Strep A - are you worried?

[lucylollipop]

Apologies if there are already threads on this. I haven't seen any yet.

News in today that a 9th child has sadly died from strep a. I have primary school age dc and a young baby so I'm worried about them getting sick and also bringing bugs home to the rest of us.

I'm not clued up enough to know if this is comparable to flu deaths in kids? I suppose I just wondered if others are worried? Given the state on the NHS at the moment it isn't a great time to get unwell.

Yes I am worried. Having real anxiety about it actually

I'm worried about how hard you have to push to get your child seen. My son has symptoms and at first the receptionist did was ask me if I'd done a covid test and 'to think of the other patients in the surgery', I told her I wasn't going to traumatise my very poorly little boy again and I couldn't care less about covid given he's 4 and could potentially have strep A. They then text me an appointment with a clinical practitioner so I had to argue with them again 'oh don't worry, she's well qualified, nearly a doctor' err no thanks I'd like an actual doctor!
We did see a doctor we know in the end who was fantastic, tested for Strep A, prescribed the antibiotics immediately without hesitation and sent me some useful information.

@prescribingmum when the government was willing it still took months, children are not of value in this country so there’s no way a response like that would be pulled together in time, the threat will be passed and over by then. I completely understand re antibiotic resistance. And understand it fully. But it is a huge picture huge problem. This is a relatively small, time critical problem in the here and now and sometimes you need to go off the bigger picture plan and deal with a clear and present danger that will be over by the spring. No one’s talking about to is as a long term strategy it’s to deal with hear and now.

All very nice to be pious but, try that with parents of dead children and see how you get on👍.

Well, ministers are suggesting children without even colds get them

This is complete nonsense. Bacteria develop antibiotic resistance, not people.

So the good bacteria in our bodies that we've just killed off does absolutely nothing for our immune system?

I know @Cuppasoupmonster thats why we are where are!

Strep A can cause those and strep throat yes and then further develop into invasive strep A or can skip the others and become invasive strep A if it gets into the blood stream.

The problem is symptoms are very similar to a wide variety of viruses as well hence its difficult for parents to know. Scarlet fever can be obvious but other symptoms such as vomiting fever etc csn be generic.

The bacteria is spread several ways its on people's skin anyway but also via coughs/sneezes contaminated surfaces.

The best thing to do is be aware of the symptoms and keep speaking to nursery/schools its a reportable illness which helps. Seek medical advice if your child comes down with the symptoms as the quicker antibiotics are given the better for it if it's strep A.

Good news is it can be swabbed for as well.

"The surfaces of the body – the skin, digestive system, and the lining of the nose – are covered by a community of microbes called the normal body flora. They help protect the host from becoming infected with more harmful micro-organisms by acting as a physical barrier. The normal body flora colonises these linings which reduces the area available for pathogens to attach to and become established. It also means that the harmful microbes have to compete with the normal body flora for nutrients. The average human gut contains around one kilo of these good bacteria which is equivalent to one bag of sugar."

microbiologysociety.org/why-microbiology-matters/what-is-microbiology/microbes-and-the-human-body/immune-system.html

But you know, let's kill off our kids' good flora with antibiotics just because some other kid in the class has a sore throat.

I had huge issues getting my child seen recently. Only saw the nurse 1st visit told viral, 2nd visit we were given anti Biotics. At both appt never looked at throat and couldn't test o2 levels as couldn't find the paediatric monitor despite this being one of my concerns.
As with children things can go either way and my child bounced back quickly from being very lethargic and a big concern to us at the time.
The issue is child wasn't really checked sufficiently and yet we took up the surgery time. If he had not improved / worsened, would we have got further help in time.

A child the same age here has died but isn't yet counted in the reported numbers.

All the talk of antibiotic resistance is a misdinoma in this case. A single course of antibiotics is not going to result in antibiotic resistance. Dr's have been told rather then look for 4 markers for tonsillitis for example as they would prior to prescribing antibiotics to relax this because of high circulation of Strep A.

That doesn't mean they are going to keep being relaxed about it its for this particular issue because of the higher rates.

Also giving your kids a prebiotic alongside antibiotics and afterwards will help with getting the body back to normal quicker

Both dds have had a temperature, sore throat and a headache on and my off for weeks.

Is there definitely always a rash?

Much has been said already but I will add that yes I am worried too and I am not one who rushes to the doctor first thing with a kid’s runny nose. Two things to consider here: 1. The general health approach from
GPs has been for my kids over the last 7 years to dismiss almost anything as viral without testing or otherwise investigating. Resulting in me feeling like a fraud most of the times to even think about seeking help, and I’m sure I’m not the only one. We’ve been told so many times it’s nothing and by consequence we’re clogging the precious appointment system when what we should do is go home with Calpol or a cup of tea, that I don’t think I’m the only one feeling it’s not even worth trying and it will all sort itself out. Until it doesn’t! But then it’s too late! 2. In other countries in Europe, strep tests are absolute standard to attend school and nursery. No test, no admission and they are repeated at least twice a year. So is a doctor’s note after each long holiday that the child has been examined and they are fit to attend school. They test not only for strep but also for common parasites etc - anything that can be easily transmitted within a close community or children.

So the only thing that surprises me is that it hasn’t happened sooner, along with other infectious outbreaks. Adding to this that any memory of public hygiene/infection prevention is quickly disappearing, I’m afraid this story will only escalate! Very sorry for all those experiencing any of it…

Our friends' DD (2.5) has been in hospital with it for 2 weeks. Stabilising now but was touch and go in ICU for a few days. Very scary.

People of colour please be aware the red rash wont be apparant on our skin,it will be more of a change of skin texture like a sandpaper feel,so if your child has symptons look for this rather than the red rash.Hope this helps.

No there's not always a rash.
Look at their throats and Google strep A throat if they have sore throats it can be quite obvious.
If unsure and they are still unwell contact your GP.

I think one of the issues is not knowing what's viral and what isn't. My eldest DD has had a sore throat/headache for a week, it comes and goes, she has shared it with me too. Neither of us have had a fever, i imagine it's viral. But the point of my post is that it's worrying because it is hard to know when to worry, especially as it appears to progress so fast.
My youngest hasn't had the virus we have yet, but there are cases of scarlett fever in her school and she catches everything! So I am worried, but just trying to prepare to watch out for concerning signs and deal with as necessary.

I don't think media scaremongering helps, at all. But then they had a field day with covid so nothing surprises me there anymore.

Big hugs to everyone who is worried.

If you think giving a course of antibiotics blind to all children with sore throats to then go and stop them when getting a negative test is the solution you don’t ‘completely understand antibiotic resistance’. You don’t even understand the basics

Wildly giving out antibiotics to all is replacing the infection issue with a resistance problem. You didn’t answer my question as to what we will do once resistance develops to step a (which it will do very quickly if we used your suggestion)

No I'm not worried. I'll keep an eye out for any symptoms and if my children have any I'll contact the GP Surgery and see what they say. My Eldest had SF 8 years ago.
There really isn't any reason to panic but as we know the media love a health scare since Covid19. M-Pox anyone? Which by the way is still spreading but the media lost interest.

My youngest DC has suddenly developed a spotty rash on their cheeks. Otherwise fine aside from the lingering croup cough and being a bit more grumpy than your average toddler. The rash looks quite sore and is raised but not rough. Slap cheek crossed my mind but again, there's no fever. Is it worth a GP call? Hate to waste their time but it would take a few days usually to be seen (telephone calls etc first)

When dS had scarlet fever the rash spread over a few days. The trunk would be the other main place the rash would start. Have you checked their throat and mouth and tongue for other symptoms of strep?

Not worried. There are plenty of other causes which are much more likely to kill a young child (step-parent, cars etc.) which we're not seeing concern for. This is a nasty bug, but the numbers of children being impacted by this are tiny in the grand scheme of things.

One of my DC has had several hospital stays linked to infections, chest infections etc. and I know how scary that is as a parent, but most parents' children won't be affected by this.

No I'm not worried; my 4 year old DD has just had scarlet fever and is fine, without antibiotic treatment.

She had a bad sore throat 3 weeks ago for 3 days, looked like tonsillitis with white spots, developed a high fever of over 39 that lasted 24 hours and then the rash started, it was only slightly pink for the first day (see photo) but lasted about 10 days covering her entire trunk before spreading to upper arms and thighs, no mistaking the sandpaper feel though. On and off red cheeks, but no rash on the face. As the rash went she had some random vomiting and developed a bit of a strawberry tongue. Due to the coverage in the media I took her to GP yesterday to be on the safe side and yes it was scarlet fever, no she doesn't need antibiotics at this stage.

I'd say most of her class have had it, or have it and I told her school yesterday and I got the impression no one else had made the connection either - so lots of little ones poorly but certainly none drastically ill.

Just to add for other readers, if you have scarlet fever, antibiotics are prescribed as a precaution to reduce the rare risk of long term complications so you should seek antibiotics even if your child isn’t unwell with the scarlet fever
@spydie it was probably too late for the antibiotics to have any benefit when you went to the gp.

Antibiotics may disrupt gut flora, of course that's true, and there can be increased risk of mouth and vaginal fungal infection as an immediate consequence, but I don't think there's any evidence that this has any impact on the ability of the immune system to deal with future infections per se.

No I’m not particularly worried. We lived in the US when my eldest was small where they routinely swab for strep rather than generically saying tonsillitis like the UK usually do. DD had strep throat as a toddler and so did just about every other child I know. According to the CDC a normal level of cases in the US is: 3 in 10 kids with a sore throat have strep throat and 1 in 10 adults. Horrible and tragic severe cases aside, it is a very common infection. The symptoms are distinct from a cold and do not involve a cough, runny nose or conjunctivitis (toddler DS has all of those right now!) so based solely on my experience with DD it’s easy to spot. I would be concerned if I was reliant on the NHS GP but we gave up on that a long time ago and now exclusively use a lovely private GP. The talk of a penicillin shortage is more concerning but we live in central London so lots of pharmacy options nearby and would hope we’d find somewhere where it’s in stock eventually.