A&E time wasters.

[ConfusedMumma99]

I don’t know if I’m just thinking like this because I’ve not been in a situation. But are people genuinely being ridiculous for the reasons of going to A&E

a friend took her son (20 months) to a&e because he got a temperature of 38.8. By the time the nurse took it at a&e it was normal and she said it was because she’d given him Calpol??????? She then said he was running round the waiting room eating snacks.

am i a cow???? Or why would use a&e for this? I appreciate lots in the news about strep A. But surely you would wait and see if temp came down with Calpol/nurofen? That’s what I’d do with my child.

however I am a first time mum so im worried I should take illness more seriously? Do you really need a hospital visit just for a temperature?

our local A&E had wait times of 14 hours the other day??? Is this a combo of lack of
staff or people going unnecessarily.

I know GP’s are notoriously bad for appointments?

how are people seen in A&E? By time spent or by severity?? It seems scary that if you actually needed a&e that you might not get seen.

@heartbroken22 thank you for your concern. It's all a bit of a daze atm, just one day at time and help out my son as much as possible, he's currently swamped with people but may not be the case in a couple of weeks when everyone returns to work. The fortunate thing is I'm retiring and my last day is 6th January.

Hope you have a wonderful Christmas x

I've just finished a placement at UTC. I'd say about 70% of people seen should not have been there. Endless colds, fit healthy 20 something adults with a sniffle would come in. We had someone who sneezed three days ago and was worried because their shoulder hurt at the time. The tiniest cuts imaginable, stubbed toes, and someone who had facial threading done which had healed beautifully but she didn't like the result.
It's mad.

Children was the one area I know my colleagues never minded seeing for tiny things. Kids can crash fast, they compensate well but can go down all of a sudden so it's always worth getting them looked at in case.

I took my daughter to A&E/urgent care with a temperature the other week. She was diagnosed with scarlet fever and given antibiotics. They said I did the right thing bringing her.
I was advised to bring her there by two family members who are a nurse and a doctor, having failed to get through to 111. Other people might not have relatives who are healthcare professionals but have the same difficulties with 111 right now because it's so busy as we are all getting sick at the same time.

I went to a walk-in centre when I got a tampon stuck at the weekend once and they sent me to A and E because there was nobody who could use a speculum at the practice. I would much rather not have been in A and E on a Sunday morning let me tell you!

i was in A & E last night and half the kids were settled in with blankets and plenty of snacks. Most of them left after being triaged. Not sure what the answer is OP - There’s lots of worried parents

A&E attendances are in fact stable - only up 0.03% since 2019. The current problems in A&E are mainly due to wards being unable to discharge existing patients, and therefore being unable to accept new patients from A&E.

I have been an A&E doctor (and GP) since the 90s. There have always been inappropriate attenders. In the old days, though, you triaged them as Priority 5 (lowest) and they sat in the waiting room until literally every other patient had been seen. Now, thanks to the 4 hour rule, you are not allowed to do that, so you end up having to see someone with an ingrowing toenail before someone with (non life-threatening) abdominal pain, because the toenail has waited nearly 4 hours. So that just reinforces the tendency to come to A&E.

ED Staff always have a weary "Yeah well, that's see..." tone when I've taken myself or a DC saying I suspect a broken bone. The best moment after that was when the staff put the xrays up & said "Oh, look at that! Really is broken. Both bones all the way across." While I'm chugging cocodamol to deal with pain.

3 or 4 in 9 of the trips we made to A&E for suspected broken bone actually found no break (one of those found "trauma"), mind. I wish had been 0 in 6, but the presentation for no-break was usually about the same as when the xray did find a break. 1-2 of the breaks were minor enough to need no treatment, so then we're down to only 4/9 essential trips.

Think it can be hard not to be a 'time waster' in A&E.

What hacks me off lljk is that neither me or the DC have ever attended without a broken bone. A&E staff still treat one with contempt (the Drs are a.bit better than the A&E nurses) DS: 1 greenstick, 1 nasty wrist fracture - needed surgery, 1 fractured ankle, broken nose twice. DD leg - needed surgery, collar bone, pulled elbow. Me: ankle, diagnosed as a sprain despite.XRay - it was broken, self diagnosed sprained ankle because I didn't think I'd be able.to weight bear - it got inflamed and didn't clear up - it was broken, 5th metatarsal, L1 by more than 50%, T12 by more than 40% - misdiagnosed by F2 and radiography - it was broken, distal radius and ulna - needed pins and plates.

I don't believe we have ever been without a confirmed injury. I appreciate we haven't been at risk of loss of.life but the abruptness and often downright rudeness astounds me, notwithstanding the failure to check pain.

So the first paediatrician diagnosed him wrongly but you cite that as an example of how good the Swiss system is?

Someone on another thread has suggest that the OP takes her Son to A&E because his penis is a tiny bit red. I despair, that's why A&E is in its knees.

So he “knew” he had had a stroke but made the decision that he would have to wait the same length of time to be seen as some random person sitting next to him (when presumably he had no idea what was actually wrong with that person) and so decided to go home, which as we all know is the best treatment for an actual stroke. 🙄

There is a pathway for diagnosing and treating strokes. Does he have a CT scanner at home?

Was it the “re-branding”? The very word Casualty denotes “walking wounded” - whereas the E means “can’t wait don’t wanna until Monday”.

@MrsFezziwig no it was more of an example that he was OK when he saw the pediatrician but deteriorated over the 24 hours afterwards and developed an ear infection.
I do think the Swiss system is better because kids have their own pediatrician who they set throughout childhood rather than a GP. You can also easily get same day appointments. And if it were evening or weekend you can go the pediatric emergency department and be seen within an hour.

@MrsFezziwig well I don't agree with his decision to go home, I would have stayed. I don't think anyone who's had a stroke should have to wait for hours in A&E to he seen. I don't think anyone who's had a stroke should have to get a lift to hospital because there aren't any ambulances available.
He's already had 2 TIAs (minor strokes) prior to this one, but can't do much until he gets all his test results backs, which appear to take weeks.

I had something very similar with one of my children and bought home dipsticks to test urine myself and avoid going unless a dipstick showed an infection (usually they were lit up like a Christmas tree and then to a and e we went but still, better to test home first). I remember being in a and e with someone whose child had a urine sample and it wasn’t tested for about 5-6 hours and he didn’t have a UTI and I thought “if they had just dipped on entry he would have been able to just go home”.

anyway, I think people are daft. A GP friend of mine says he is inundated with paranoid parents. It’s generally clear when it’s an a and e situation. Many people ought not to be there; and they ought not to be at the GP either. Yes the system is bad but it’s not helped by people being unable to exercise a bit of common sense/go to the pharmacy etc.

Strike patient often bypass A&E and go straight to hyper acute specialist units. My friend did when he had one.

You don’t know that he would have had to wait hours. For all you know he might have been the next patient to be seen. But because he wasn’t prepared to wait he went home and lost any chance of effective treatment (since stroke treatment ideally should be given within a certain time window).

Typical stroke symptoms are pretty well publicised. Did he communicate the symptoms he had to the receptionist?

You could also tone down the inflammatory language - I presume they asked him to wait (rather than “dumped” him?)

I was an HCP for over thirty years. If I was in his situation and “knew” I’d had a stroke I would get to hospital by the fastest means possible (likely to be private transport) and stay there until the staff had a chance to make a diagnosis and treat me).

And just to reiterate - he didn’t actually know whether he’d had an acute stroke or not (unless he’s medically qualified of course).

I have relatives that live in Canada. They would never dream of taking their child (or themselves) to A&E for half the things people here do. The majority really don't warrant hospital care. Instead over there they have minor accident treatment clinics which are almost like a walk in GP. You go there and wait to be seen. The Dr then tells you you're fine, take calpol etc, can write a prescription or tell you to go to A&E. There you would only go straight to A&E if you broke a bone, we're having a life or death experience, bleeding profusely, etc.

I think people in the U.K. overreact and panic and feel they need to go to A&E because there isn't any other option. It is a huge waste of time for the A&E staff who are run off their feet.

Some of the things I've seen posted on MN where people are either asking if they should go to A&E, being told to go to A&E, etc are honestly baffling. More often than not it's something that a plaster or calpol and a couple of hours rest could fix.

I don't think there are as many 'time wasters' as some may have you believe. People are seen according to the severity of their illness, and A&E waiting times have always been notoriously long, so you have to be pretty keen to see a Dr to wait 24 hours or more (the wait time in my local A&E).

Some of those waiting in A&E will be waiting for a bed to be free on a ward so that they can be admitted.

A lot of A&Es are also now walk-in clinics where people are encouraged to go for minor illnesses.

I wouldn't be so quick to judge people making use of the health service that is there for that very purpose. There will, of course, be some people who visit because they simply can't get a GP appointment...I don't see this as them taking the mickey out of the NHS or being time wasters. Where do you expect them to go for help? Even those with private healthcare usually need to be referred by their GP.

It doesn't help that you can't get an appointment at your GP surgery, and then you ring 111 and can't get an out of hours appointment either. So your options are limited. That said a child with a temp of 38.8 doesn't really need to be seen, unless the temperature has lasted for 5 days (or that's what I've always been told by doctors anyway).

But you've explained yourself that in Canada they have an alternative option to go to. On many areas of the UK, there are no walk-in or minor injury units and those that do exist often open for limited hours. Many patients here have the choice of GP (with no appointments) or A&E.

More walk-in centres would be good.
My town centre had one, but it got closed down and is now just a normal GP surgery.
Now the minors/urgent care are attached to the main hospital which is out of town.
Admittedly, new houses keep being built where I live but health care provision is not being expanded to reflect that.

Our local a&e has something similar. You go, are triaged to the attached 24hr GP or to a&e itself.

A&e itself nurse practitioners triage and can decide on investigations such as x-ray. So instead of waiting for a dr to see you and decide on x-ray/bloods etc, then wait again after for the dr review, you’re sent straight from triage, and it’s already reviewed when you see the dr. Makes things much quicker.

So much ignorant nonsense in one post. Do you have any evidence whatsoever for any of this??