your job how can you prove that? Particularly in a new role. You could try argue they take an Output based approach if you can prove they get the same and that pay should reflect that but its pretty hard to convince employers of this - ultimately why would they pay you more?

Pretty normal for a 4 day week, it’s not really part time, need to drop to 3 days for it to actually be treated as part time in most jobs particularly if office etc. Any stats or performance targets you have should be adjusted to the 80%.

Best option is to raise with your work that you are working same as before so requesting 100% pay (but you will then be committed to the 4 long days), if they say no then it will have been raised and you need to push for 80% workload and for that to be maintained - so result that either you stay as now but get back 100% pay or stay at 80% pay and less work than now

In the Civil Service, we can do 'compressed hours' (5 days' hours worked in 4 days, or occasionally 4 and a half). If you are working more than four-fifths of full-time hours each week, they are ripping you off. Maybe a Tribunal case, if you can't get resolution amicably?

It’s becoming apparent I’m doing the same amount of work across 4 days. No one covers for me on my day off. AIBU to expect full pay?

If it's the same amount of work or, more you should be on the same pay as you were before.

It sounds like your employers either hasn't thought this out, or has used your absence as an opportunity to shit on you. Now that you are anew mother, that is enough for some employers to see you as vulnerable, that you won't be as attractive to other employers, and once they they see you as that, it's a greenlight for them to start overloading you and start taking the piss.

It’s so bloody cheeky isn’t it? In my old job we had a workload model that counted the hours assigned per week to any given responsibility and allocated them as workload points. So, if you were Publicity Officer and they expected you to spend 10 hours per week doing that it would be 10 points. Well, one of my roles before I went on maternity leave was worth 8 points. When I came back, now on 50% hours and pay, they tried to give me exactly the same role…at 4 points! After I kicked up a stink they said fine, they’d make it 7, but only if I took on an extra chunk of responsibility. That extra chunk of responsibility came out of a make colleague’s role, but his workload recognition wasn’t adjusted down at all. Funny that.

Yes you're being mugged off for the extra 20%.

I am on mat leave, going back on condensed hours to work 4 days but on the same money, same job title, with the expectation that I'm working longer days to have that one day off in the week, therefore my output will be the same.

No way would I accept that I should be paid less.

Could you keep a log for a couple of weeks and present your findings to your manager/HR?

Sounds like someone has ballsed up

I do 80% hours over 5 days but I knock off early a couple of days a week to take the DC to activities. I'm civil service so I'm definitely not expected to do more than 80% hours for 80% pay but it only works if I am very flexible and show a lot of willingness. Plus I keep timesheets of my hours. I think working for a private company you could easily find the expectations are higher.

one of my bosses actually thought I was doing compressed hours. I very firmly said no you only pay me for 80% despite work being too full on. Part of the problem is so many jobs seem to expect you to just go over hours or have silly deadlines. Most of the time though I do manage 4 days. I’d never do 3 days again because while I was better at home for my children, it was far too stressful for me trying to cram in a full time job into 3 days.

And OP never returned…..

Maybe she's still working to catch up...

As pps have said, compressed hours to me means working your normal hours over fewer days, so full time over 4 days. For that, I'd expect 100% pay.

If you're doing 4 "normal" days, then yes, you get 80%.

The issue is that there is rarely any adjustment in the work load when you work 4 days even though you're only being paid 80%.

If your hours have reduced YABU but I understand what you’re dating. I did 4 days and soon went back to full time as the workload was the same.

It depends 100% on what hours you're working doesn't it?

I've always done compressed hours even before kids, but always at FT hours (was 37 or 40 depending on where I was).
Do you do FT hours over 4 days, or PT hours over 4 days?

If you do FT hours, of course you are entitled to FT pay, I'm not sure how it's even happened that you're not!