... to think that "bad" sex is common in many relationships

[TheShoeFits]

This thought was triggered by some recent threads I've read, and a situation I found myself in for a time, and a discussion in a reply I made. I think that reading MN has made me aware of lots of things in relationships that were not on my radar; I guess I'd have found out in the long run; I mean the typical read flags thing such as love bombing, ghosting and so on.

For reference, I'm not looking for salacious details of bad sex. A simple vote will do!

YABU: No, I've seldom or never had bad sex in my relationship

YANBU: Yes, I'd agree. We have sex, but much of time it's really not good, and a chore.

The voting split is 50-50, I didn't really know what to expect.

I'm another of those that made a decision a some point with DH to be "good in bed" as another posted put the phrase. It's not meant as a boast, rather it's just being aware of pleasing my DH (and it is reciprocated). Of course, sometimes I'm OK with just lying there and taking it easy. It's great when you are with a compatible partner.

Yanbu yanbu yanbu for me!

A lot of women have little interest in sex

I think this is a pernicious myth that helps keep heterosexual women having bad sex and the cycle continues.

I know when I was first sexually active, I was incredibly underwhelmed, yet boys were literally obsessed. You learn quite quickly (and so many cultural/societal messages reinforce) that sex is something men love and women put up with, but can use in a kind of gatekeeper style to have some lame kind of "power" over men. Hence all the "empowerfulising" shit.

My understanding was that sex was not optional in a relationship. If you didn't want sex (or enough sex) then they wouldn't want you. I did want all the other parts of a relationship, but I wasn't that fussed about sex because it was usually crap, had no idea at that point it could be good. But it's required for a relationship, so OK, whatever. I just assumed that was normal because men love sex and women put up with it.

Hormonal birth control also doesn't help. Lot of young women on hormonal birth control, because it's the most effective, especially the long term/no action required forms. But I only realised in my 30s this kills my libido (already not huge) stone dead, and I'm not the only one - it's a really common side effect.

Then many years having crap/boring/chore type sex and it doesn't make you want to try new things or have more or explore or whatever. In fact usually you dread this because "trying something new" revolves entirely around whatever new kink your bloke has picked up from porn (because "all men watch porn and it's normal"), and porn is invariably shit for women. And sometimes you've fallen into a trap of faking it/expressing pleasure so your man thinks that's just what sex with women is like and doesn't bother to try anything to make you like it more. Because men love sex and women put up with it. And you can't tell him that you've been faking it for ages because to insult a man's sexual prowess is the worst insult ever and would break the entire relationship (yes, all my previous relationships were this fragile!) Nor can you stop faking it because a fake orgasm is a nice easy "Stop now" that doesn't risk causing an argument.

The more women have bad sex the less they enjoy sex. The more men having sex with women who are used to bad sex means they don't think they have to make any effort, or what's the point in making effort, women don't like sex anyway. The cycle repeats again and again and eventually women in long term relationships just give up the pretence and poof, dead bedroom.

I hope it's changing, it doesn't have to be this way. I hope young women don't feel that they have to have sex to be in a relationship, I hope young men are interested and curious and want to know how to please their partner as well as themselves. I'm worried it's going the wrong way and getting worse, though, because of porn being so normalised. My generation was the first where boys expected you to be a porn star, but it's become more and more accessible and more and more extreme.

Things can also go from good to bad and good again. In my case it was good, then I was on medication for a period of time with a side effect that I could not orgasm. That had a huge impact on me, and looking back it made me less interested and somewhat lazy. A medication change and everything was resolved again within a few weeks.

If I don't "finish" then it just feels unresolved or empty for me. I remember reading a post about a woman who NEVER had an orgasm. I felt so sorry for both her and her partner. That must be so so difficult for them both.

YABU. Sex has always been great with dh. Been together 25 years. He's an unselfish, good lover.

Many women have little interest in sex. I stand by this. You go on to say in your comment that birth control kills your libido, which is already not huge. So yes, many women, yourself included, have little interest in sex. If I had no libido, I’d probably be happy with a man who also has little interest in sex. I’d probably hate to be with a man who wanted sex often, so would more likely put up with a poor or none existent sex life. But being a hypersexual woman means this doesn’t apply to me. If I was with a man with no libido or who was over in 5 mins, I’d be resentful and frustrated. From what I read on here, most women would rather have a cup of tea than an orgasm!

From my own experience, (only so I might be alone but I really really doubt it) I might have thought I had little interest in sex in my twenties and thirties.
Turns out it wasn't sex I was disinterested in, it was 'sex with my exhusband' I was disinterested in.
I think me and many other women were so consumed with getting married in our twenties (like we'd 'won' if we did) that we didn't pause and discover our chosen partners were not very good ones.

In general for me, I know what my DH likes, and try to look after him in that respect. I'm happy to do that, because I know it is important for him, making him happy makes me happy.

I do hope he knows how to make you happy too.

I have had many partners, I would actually say 75% of them were crap, I suppose mainly because of age as mostly were when I was 16-21. All very selfish.

My DH is not selfish, very concerned about my enjoyment and the sex is amazing but now sadly libido all but gone for me as post menopausal.

There's no such thing as bad sex. Only bad communication.

I know... I also find this utterly bizarre. I cannot see the point of embarking on a committed relationship with someone if you don't fancy them or want to shag them. There is literally no point in being in a relationship which is totally sexless so why wouldn't you set the bar high from the start?

I agree with the OP's premise that there is quite a lot of bad or mediocre sex in long-term relationships. It's understandable really when you factor in familiarity, workload, exhaustion, children etc. It's quite hard to feel rampantly sexual with someone you've lived with for years.

But there's a big difference between someone you have satisfying, loving if infrequent sex with and someone who literally couldn't give a shit about whether you get any pleasure from the act at all. Desire waxes and wains but someone who doesn't think you deserve pleasure at all will never get better.

I think lots of relationships have slumps or go through periods where either or neither want it but I don't think bad sex is the norm.

It's certainly not been the case in my experience, not overall anyway. The odd glitch sure but it's soon worked through.

I hope young women don't feel that they have to have sex to be in a relationship .......................... that'll put you firmly in the friend zone.

Many women have little interest in sex.

I don't think that's true. I think its socially conditioned.

I think the problem is that for women enjoyment in sex comes with lots of baggage. A lot or women are socialised to believe that sex is something they have to "give" men or something they withhold in order to capture men and get them down the aisle etc. There's also an overlay of morality that tells them they are judged for having it in the "wrong" way (too many partners, too often, too little).

They are also always told that sex can only happen in a committed relationship so quite often if they are in a committed relationship and the sex is bad they will tough it out, thinking that it won't get any better. And being married to a disobliging slob who expects you to do all domestic work and has no interest in anything except work and football doesn't do wonders for most people's sex lives.

It would be much healthier in my view if more women were able to have more no strings sex when young (in a safe and consensual way) in order to give them real perspective on what they actually enjoy.

Yes a lot on vanilla folk out there haha

Depressing as ever then.