to get hacked off at journalists moaning about how oh so hard it is to afford school fees

[emkana]

like in the Daily Telegraph for example today

www.telegraph.co.uk/education/main.jhtml;jsessionid=AFH51SI3AUOK5QFIQMFSFGGAVCBQ0IV0?xml=/education/ 2008/01/30/faclass130.xml&page=2

Ahhh yes...we're back to lying again....

I read that article with interest Xenia, and pertinent to this discussion not only have I spectacularly underachieved by many people's standards (and partly my own) but my education was probably a total waste of money because it was never backed up with support to organise and discipline myself. My parents did lead by example in this respect but as the youngest of six at the time, and the 'gifted' one, my messy room and hopeless disorganisation was affectionately tolerated as a sort of 'mad scientist syndrome'.

I WANT THOSE REFERENCES

DH can't work Xenia because he is a full time carer to me and our brain damaged one. He has a PhD and had a great job with BAE systems as a scientist.
No getting on of one's bike when life has dealt one a shitty hand.

who can afford extra-curricular actvities?

Hmm, interesting Xenia. Dh is the highest biller/top performer at work and he's the only one there without a degree (his company actually require a degree for his job but his 'gift of the gab' got him in).

I repeat - there is no reason why I would pay for private education because there is no need NOT because I can't afford to.

Absolutely, hard work is key to success in life.

We were having this discussion with my stepsons last night over dinner, as we want to send them to Millfield this summer on an English-as-a-foreign-language course.

My elder stepson (12) completely understands that he is going to have to work hard to have a nice life (and he does work hard - really hard), and he completely understands that when we offer him opportunities to go on courses etc in the holidays we are doing him a favour, not punishing him.

The younger one (10), however, hasn't got there yet... he doesn't understand why life (outside school) just can't be all play..

hard work?

you mean you don't just Pay The Cheque for Poshe Schoole and automatically get an account at Coutts??

That 50% may well be true, earlier Xenia suggested that all parents would prefer private schools if they could choose.

I am not criticising anyone else's school choices (or I wouldn't have many friends left) but I do actually strongly believe that a non-selective non-religious bog standard comp education can be one of the best sorts of education around, even for bright children. That was my experience (Comprehensive - Oxford - Phd. etc) and that of many of my friends, and I see it with teenagers I know now as well.

hard work...oh that's where I've been going wrong all these years. Sitting on my backside doing nothing when I should have been out there working. Doh!

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If I go chucking around stats like that I have to reference them.

Coutts - the bank that likes to say yah.

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Quite a few different themes on here now.
Today's Times article was about child geniuses, not the average bright child at state or private grammar type school so in practice irrelevant to most of us but someone has been charting exceptionally bright ones, The Ruth Lawrences of this world ect since the 1940s. They seem to be told those who don't go on to do that well that they are very bright so they do the bare minimum and then they find in real life that's not enough, whereas if like Vanessa Mae you're a genius at the violin PLUS you do 4 hours practice a day and are reasonably sorted mentally then you can do really well.

If you have a fairly clever child below that level most parents want them to go to a good school. In most urban centres at least you need to pay to get the best school and overall children in private schools do do pretty well. I certainly don't mind that I've been paying fees now for nearly 20 years. It's been money well spent.

(needmore, a very nasty hand, certainly - could he write a book from home or do consulting at the PC or that kind of thing? I used to mark exam papers and did that from home too)

snort @ swedes

wish he could Xenia but dd requires 24 hour care. (he has written a sci-fi novel but no publisher yet and he gets short stories publised and we earn 20 quid a pop. Terrible money unless you're Stephen King)
We have 4 very bright children (which is why I home educated) but I'm hoping their start in life isn't blighted cos we are on benefits (which is all dd2's fault). Working hard means bugger all when something terrible happens.

"I've stopped reading newspapers altogether. They make you want to vomit."

with you Tech. If i read the papers too often, i have to go on a "media diet" just to calm down for a while.

WHAT fanjo thread, WHERE???

That certainly doesn't sound easy, nm but for a lot of people they don't have that situation, worked hard got a lot put in the bank and if disaster strikes they have it to fall back on or inherited wealth if you manage to perpetuate wealth down the generations including by sending them to private schools etc... a lot of people are getting money via their parents these days too.

"They moved to the North-East in 1991 and bought a traditional Cumbrian longhouse, along with 50 acres of land and, after assembling a collection of rare and interesting animals, ran a successful children's petting farm."

I'm sorry - but when has Cumbria been in the North East??!

Branflake - Well spotted. The journo should have known it's in East Angular.

Perhaps they forgot they turned left at Scotch Corner?

Also that twonk man. There's no way he's in the Tourist Indsutry - he's an estate agent. He's shown me round every other house I've ever looked at.

Let me just reiterate once more:

I (and many mumsnetters) have no objection to other people having done well in life and choosing to spend their money on their children's education. We just find it hard to feel sorry for the financial struggles of people who are clearly, by our standards, rather well off. That is why we take objection to the very common article in the national press, which is all about inviting you to commiserate with people who seem remarkably well off. Personally, I am not asking anyone to feel sorry for me either: I enjoy life and don't equate money with success, so clearly I do not deserve any pity on that score. But I do know many hardworking people who through no fault of their own are struggling with everyday necessaries, and it's to them my sympathy would go. A lot of these people do jobs that our lives depend on, but which happen to be badly paid, so I would feel very uncomfortable about suggesting that it's their own fault for not getting a better job.

The suggestion that a 7yo with a reading age of 12 can only thrive with special schooling is plainly ridiculous. There is nothing that unusual about having a reading age of 12- I had that in two languages by that age and was teaching myself a third language at home. I would never have thought that entitled me to behave badly at school.

My dd also has a very advanced reading age (was reading Lord of the Rings at age 6), but I never doubted that I could teach her to behave. You don't have to behave badly just because you're bored. Also, if you have interesting things to do out of school, you will be less bored and a little adapting to other people's needs during school hours is unlikely to do you much harm.

Obviously, there are very gifted children who also have behavioural problems, but I think it is totally wrong to expect behavioural problems just because your child is gifted. Heaven knows there are enough untalented children with behavioural problems. And plenty of gifted children who also have the gift of understanding the needs of others, the significance of rules and the importance of tolerance. Academically doesn't have to spell emotionally immature.

Most bright children do better in academic state or private schools and most of the country doesn't have state grammars therefore this mother is doing what is best for her child and those who could but choose not to pay aren't (if they have a similar child who would thrive educated amongst other clever children).

A starving Ethiopian would laugh at anyone on state benefits in the UK suggesting anyone should feel sorry for them. It's all relative.