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Oxford 'climate lockdowns' and '15-minute city' - can anyone local explain their views on this?

897 replies

unsureatthispoint · 07/12/2022 10:48

This news has been published in several media outlets and being talked about ATM.

Road blocks stopping most motorists from driving through Oxford city centre will divide the city into six "15 minute" neighbourhoods, a county council travel chief has said.

And he insisted the controversial plan would go ahead whether people liked it or not.

Duncan Enright, Oxfordshire County Council's cabinet member for travel and development strategy, explained the authority's traffic filter proposals in an interview in The Sunday Times.

He said the filters would turn Oxford into "a 15-minute city" with local services within a small walking radius.

Mr Enright said: "It is about making sure you have the community centre which has all of those essential needs, the bottle of milk, pharmacy, GP, schools which you need to have a 15-minute neighbourhood."

The aim is to reduce traffic in the city centre and make city living more pleasant, but critics say the plans will negatively affect businesses and the city centre's economy.

Here's the link

www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/23073992.traffic-filters-will-divide-city-six-15-minute-neighbourhoods-agrees-highways-councillor/

Are local people aware of this and what's their take on it?

OP posts:
antelopevalley · 12/12/2022 19:22

Devoutspoken · 12/12/2022 18:06

The narrative that all low paid jobs are only possible by car is a false one

True. But as the public transport is also poor and expensive then you do have problems.

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 19:24

It's also not just low paid workers who'll have issues here. You can be earning over the average and still not be able to afford housing in Oxford, particularly if you were irresponsible enough to be born after about 1980.

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 20:01

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 19:24

It's also not just low paid workers who'll have issues here. You can be earning over the average and still not be able to afford housing in Oxford, particularly if you were irresponsible enough to be born after about 1980.

The UK average salary for a full time employee is about £38,000 a year. If you are a couple both earning that average then I would have thought a house such as this a simple cycle to anywhere in Oxford would be affordable.

www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/77846985#/?channel=RES_BUY

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 20:12

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 20:01

The UK average salary for a full time employee is about £38,000 a year. If you are a couple both earning that average then I would have thought a house such as this a simple cycle to anywhere in Oxford would be affordable.

www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/77846985#/?channel=RES_BUY

Good job it's only dual income full time working couples who ever need housing in Oxford then, eh? Otherwise there might be a problem!

Ultimately though, I don't know how far this is a circle that can be squared. Oxford is a beautiful city but it's also got an economy that can't be supported and staffed purely by the residents. Better public transport is needed, and would improve things, but it might also have got bigger than can actually be sustained even with more buses etc. I don't see more housing happening there, and tbf there are more physical constraints than in most cities, so it's a pressure cooker. Whoever said upthread that it's more of a market town with notions than a city had a point.

terrywynne · 12/12/2022 20:32

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 20:01

The UK average salary for a full time employee is about £38,000 a year. If you are a couple both earning that average then I would have thought a house such as this a simple cycle to anywhere in Oxford would be affordable.

www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/77846985#/?channel=RES_BUY

Ah, yes Rose Hill. One of the most deprived estates in Oxford. Not sure what the 2021 stats will say but back in 2011, 44% of children living on the estate were below the poverty line and it was among the 20% most deprived areas in England. That house would be unaffordable for many who live on the estate. And your couple with there £38,000 each would likely choose to buy further out for a similar price and commute in.

If I recall correctly, a few years back, Oxford was the UKs most unaffordable city (comparing cost of housing against average pay in the region). There is a reason so many people commute from the surrounding area.

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 20:38

terrywynne · 12/12/2022 20:32

Ah, yes Rose Hill. One of the most deprived estates in Oxford. Not sure what the 2021 stats will say but back in 2011, 44% of children living on the estate were below the poverty line and it was among the 20% most deprived areas in England. That house would be unaffordable for many who live on the estate. And your couple with there £38,000 each would likely choose to buy further out for a similar price and commute in.

If I recall correctly, a few years back, Oxford was the UKs most unaffordable city (comparing cost of housing against average pay in the region). There is a reason so many people commute from the surrounding area.

I am glad that we are in agreement that those on an average salary are choosing to live outside Oxford and commute in.

The question then is, should those commuters complain if those who choose to live in Oxford prioritise their own health and safety over the convincence of people living elsewhere?

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 20:43

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 20:12

Good job it's only dual income full time working couples who ever need housing in Oxford then, eh? Otherwise there might be a problem!

Ultimately though, I don't know how far this is a circle that can be squared. Oxford is a beautiful city but it's also got an economy that can't be supported and staffed purely by the residents. Better public transport is needed, and would improve things, but it might also have got bigger than can actually be sustained even with more buses etc. I don't see more housing happening there, and tbf there are more physical constraints than in most cities, so it's a pressure cooker. Whoever said upthread that it's more of a market town with notions than a city had a point.

So you would like me to show you examples of places that a single person earning over the average could afford to live in in Oxford?
Ok.

www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/128610140#/?channel=RES_NEW

Phyllistyne · 12/12/2022 20:47

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

TheyreOnlyNoodlesMichael · 12/12/2022 20:53

TheKeatingFive · 11/12/2022 16:34

Is Holis starting to remind anyone of a certain poster?

I'll take zoom christmas for 500 points.

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 21:05

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 20:43

So you would like me to show you examples of places that a single person earning over the average could afford to live in in Oxford?
Ok.

www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/128610140#/?channel=RES_NEW

Yes indeed, I think the fact that you've had to resort to shared ownership options with no information about leasehold length and only estimates on some other costs illustrates my point rather well. Thanks!

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 21:08

Contradictory info sorry, not no info. Two different statements. Also we presumably don't imagine that anyone earning over the median FT salary in Oxford will be able to get a mortgage and pay a deposit?

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 21:08

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 21:05

Yes indeed, I think the fact that you've had to resort to shared ownership options with no information about leasehold length and only estimates on some other costs illustrates my point rather well. Thanks!

Is it housing?
Is it in Oxford?
Is it affordable to someone on an average income?

What point were you trying to make?

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 21:13

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 21:08

Contradictory info sorry, not no info. Two different statements. Also we presumably don't imagine that anyone earning over the median FT salary in Oxford will be able to get a mortgage and pay a deposit?

You would like examples of affordable rental properties as well?

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 21:16

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 21:08

Is it housing?
Is it in Oxford?
Is it affordable to someone on an average income?

What point were you trying to make?

Yes, yes and not necessarily because you've made an assumption that the single person is able to purchase. That they have a deposit and can get a mortgage. That's rather silly.

The point, not a complex one, is that it is possible to be unable to afford housing in Oxford even on an above average wage. You'd have to do much more than provide an example of three shared ownership flats with incomplete particulars available to purchase to refute that, especially as there are issues here of supply as well as cost.

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 21:23

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 21:13

You would like examples of affordable rental properties as well?

You can make that part of your explanation as to how the number of people earning more than median wage wanting housing in Oxford is sufficiently catered for by the affordable supply if you consider it would assist your case, yes.

Be sure to factor in dependents too: after all, we never said the above median earners were childfree.

jgw1 · 12/12/2022 21:23

SirMingeALot · 12/12/2022 21:16

Yes, yes and not necessarily because you've made an assumption that the single person is able to purchase. That they have a deposit and can get a mortgage. That's rather silly.

The point, not a complex one, is that it is possible to be unable to afford housing in Oxford even on an above average wage. You'd have to do much more than provide an example of three shared ownership flats with incomplete particulars available to purchase to refute that, especially as there are issues here of supply as well as cost.

Ah, so you would like examples of rental properties.

Would in your view a rent of 20% or less of annual income be affordable?

TizerorFizz · 12/12/2022 22:48

@jgw1
Your first house was going to auction. Try and accept there isn’t cheap housing in Oxford.

TizerorFizz · 12/12/2022 22:55

2 x salaries at £35,000 could buy in Bicester. Then there’s travel costs. Oxford has always been expensive. That’s why people are forced out to the new estates in what were villages.

jgw1 · 13/12/2022 06:45

TizerorFizz · 12/12/2022 22:55

2 x salaries at £35,000 could buy in Bicester. Then there’s travel costs. Oxford has always been expensive. That’s why people are forced out to the new estates in what were villages.

Do you mean a property something like this?

www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/126016937#/?channel=RES_BUY

Devoutspoken · 13/12/2022 08:25

But it's also true to say that some people will be able to cycle

RoseAndGeranium · 13/12/2022 09:29

jgw1 · 13/12/2022 06:45

Do you mean a property something like this?

www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/126016937#/?channel=RES_BUY

What point are you trying to make? That there are affordable properties for sale in villages (like Bicester) outside Oxford? Yes. We know. But transport costs from those villages are high, and transport options are often inadequate or non-existent. Even assuming all those who currently commute by car from villages where there is inadequate public transport would currently be willing and able to afford to move to Oxford itself or villages with better transport links, what do you think would happen to house prices in those moved-to areas? Do you really believe there would be enough housing for all those people? Or that it wouldn’t result in displacement of the poorer tenants in deprived areas like Rose Hill? Where should they go? This is the problem with ideologically driven politics. You ignore all the knock on effects on people, many of whom are vulnerable.

Devoutspoken · 13/12/2022 09:45

There are also knock on effects for vulnerable people the way things are now

jgw1 · 13/12/2022 09:46

Devoutspoken · 13/12/2022 09:45

There are also knock on effects for vulnerable people the way things are now

But the car is king, and those who use them are much more important than those who are threatened by the dangers that cars bring.

Florenz · 13/12/2022 11:18

If everyone stopped using cars even for a day, the country would grind to a halt.

jgw1 · 13/12/2022 11:52

Florenz · 13/12/2022 11:18

If everyone stopped using cars even for a day, the country would grind to a halt.

Surely without cars on the roads it would be rather easier to get around, in fact quite the opposite from grinding to a halt?